Bloods Done....

[stevesmi]

Go ahead who said any of that info is real? U make it up when u order blood form there smartass.

Jan-april
Enanthate 500/wk
Prop 500/wk
Adex EOD

May-aug
Hcg & letro

Sep-dec
Cyp 400/wk
Hcg 500iu /wk
Proviron ED

Gyno started around april of 2012 went away when I started letro it came back around november. I have been off all of 2013. Ordered some letro which comes in today. What would be the best cycle to take letro at?

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your gyno has to be estrogen based. we know that. I'm gonna say since your sex drive is in the shitter to avoid the letro if its not even helping (unless you have a specific plan and not just throwing darts at a wall). you might want to avoid aromatizing compounds in the future.

just for the record hcg does spike estrogen some, but nothing like test will.

what i would do in your shoes is avoid hormones for a while. get rid of your gyno.. should of never jumped back on roids when you were getting gyno in the first place until you solved that problem. always fix problems first instead of complicating matters. all things considered your bloods came in clean like i said so that is a good thing.

hope this helps .. i would talk to CEO or needtogetaas about gyno cause they both are good at that subject

 

[stevesmi]

Hi guys

I'd like to put a different perspective on his blood results.

I'm not sure if I've simply overlooked it, but I can't see his Free Testosterone only his Serum of 469ng/dl. While it does appear that he's not done any significant damage I'd hasten to say that he hasn't recovered at all.
His FSH and LH are both pretty high indicating his testes aren't running or producing enough hormone. This lends me to believe his Total Testosterone (469ng/dl) isn't where it naturally should be due to his testicles not reponding to the secretions from the pituatary gland. What do you guys reckon?

I think he needs to start a comprehensive recovery PCT schedule offered by you guys, and asap. I would also advise he gets a re-work done on FSH, LH, and Free or Bioavailable T (and total again).

You definately need to give the AAS a couple of months break and stick to a good PCT and then introduce some natural testosterone boosting supplements and E busters.

All the best and thanks for posting the labs.

Craig

without knowing what his T was like before hard to guess. in todays society we gotta get more and more used to 450 total T being a solid number. has to do with the environment, our jobs, whats in our foods/drinks, etc.

i do also beleive once you start abusing hormones (running what is considered even low to moderate amounts of juice) its gonna be almost impossible to get your T levels up to where it was before you touched hormones. I can't prove this theory with 'studies' but its just based on having seen so many bloods the past year or two on here. hence why we say young guys should wait to juice.

 

[ohyea]

your gyno has to be estrogen based. we know that. I'm gonna say since your sex drive is in the shitter to avoid the letro if its not even helping (unless you have a specific plan and not just throwing darts at a wall). you might want to avoid aromatizing compounds in the future.

just for the record hcg does spike estrogen some, but nothing like test will.

what i would do in your shoes is avoid hormones for a while. get rid of your gyno.. should of never jumped back on roids when you were getting gyno in the first place until you solved that problem. always fix problems first instead of complicating matters. all things considered your bloods came in clean like i said so that is a good thing.

hope this helps .. i would talk to CEO or needtogetaas about gyno cause they both are good at that subject

Ok an thank you. I have NOT started the letro. I wamt to know a good cycle an how to take this liquid L FEM its called . I ordered it of AG Guys . I tried to put it under my tongue like my other letro but it burned the skin. Therefore what the hell do I do inject this type of letro?

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[Mike4705]

Why did you put it under your tongue?

 

[ohyea]

Idk that how I did my last stuff but it wasnt the same color....anyway what should I cycle it?

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[stevesmi]

Ok an thank you. I have NOT started the letro. I wamt to know a good cycle an how to take this liquid L FEM its called . I ordered it of AG Guys . I tried to put it under my tongue like my other letro but it burned the skin. Therefore what the hell do I do inject this type of letro?

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you just swallow it. a trick is to put it in with some juice

DO NOT inject it.

also keep in mind letro will tank your libido.. keep this in mind and be aware. i understand your frustration with gyno but you need to go into this with a real plan and not just throw drugs at the problem.. thats why i said to talk to those two i mentioned who have experience with gyno.

no one problem is ever the same so you will need to realize that. your friend could take a gram of test a week and not get gyno but you could take barely any and get it.

 

[UA_Iron]

Nothing has fired up my nipples like HCG has. Letro will hurt your libido, but its only temporary.

 

[ohyea]

Any ideas on a letro cycle

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[ceo]

Hi guys

I'd like to put a different perspective on his blood results.

I'm not sure if I've simply overlooked it, but I can't see his Free Testosterone only his Serum of 469ng/dl. While it does appear that he's not done any significant damage I'd hasten to say that he hasn't recovered at all.
His FSH and LH are both pretty high indicating his testes aren't running or producing enough hormone. This lends me to believe his Total Testosterone (469ng/dl) isn't where it naturally should be due to his testicles not reponding to the secretions from the pituatary gland. What do you guys reckon?

I think he needs to start a comprehensive recovery PCT schedule offered by you guys, and asap. I would also advise he gets a re-work done on FSH, LH, and Free or Bioavailable T (and total again).

You definately need to give the AAS a couple of months break and stick to a good PCT and then introduce some natural testosterone boosting supplements and E busters.

All the best and thanks for posting the labs.

Craig

Free T is usually 1.5% - 2.5%. If we knew his SHBG we could most likely, quite accurately calculate it since we do know his albumin. Example: if his SHBG were 65 (very high) his Free T would be calculated at 5.88 ng/dl, or 1.25%. If SHBG were 15 (very low) Free T would be calculated at 12.9 ng/dl, or 2.75%.

Up to 40% of bound T is loosely bound to albumin and can be easily dissociated and made readily available for uptake.

His FSH and LH are also smack-dab in the middle of the normal range. Nothing wrong there.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

OP - it appears as though you never ran an AI or SERM during your cycles. Is this the case? Why? If so, no wonder.

Also, you need to learn how to eat and lift for max gains as an ecto before you go on any more cycles. At 6'4" you could have easily gotten to 185 lbs without AAS. Any medical issues why reaching 185 natty would not have been possible?

Bottom line is you have gyno. Start your letro. How much? Well...how bad is your gyno? If it's really bad you can start at 2.5mg/day and lower the dose as symptoms subside. If it's not that bad and you want to save your joints and libido, you can go slow and steady at 0.5mg - 1.0mg/day. Monitor as you go along and once gyno disappears you should probably switch to aromasin at 12.5 EOD or E3D for a while.

 

[ohyea]

Free T is usually 1.5% - 2.5%. If we knew his SHBG we could most likely, quite accurately calculate it since we do know his albumin. Example: if his SHBG were 65 (very high) his Free T would be calculated at 5.88 ng/dl, or 1.25%. If SHBG were 15 (very low) Free T would be calculated at 12.9 ng/dl, or 2.75%.

Up to 40% of bound T is loosely bound to albumin and can be easily dissociated and made readily available for uptake.

His FSH and LH are also smack-dab in the middle of the normal range. Nothing wrong there.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

OP - it appears as though you never ran an AI or SERM during your cycles. Is this the case? Why? If so, no wonder.

Also, you need to learn how to eat and lift for max gains as an ecto before you go on any more cycles. At 6'4" you could have easily gotten to 185 lbs without AAS. Any medical issues why reaching 185 natty would not have been possible?

Bottom line is you have gyno. Start your letro. How much? Well...how bad is your gyno? If it's really bad you can start at 2.5mg/day and lower the dose as symptoms subside. If it's not that bad and you want to save your joints and libido, you can go slow and steady at 0.5mg - 1.0mg/day. Monitor as you go along and once gyno disappears you should probably switch to aromasin at 12.5 EOD or E3D for a while.

Thank you for that its bad an started 2.5mg/day and i am on day 4. sensitivity is gone an the pain isnt that bad anymore. lumps/balls are still the same size. once they subside i will start to lower the dose. i also read in Needto's that he had the guy on 5mg/day for about a week then tapered down....I am learning about the SERMs now wasnt told about them from anyone. I have also looked into the HCgenerate/Bridge but idk which is better. Also next cycle will be much much much more percise.