Box Squat Note

[GRIMMER]

Hey Fellas i just wanted to throw this in because i thought it was important. I trian by myself for the most part and don't have anybody to look at my form very often. Although i have been doing these for a year or so i still find that i don't always do them with perfect form. I have found from my experience and from watching others that one of the most common mistakes is not arching the back hard enough.
Today in the gym i was trying to coach myself to get back into the best form possible and the only thing that i find is that i have little or no arch in my back. today i worked on it and found that it is so much easier and effective to sit back to where you put all the emphasis on your glutes and hams when you have a hard arch. After all , one of the main reasons to do the box squat is to work these muscles and to sit back.
the reason that i don't all the time is because i don't feel as tight when i do it although i do sit back.

I just wanted to throw this out there for those of you who train by yourself and don't have someone to watch you. Remember to arch hard and sit back and the movement will become much more effective.

Just as a side note , I find that when you have a partner that can tell you to , sit back , push your knees out , arch your back , spread the floor , ECT. that they are invaluable to training properly. Try to tell yurself one or two things right before you lift to focus on and it can help you right away. Today i said to myself "arch your back!!!" before every lift.

Later

 

[Hannibal]

I just wanted to throw this out there for those of you who train by yourself and don't have someone to watch you. Remember to arch hard and sit back and the movement will become much more effective.

Just as a side note , I find that when you have a partner that can tell you to , sit back , push your knees out , arch your back , spread the floor , ECT. that they are invaluable to training properly. Try to tell yurself one or two things right before you lift to focus on and it can help you right away. Today i said to myself "arch your back!!!" before every lift.

Later

The hardest person to train is yourself. Having a second or third set of eyes in training is invaluable. My problem also is not arching hard enough. I am working on it. A mistake that I am working on getting out of is losing my air on the box. Instead of stayin tight....if I dont actively concentrate on it I will lose my air and that makes me lose my arch and drop my chest.

Thats the great thing about box squats however. The number of first reps. It is a great teacher....just easier if you have someone there to remind you. That way you can just move the weight.

Arch your back till it starts to cramp...thats a good arch

 

[GRIMMER]

I know what you mean when you lose yourr air. Around the 6th or 7th set i am usually huffing and puffing pretty good so trying to hold that air in for any longer than a breath is tough.

 

[Hannibal]

Start dragging the sled and endurance wont be a problem. Mine is not a question of fatigue...when I am in shape my heart rate never gets out of hand even when doing box squats. Mine is just a technique problem that I WILL FIX!!!

 

[GRIMMER]

do you drag instead of your max day or after it or what.

 

[Screwball]

Box Squatting...

Excellent post, Grimmer! I could not agree with you more about arching the back as hard as possible and sitting back when box squatting. This post is a great reminder for all of us to really focus on technique. It's much too easy to go to the gym and "go through the motions" without focusing on the real goals - increasing strength & perfecting technique.

I also try to break down each lift into steps and visualize in my head how the lift is going to be performed. When I perform the lift I run through the steps in my mind as I actually perform the lift. Focus on a few basic lift performance steps (i.e. squatting - set the weight, strong arch, big air, sit back, get to depth, explode out of the hole, head & shoulders lead, knees out, break the bar, hips forward, set the weight). Now, this is quite a few steps and each will have their own personal weaknesses and these personal weaknesses should be the focus for each respective lifter. The key to this technique is to use it each and every time you perform the lift. It is similar to a golfers or baseball players pre-swing routine. If you use the technique when performing warm-up sets then it will become second nature. This becomes important when using maximal weights because the mind tends to become focused on only functioning with the central nervous system to fire muscle fiber maximally. This is why many lifters describe maximal lifts as mind-clearing. You don't know what the hell was going through your mind; the only thing that mattered was lifting that damn steel. I know personally that when I have thoughts running through my mind as I lift, (i.e. Do I need to get a bigger singlet? This one sure is tight. - Dumb, shit like that.) I never have my best attempts.

Grimmer, great start to a thread that everyone can benefit from.

 

[Hannibal]

do you drag instead of your max day or after it or what.

4 to 6 hours after you lift is best. Check out Spatterson's post about her New Split....I wrote it for her..and the prescribed dragging for active recovery is listed there.

It makes a WORLD of difference...

An article by someone that knows alot more about it than me...

http://www.testosterone.net/html/body_146gpp.html

 

[Deciever]

just a quick question on the box squat.. i know your supposed to sit down on the box and relax your muscles, but how long are you supposed to pause?

 

[GRIMMER]

Just long enough to relax the muscles and then back up

 

[Deciever]

alright... the one guy who was mentioned in my "westside....a gimmick thread" was trying to explain to me that i shouldnt' pause because it places a large amount of stress souly on the back, which isnt good and cause problems.. so he was telling me that i should just tap it and then go back up... any opinions on his theory?

 

[Hannibal]

Just long enough to relax the muscles and then back up

Just long enough to relax the HIP FLEXORS...everything else is held TIGHT!!!

The pause on the box is crucial as it breaks up the concentric eccentric chain. Makes this work...static overcome by dynamic...very effective.

 

[GRIMMER]

Hannibal is correct , i should have elaborated a bit.

 

[Hannibal]

Better safe than sorry....some people dont read the articles, and only go by what is said here.

 

[Deciever]

thanks hannibal for the clearup(i was pretty sure it was just the hip flexors anyway).. if tried to relax all my muscles, i'd most likely end up as a smushed little boy trapped under a lot of weight, becuase i relaxed all my muscles...

 

[Cubanito17]

WHOA WHOA WHOA on box squats your suppose to pause on the box. Isn't this dangerous I know with the weight on your back if you pause on the box you can really fuck up your back. I've been doin my box squats low enough so when I touch the box I pop back up. One question then if your suppose to pause then how can you keep your 8X2 under 4.5 seconds if your doin them on DE SQ/DL day????

 

[spatts]

I may be way off base here, but it seems to me that if you've mastered your form, then relaxing and recontracting the hip flexors shouldn't take more than a split second. If you're taking the time to sit back and relax, you're probably losing your arch and lifting with your quads instead.


What do I know...I'm the new girl.

 

[Deciever]

spatterson actually what you say makes sense.. i'll do a little experiment with like just the bar to see how long it takes me to release the tension

 

[Hannibal]

I may be way off base here, but it seems to me that if you've mastered your form, then relaxing and recontracting the hip flexors shouldn't take more than a split second. If you're taking the time to sit back and relax, you're probably losing your arch and lifting with your quads instead.

What do I know...I'm the new girl.

Don't even...you know some stuff. I am amazed at how quickly you have picked this up. Sometimes, as it has already been said, women are much easier to train as they are more receptive.

Pausing on the box does not fuck up your back. How many back injuries do you hear about coming out of Westside? If it fucks with your back..then you need a stronger back.

 

[Cubanito17]

so how long do you pause for???? and this whole hip flexor thing i'm not familiar with

 

[spatts]

Just long enough to release the hipflexor while still keeping your back arched, and tighten the glutes to lift off.

 

[Cubanito17]

See that's the thing I don't understand this whole hip flexor thing. Is the timing different for everyone or is there a way you can tell how people are different????

 

[spatts]

I would imagine it differs, yes. I'm new to it and still learning form, so even my speed sets are kind of slow. However, someone like Hannibal makes it look like a piece of cake because he's been doing it SO long that it just comes naturally to him now.

Have you seen the Squatting Secrets video that Dave Tate did? Or read the Box squat articles at www.elitefts.com ?

 

[Cubanito17]

See i wish I could see those vids and I've heard the ones on deepsquatter.com are even better but thanks to my lil bro he messed up our real player and when I try and DL vids and convert them to Windows media player it shuts down my comp. So I can't see any vids. I'll thank my lil bro again for that one when I get upstairs.

 

[Deciever]

cubanito, scroll down the page and look for a thread called "box squat videos" and then look for the link irish power pasted. got some videos of like 500-600 lb box squats, also all the other links in there show them too

 

[spatts]

These are vids you can buy and watch on a VCR. Not even sure they're availble for download.

 

[Hannibal]

Just long enough to release the hipflexor while still keeping your back arched, and tighten the glutes to lift off.

Pause long enough to release the hip flexors....then drive your head back into the bar....arch your back...and flex off the box. If you have someone watching you from the side....your glutes HAVE to flex before your quads do.....

 

[spatts]

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink...so here it is:

"Box Squat: The benefits of this exercise are numerous. They develop eccentric and concentric power by breaking the eccentric concentric chain. Box squats are a form of overload and isolation. The box squat is the best way to teach proper form on the squat because it is easy to sit way back while pushing your knees out. To take the bar out of the rack, the hands must be evenly placed on the bar. Secure the bar on the back where it feel the most comfortable. To lift the bar out of the rack, one must push evenly with the legs, arch the back, push your ABS out against the belt, and lift the chest up while driving the head back. A high chest will ensure the bar rests as far back as possible. Slide one foot back then the other, to assume a position to squat. Set your feet up in a wide stance position. Point your toes straight ahead or slightly outward. Also keep your elbows pulled under the bar. When one is ready for the decent, make sure to keep the same arched back position. Pull your shoulders together and push your ABS out. To begin the decent push your hips back first. As you sit back push your knees out to the sides to ensure maximum hip involvement. Once one reaches the box, you need to sit on the box and release the hip flexors. Keep the back arched and abs pushed out while driving your knees out to the side.. To begin the ascent, push out on the belt, arch the back as much as possible, and drive the head, chest, and shoulders to the rear. If you push with the leg first, your buttocks will raise first, forcing the bar over the knees, as in a good morning, causing stress to the lower back and knees and diminishing the power of the squat."

 

[GRIMMER]

Cubanito i should have showed you how to do these when you were here. I don't know about time i have never read anything about how long it should take but you don't just touch and go . You do need to pause but not like the pause in the bench its shorter than that. Its different for everyone , depending on how fast like spatterson said you are is also part of how experienced you are with them. THe more experienced the faster you will be able to relax the Hip and squat back up. Anybody that tells you they mess your back up is iether doing them wrong or doesn't know what they are talking about. Remember the goal is to shift the weight onto the more powerful squating muscles of the glutes and hams this is why you relax the hip flexer.

 

[Cubanito17]

NO I havnt' bought any vids from elitefts b/c of two reasons one I work at publix so I don't make that much $$ just workin weekends. And two the cash i do make I watch what I spend it on and lately i've been spendin it on stuff I can use i.e. suit, shirt, belt, etc.

 

[Cubanito17]

GRIMM I know there are stil ALOT of things I have to learn. That's why really I'm glad the 3 lift for me is gonna be in december. If you already didn't ready my lil bro is doin the july 20th meet with me.

 

[GRIMMER]

Sweet , i will definitly be there to watch. and we will go over some training stuff to. might be in that area sometime this summer so we will need to get together and train for a day.

 

[Cubanito17]

Well the thing is I don't live anywhere close to daytona and I will be resting a week out to the comp So I don't think we'll be able to train. SHHOOOOOT don't get me wrong i'd love to train with you it's just i'm 3 hours away from daytona. Man i got some great parents b/c i'm gonna have both of them supportin me and takin me there. As you know I don't know directions for shit. And dad and me finished up the boards tonight so I'll be training with them thursday. Since I like to get shit done right. We cut 2 2X6X8's into 12 pieces each 15 inches long. And i'm nailed them together with a nail gun to make a 3 board 4 board and a 5 board. So I'm set for my board presses. And lil bro is back to trainin with me.

 

[GRIMMER]

I didn't mean to train with you in Daytona. I might spend a week this summer training with Bob and you should come down for a few days , i know your only an hour or so away from him.

 

[Cubanito17]

OH OK ye if you do that then I'll definately go down there. Now remember i'm in school so you'd have to tell me ahead of time and let me know which day, so I can go after school if it's right after school i'll get there at 430 or so. and if you train a day on the weekend not sure b/c of work. Now if your talkin about summer like startin around JUNE then i'm outta school i just have to worry about work so either way I know you'll let me know ahead of time. I believe you stil have my cell so call me when your around here. And shit it'd be cool if you pass by my house if you get board or somethin. I really did appreciate you invitin me over that night so your more than welcome in my lil town to chill. I'll get some peeps together and we could go play pool or somethin.

 

[Arioch]

When you are on the box, the toros is much closer to vertical, which causes a decrease in the shearing force on the spine, and an increase in compressive force. The spine is able to bear a much greater degree of compressive force than it ever could shearing force, which can damage the discs.

Anyone who says that box squatting is dangerous because of the pause has no idea what they are talking about, as they are only considering a single factor of a complex equation. And exercises for spinal unloading, such as reverse hypers, help open the spinal column, specifically the lubar vertebrae, and increase the flow of synovial fluid.