Bulking Diet

[Shak]

Hi Everyone -

I'm finding lots of information on how to eat to LOSE weight and there is tons of info from the guys on the diet board on bulking diets, but I'm not finding a whole lot of info on bulking diets for women. I obviously don't need 500g of protein and 4000 calories a day like some of the men!

I'm going to be training really hard over the next 6 months, but I want to make sure I'm eating right too.

Does anyone have a good bulking diet they can post with pre and post workout meals/shakes?

Thanks!

 

[valerie]

I don't have a bulking diet, but would offer the suggestion that now is a good time to up your clean complex carbs, protein does not need to as high as when cutting. At least one gram per lb of lbm would be a minimum. By slowly adding the complex carbs you should find the right amount without adding extra fat.

 

[Shak]

thanks val -

i have a very balanced diet. the only time i restrict my calories is when i'm cutting. i rarely eat simple carbs and my complex carbs consist of fiber cereal for breakfast and a whole wheat pita for lunch. i don't usually have a lot of carbs with dinner, unless i'm making burgers or sandwiches. the rest of my carbs come from veges & fruits & yogurt. I basically just try to eat healthy.

I assumed my protein would be higher than when cutting since i'm not restricting calories and I need the protein to build muscle.

I think my main concerns are what to eat pre and post workout.

 

[valerie]

You are not eating enough complex carbs. You can not get enough from veggies and yogurt. Yogurt has simple sugars as is the sugar in fruit....

Put simply complex carbs is what fuels your muscles. You will need less protein because complex carbs are protein sparing and you do not need to use it for energy, unlike when dieting. A
minimum would be one gram per lb of lbm, this is the least amount. you could go to 1.5 grams per lb of lbm. What is nice about that is you save money and actually make the gains you want and increase your strength as well.

You will find it very difficult to make lbm gains on the amount of complex carbs you are using now. I would add in more starchy carbs, especially on days you are lifting. Sweet potaotes, reg potatoes, rice, etc.

For both pre and post w/o you want carbs and protein.

 

[Shak]

thanks val -

i knew i needed to add more carbs - i was looking forward to it.
love those sweet potatoes!

on the diet board there is so much talk about adding dextrose to protein shakes. i suppose i could buy some dextrose, but i would rather eat those carbs instead. what are your thoughts on this?

 

[dzulboy]

um i would use the 40 30 30 routine for female bulking 40% carbs 30% protein and fat .9 grams of protein per lb is the minimum for "active" persons. so if you are say 130 you should be consuming 117 grams of protein 117 grams of fat (i know sounds high but it better to bulk this way for a woman keeps fat deposits down IMO) and 156 grams of carbs coming out to 2145 calories now i am not saying you should live by that diet but it works well hope i helped

 

[dzulboy]

um i would use the 40 30 30 routine for female bulking 40% carbs 30% protein and fat .9 grams of protein per lb is the minimum for "active" persons. so if you are say 130 you should be consuming 117 grams of protein 117 grams of fat (i know sounds high but it better to bulk this way for a woman keeps fat deposits down IMO) and 156 grams of carbs coming out to 2145 calories now i am not saying you should live by that diet but it works well hope i helped oh and 3 grams of water for every i gram of carbs you eat at least

 

[valerie]

Shak-- yes go with the whole foods. It really isnt necessary to jack up insulin. Best to keep with the low glycemic carbs, the ones with fiber. The health benefits of insulin sensitivity are important. You certainly could still have high glycemic foods, just would not overdo them. If I eat much of them, its the day prior to lifting. The idea is to gain lbm and keep fat to minimum. I would keep my fat % of diet closer to 20%. Its so easy for the body to convert dietary fat to stored fat. Personally the fats I add in are the essential fatty acids, flaxseed oil, fish oil etc. I do eat lean meats so that fat is pretty minimal. You can play around with %s. Good luck--valerie

 

[woof]

I am not sure what kind of workouts that you will be doing, but POST workout (30-60min) your body will readily replenish its glycogen stores with a 50% dextrose/ 50% whey protein shake - you do not have to worry about your body storing this as fat! If you are doing a longer endurance type workout like a long distance run (1+hr) or bike ride (2hr+) then you might even consider a 4:1 ratio of carbs:whey protein.

You can also use maltodextrin, which is sold at beer brewing stores, instead of dextrose.

The reason to use dextrose/maltodextrin is because it will be absorbed the QUICKEST. This might be important if you are going to work out again later in the day. If not, there is no reason why you could not have:
1) a banana and a pro shake
2) milk and higher pro cereal
3) flavored yogurt w/ pro powder mixed in
etc
Point being => simple carbs are not only OK, but preferred after an intense workout.

 

[valerie]

I would'nt look to the fructose and lactose to replace glycogen stores, fructose has been shown to preferentially refill liver stores. Sometimes its seems like we forget that the body has plenty of sense and ability to maintain its balance with out us adding in lots of "stuff". After a w/o the muscles will be sensitve to insulin regardless of quickness. My suggs are to keep things simple yet effective. Since you will be eating more complex carbs anyhow you can just make sure have a good meal an hour or two after your postwork out protein drink.

You could also try the malto/dex carbs for a while and see how that works. I would suggest you do a search for MS's comments on this.

BTW I am a supp retailer and do sell carb powders-----don't use them though.

 

[lil k]

i just got done bulking, basically i followed a place of 50/30/20 (protein, carbs, fat)

i took in about 200+ grams of protein a day, all my fats came from udos oil, nuts, pb etc. and the carbs were mostly wild rice, brown basmatti rice, yams, veggies etc. post workout i took in about 40grams whey, 50 grams carbs from dextrose, and some l-glut and 5 grams creatine.

i ate real real clean, i just ate a lot more.

 

[JJFigure]

What kind of results did you get, lil k?

 

[Deleted member 33117]

Those who are advocating 20% fat calories should bear in mind that it is much more difficult to gain muscle mass on a low fat diet, and the gains come much slower. In terms of staying lean, bear in mind that when overeating (which one needs to do in moderation for efficent gains) additonal carb calories ARE more likely to cause a gain in bodyfat than fat calories. I would advocate something closer to a 40/30/30 p/c/f split.

valerie, I would agree with you on the fructose issue 100%, however not on the lactose. If one can tolerate dairy products, they are extremely anabolic, and tend to reduce gains in bodyfat when overeating. They have been proven to increase insulin senstivity, which will not only yeild faster gains in lbm, but will also reduce gains in bodyfat. Nutritionist have also noticed, and they suspect it involved the high amounts of asborbable calcium present in them, that a moderate to high intake of dairy products seems to reduce the ability of fat cells to take in nutrients. This effect appears to be more prounced in women than in men. My advice is for her to eat a considerable amount of dairy, if she isn't lactose intolerant.

Do not forget the importance of SATURATED (owww scary stuff) fat as well as a high intake of omega 3's when seeking optimal gains in muscle mass. Do not go lightly on the leafy green vegetables either. 4 or 5 salids a day, should be the minimum when bulking.

Shak, if you have any specific questions, I'll be more than happy to answer them. I really didn't give enough information in this post.

 

[lil k]

What kind of results did you get, lil k?

i did very well actually...gained about 20lbs over the 3 months.....i put on a lot of lean muscle and added fat of course....my bra size went up because my lats grew like crazy....i think that my genetics are as such that i grow almost too fast to my liking....i am 4'11 and am 121 now (but was 126 at end), i am cutting now and will be for a while...i added size to my traps, delts, lats, and triceps the most....now that i am leaning down i can see a horseshoe which was never that noticeable before....

the fat that i did gain is coming off fast now, but i am cutting pretty hard......nice to have some good size out of it, it was the first time i ever "bulked" per se, and i am not sure i will do it again cause i don't like feeling chubby hehe....but all in all i put on at least 7-10lbs of lean muscle and that was well worth it by far!

oh one last point, i took about 4-5 tablespoons of udos ed, for the majority of my fat....

 

[Shak]

thanks to all of you for your awesome responses.

i'd like to gain at least 7-10 lbs of lbm over the next 6 months. i was able to put on some size last winter, went on a very effective cutting diet this past spring, and then enjoyed my summer...(took the past two months off and enjoyed outdoor activities).


body - i'm not lactose intolerant. i handle dairy very well. how much dairy would you suggest i have daily? i prefer my protein shakes mixed with milk rather than water. in terms of saturated fats, do you suggest i get these mostly from meat? i'm insanely anal whenever i prepare meat (cutting every little bit of fat off that i see). should i stop this? it will be hard for me...it's so gross.

i can buy dextrose to mix with my post-workout shakes, but i thought having a protein shake with some sort of food would be easier.

lil k - what exercises do you attribute to your rapid lat development? i wish i had your genetics!

thanks val for all the advice!!

 

[Deleted member 33117]

thanks to all of you for your awesome responses.

i'd like to gain at least 7-10 lbs of lbm over the next 6 months. i was able to put on some size last winter, went on a very effective cutting diet this past spring, and then enjoyed my summer...(took the past two months off and enjoyed outdoor activities).


body - i'm not lactose intolerant. i handle dairy very well. how much dairy would you suggest i have daily? i prefer my protein shakes mixed with milk rather than water. in terms of saturated fats, do you suggest i get these mostly from meat? i'm insanely anal whenever i prepare meat (cutting every little bit of fat off that i see). should i stop this? it will be hard for me...it's so gross.

i can buy dextrose to mix with my post-workout shakes, but i thought having a protein shake with some sort of food would be easier.

lil k - what exercises do you attribute to your rapid lat development? i wish i had your genetics!

thanks val for all the advice!!

Avoid fat free dairy products, and eat a steak every day. That should handle your saturated fat needs. Alot of people act like saturated fat and cholesterol are going to kill them. They are necissary to not only sustain human life, but one needs a considerable amount of them to keep the release of several anabolic hormones at a high level. The human body has not only evolved to handle them, but to acutually need them. The reason they become harmful, is because people today often do not eat the foods that we evolved to eat with them (green vegetables and sources with efa's), and by eating foods that we should not be eating (massive amounts of carbohydrates, high GI carbs, processed sugars, hydrogenated oils) that elevate insulin levels beyond the normal and healthy range. If one keeps their insulin levels in check, and eats enough omega 3 fatty acids, and other efa's, they will not have a negative impact on most people's cholesterol levels or body fat.

The studies showing the most postive results in women were the one's in which they consumed 3 to 4 servings of dairy every day.

Good luck in gaining 10 ibs of muscle. You'll get alot of help and advice here to make your task easier.

 

[lil k]

lil k - what exercises do you attribute to your rapid lat development? i wish i had your genetics!

lol, my husband hates my genetics, hahahaha...i think it has a lot to do with my height..

as for my back, i think the big thing is wide grip pullups and heavy lat pulldowns...those two things really seemed to make my lats explode...of course dead lifts, and i also do a lot of bent over barbell rows, seated cable rows and one arm dumbell rows...a new thing that my hubby does and i started i really love as well...after doing everything i end back day with one arm rows on a cable machine...i sit on the floor, put the cable on the lowest setting and do one arm rows that way...i get a great stretch and a wonderful pump!

 

[Shak]

....and eat a steak every day.


i'm going to be broke...


wide grip pullups have been a goal of mine for awhile. for now, all i can do is hang from the bar...woohoo....but, i'm determine to be able to do some by the end of the winter!

 

[lil k]

wide grip pullups have been a goal of mine for awhile. for now, all i can do is hang from the bar...woohoo....but, i'm determine to be able to do some by the end of the winter!

do you have a machine at your gym that can assist you? that is how i got started doing them, then just kept working my way up....

 

[Shak]

i do have that graviton (i think that's what it's called) machine - i've been planning on using that. it's good to hear you got results from that -

 

[woof]

You can also use a spotter to assist you w/ pull-ups: bend your knees and have someone support you under your shins. Then you can push off their hands just enough to help you complete a rep. Do the negative part w/o their help.

Keep trying - it will not be long before you can do these on your own!

 

[Shak]

thanks woof!

 

[Deleted member 33117]

You can also use a spotter to assist you w/ pull-ups: bend your knees and have someone support you under your shins. Then you can push off their hands just enough to help you complete a rep. Do the negative part w/o their help.

Keep trying - it will not be long before you can do these on your own!

I love spotting girls on their pullups. Some of them don't like my technec, but I keep trying to tell them that you get the best stability and weight distribution if the spotter places one hand under each glute.