Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below ThePolishHammer
New member
Anybody know what this is? Specifically what sort of balistic training would work to train your vertical jump.
Ballistic Training, What is this?
- Thread starter ThePolishHammer
- Start date
C
Citruscide
Guest
Ballistic training is usually used to counter-act the deceleration phase that can occur in other forms of training(such as plyometric training) ... that is, the athlete will actually throws or jumps WITH the weight. The athlete will actually jump with the weight or catch the weight.
The term Ballistic basically means acceleration to high velocity with actual projection into free space. There is a great strain taken on the body through this type of training, as the stress on the body when you 'land' or 'catch' the weight is tremendous. Some weight equipment is actually adapted to work with this technique, so as to lessen the strain.
C-ditty
The term Ballistic basically means acceleration to high velocity with actual projection into free space. There is a great strain taken on the body through this type of training, as the stress on the body when you 'land' or 'catch' the weight is tremendous. Some weight equipment is actually adapted to work with this technique, so as to lessen the strain.
C-ditty
coolcolj
New member
Polish hammer - from what I a gather your keen to get some hops.
well basicly VJ boils down to 4 things -
1) Great jumping technique
2) large strength to weight ratio - get strong on squats and deadlifts. aim for at least 2 times bodyweight minimum.
3)Explosive strength and rate of force developement - olympic lifts, jump squats, jumps with weights, fast/explosive squats and deadlifts, depth jumps, use bands.
4) optimum stretch reflex - plyos and depth jumps
Do all of these and you too can have a vertical jump that will make throwers, NFL players and triple jumpers proud
It takes time - plan to invest a good 2 years to reach your potential.
well basicly VJ boils down to 4 things -
1) Great jumping technique
2) large strength to weight ratio - get strong on squats and deadlifts. aim for at least 2 times bodyweight minimum.
3)Explosive strength and rate of force developement - olympic lifts, jump squats, jumps with weights, fast/explosive squats and deadlifts, depth jumps, use bands.
4) optimum stretch reflex - plyos and depth jumps
Do all of these and you too can have a vertical jump that will make throwers, NFL players and triple jumpers proud
It takes time - plan to invest a good 2 years to reach your potential.
C
Citruscide
Guest
I did some of these techniques when I was a high jumper at IU.
Basically, I did plyometrics with weights. I'd do the box jumping with a weighted vest/back back, weighted jump ropes, standing jumps with weights... basically, I did regular training with weights and explosiveness. I got gains pretty fast, however... but remember, I was already in great jumping shape as it was... so it was just a matter of pushing myself further.
C-ditty
Basically, I did plyometrics with weights. I'd do the box jumping with a weighted vest/back back, weighted jump ropes, standing jumps with weights... basically, I did regular training with weights and explosiveness. I got gains pretty fast, however... but remember, I was already in great jumping shape as it was... so it was just a matter of pushing myself further.
C-ditty
ThePolishHammer
New member
A few questions
Just to clarify....
What are depth Jumps?
What did you mean by "Use bands"
And just out of curiosity, A 350 lb squat is about the equivilent of what sort of weight on bench?
And Citruscide,
What did you mean by the deceleration phase that hapens with polymetric training.
Did you mean a deceleration in jumping velocity, or progress?
Thanks for all the help.
Cant wait to put some of this stuff into action.
Just to clarify....
What are depth Jumps?
What did you mean by "Use bands"
And just out of curiosity, A 350 lb squat is about the equivilent of what sort of weight on bench?
And Citruscide,
What did you mean by the deceleration phase that hapens with polymetric training.
Did you mean a deceleration in jumping velocity, or progress?
Thanks for all the help.
Cant wait to put some of this stuff into action.
coolcolj
New member
depth jumps - step off a 20-24inch box and then jump upon landing, minimise contact time. Not to be done until you have ample leg and tendon strength ie - full squat at least 1.5 times your BW. Very stressful on the CNS and tendons
These are usually done towards the end of a long training plan.
Bands - adding bands on squats alslow one to fully explode the lift from bottom to top, without slowing down. Keeps the bar on your back as well. See here
http://www.jumpstretch.com/
Bench press has no correlation to the squat. I would be incline to choose the incline bench press and overhead press over the BP if you after hops.
He means - the eccentric phase - when you land and absorb the impact
just concentrate on getting very strong on squats and deadlifts, but always remeber bar speed has to remain high for this strength to transfer to jumping.
These are usually done towards the end of a long training plan.
Bands - adding bands on squats alslow one to fully explode the lift from bottom to top, without slowing down. Keeps the bar on your back as well. See here
http://www.jumpstretch.com/
Bench press has no correlation to the squat. I would be incline to choose the incline bench press and overhead press over the BP if you after hops.
He means - the eccentric phase - when you land and absorb the impact
just concentrate on getting very strong on squats and deadlifts, but always remeber bar speed has to remain high for this strength to transfer to jumping.
ThePolishHammer
New member
great
Much thanks for the info.
What sort of barspeed should i be trying to keep up? How long from the bottom to the top of the movement?
Much thanks for the info.
What sort of barspeed should i be trying to keep up? How long from the bottom to the top of the movement?
C
Citruscide
Guest
Re: A few questions
In plyometric training, say, for instance, you jump onto a box, or do a standing jump as high as you can in the air. Well, the deceleration phase is when you are coming down. Without weights, the deceleration part of the movement is very short, meaning, it doesn't take as much effort to slow down as it does to "take off".
By adding weight to the movement (Ballistic) you increase the length of the deceleration phase and thus, there will be a greater development of power. Because by having weights with you on the jump, it will take you more effort to slow down and stop (simple inertia)
So, if you actually throw or jump with the weight, the deceleration phase will be increased to be more optimal for strength and power.
Hope that helped you understand it.
C-ditty
ThePolishHammer said:
In plyometric training, say, for instance, you jump onto a box, or do a standing jump as high as you can in the air. Well, the deceleration phase is when you are coming down. Without weights, the deceleration part of the movement is very short, meaning, it doesn't take as much effort to slow down as it does to "take off".
By adding weight to the movement (Ballistic) you increase the length of the deceleration phase and thus, there will be a greater development of power. Because by having weights with you on the jump, it will take you more effort to slow down and stop (simple inertia)
So, if you actually throw or jump with the weight, the deceleration phase will be increased to be more optimal for strength and power.
Hope that helped you understand it.
C-ditty
coolcolj
New member
Re: great
under one second
see my video clip - squatting with bands
right click and save before viewing
http://www.members.optushome.com.au/coolcolj/Movies/CCJ_FirstBandsSquatWorkout.mpg
The heavier set is 1 sec going up, the lighter power set is 0.7 sec. which is pretty quick for a full squat since it has a long rnage of motion.
ThePolishHammer said:
under one second
see my video clip - squatting with bands
right click and save before viewing
http://www.members.optushome.com.au/coolcolj/Movies/CCJ_FirstBandsSquatWorkout.mpg
The heavier set is 1 sec going up, the lighter power set is 0.7 sec. which is pretty quick for a full squat since it has a long rnage of motion.
C
Citruscide
Guest
CoolColJ said:
well, I think I would agree with this on a general level... but I don't even think I did more than 135lbs on squats (back when I weighed 160-165) and I did all kinds of jumps like this... of course, I also did many many sprints and other exercises that kept me honest.
C-ditty
crew9
New member
CoolColJ said:
I'm not sure I agree with this statement completely. I think depth jumps would be great for his vertical leap irregardless of his leg strength. I'll use myself as an example. Depth jumps were a staple of my teams jump training for volleyball. My, and for the most part my entire team's, squats were not strong in the least. I also had both my ACL's blown out at the time but the depth jumps still helped my vert quite a bit. The full squat at 1.5 your bodyweight would be ideal but I wouldn't be so quick to say do not do these if you can't hack that weight.
coolcolj
New member
he's gonna have to squat and deadlift anyway to get his vert up, might as well leave the depth jumps to latter. You still need a good power to weight ratio - of which high strength levels are a requirement. I can't think of a single elite sprinter, triple jumper etc right now that can't squat twice his own bodyweight
just squatting will make anyone jump higher . I'ved added a solid 5 inches already in the last 7 months just from squats and olympic lifts, even though my bodyweight has climbed from 180 to 194lbs.
its all about foundation.
just squatting will make anyone jump higher . I'ved added a solid 5 inches already in the last 7 months just from squats and olympic lifts, even though my bodyweight has climbed from 180 to 194lbs.
its all about foundation.
C
Citruscide
Guest
I think what Crew is trying to say is that you don't have to wait until you can squat 1.5x your body weight on squats.
I did the depth jumps in Track back when I only squatted 30lbs less than my body weight (for reps)
C-ditty
I did the depth jumps in Track back when I only squatted 30lbs less than my body weight (for reps)
C-ditty
ThePolishHammer
New member
well.
How much leg work can you pull off in one week?
Plyometrics/Depth Jumps, Deadlifts, Squats, 2-3 light tumbling practices, and potetnially two sprinting sessions.
how much training is advisable? Any suggestions on a split? How should these drills/exercises be periodized?
How much leg work can you pull off in one week?
Plyometrics/Depth Jumps, Deadlifts, Squats, 2-3 light tumbling practices, and potetnially two sprinting sessions.
how much training is advisable? Any suggestions on a split? How should these drills/exercises be periodized?
ThePolishHammer
New member
Checked out that video. Pretty impressive. Im still a little unclear on how the bands help the lifter continuosly explode up. How does the resitance they provide differ from the resitance of the weight?
crew9
New member
I could be wrong so somebody please correct me if I am, but I think the point of the bands is to provide a consistently greater load. Like when you start off the band's aren't applying much if any force against, but as you get farther into the movement they'll provide greater and greater resistance. With the weights no matter what point your at 135 is 135.
coolcolj
New member
see what you can get away with, usually your body can handle quite a bit for 2-3 weeks and then breaks down. So My advise is to stack up for 2 weeks and the backoff for 3 weeks.
Its the CNS and tibs you have to worry about, shin splints and knee patella pain is a real danger.
You'll have to experiment
Bands are like giant rubber bands. Stretch a band, and the resistance increases with each inch that it is stretched. I used failry low tension/stretch in those vids - they only kicked in halfway up. But ideally you want them to start kicking in as soon as you start to rise.
They do add a slightly unstable feel to the exercise, which helps to make you more aware of tigtening up the core muscles.
Lately I've been squatting 3-4 times a week, and I experienced first hand how much my abs were being used with the bands on!
When you squat you know how easy the top is right? Well the bands add more resistance as they stretch, so they load the top end. SO adding the bands accomodates your increasing leverage at the top of the squat. This is the money area of the squat for vert training. The last thing you want is to train yourself to slow down here, which is what you would normally do. WIth band tension in place, one must now explode all the way to the top. Even if you don't, the bands somehow force you too, because as you squat up, the bands start to stretch and the weight increases, this signals the brain to increase the force of the muscles to compenstate.
Training the CNS to do this is what you want for Vertical Jumping, so much so you may not need to do any olympic lifts
Another thing, Bands slingshot the weight downwards, creating greater eccentric stress, and thus a better stretch reflex off the bottom much like depth jumps and plyos.
Basicly if you don't push hard all the way you will not lockout. Also when you do push hard, the bands add a lot of tension to the bar, and that keeps the bar on your back. Anyone who has squatted explosively will know that the bar will come off your back and crash back down on your traps...the bands limit this movement to half an inch at the most, if at all, depending on the band tension off course.
Its the CNS and tibs you have to worry about, shin splints and knee patella pain is a real danger.
You'll have to experiment
Bands are like giant rubber bands. Stretch a band, and the resistance increases with each inch that it is stretched. I used failry low tension/stretch in those vids - they only kicked in halfway up. But ideally you want them to start kicking in as soon as you start to rise.
They do add a slightly unstable feel to the exercise, which helps to make you more aware of tigtening up the core muscles.
Lately I've been squatting 3-4 times a week, and I experienced first hand how much my abs were being used with the bands on!
When you squat you know how easy the top is right? Well the bands add more resistance as they stretch, so they load the top end. SO adding the bands accomodates your increasing leverage at the top of the squat. This is the money area of the squat for vert training. The last thing you want is to train yourself to slow down here, which is what you would normally do. WIth band tension in place, one must now explode all the way to the top. Even if you don't, the bands somehow force you too, because as you squat up, the bands start to stretch and the weight increases, this signals the brain to increase the force of the muscles to compenstate.
Training the CNS to do this is what you want for Vertical Jumping, so much so you may not need to do any olympic lifts
Another thing, Bands slingshot the weight downwards, creating greater eccentric stress, and thus a better stretch reflex off the bottom much like depth jumps and plyos.
Basicly if you don't push hard all the way you will not lockout. Also when you do push hard, the bands add a lot of tension to the bar, and that keeps the bar on your back. Anyone who has squatted explosively will know that the bar will come off your back and crash back down on your traps...the bands limit this movement to half an inch at the most, if at all, depending on the band tension off course.
Last edited:
ThePolishHammer
New member
sooo...
Tanks for clearing that up. So When would you reccomend i start training with the bands?
Tanks for clearing that up. So When would you reccomend i start training with the bands?
ThePolishHammer
New member
how to measure your VJ
How do you measure your vertical jump.
I just started squatting yesterday.
I should probably see how hi my jump is at this point. How do i measure this?
Im guessing by making some marks on the wall and seeing which ones i can touch then take that height and subtract my height+the length of my arm?
How do you measure your vertical jump.
I just started squatting yesterday.
I should probably see how hi my jump is at this point. How do i measure this?
Im guessing by making some marks on the wall and seeing which ones i can touch then take that height and subtract my height+the length of my arm?
