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Back Routines

swordfish151

swordfish151

New member
Im looking for a good back routine...
what im currently doing

Chin ups (on the machine) 5X5
seated rows 2X10
bent over rows on the smith machines 2X10
hyperextensions 3X15

Thinking about deadlifts but should i do those first? why are deads so great?
 
the reason deads are great?
for me personally, i had no back until i started doing em
and then my traps improved
and my squats and quads/hams

my .02
 
My opinion deads are the best back exercise if not best single lift out there. You will gain mass like crazy in your back as well as others like forearms legs bis. Yes I like to do them first. Just for example I do back like this
 
like this? ..oh must be a typo.. or you are fixing to add it in and i am fucking it all up for you... ha ha
 
you need:

weighted chins
bent over rows (parallell to ground -- or db rows paralell to ground)
deadlifts
optional: good morning or hypers

any cables or machines are basically second rate.
 
I do them last because they take so much out of me. Sometimes I feel like passing out so I would rather have that happen at the end of my workout as opposed to the beginning. Depends on what your focus is though. If all you care about is your deadlift, then yeah, do it first.
 
ChewYxRage said:
I do them last because they take so much out of me. Sometimes I feel like passing out so I would rather have that happen at the end of my workout as opposed to the beginning. Depends on what your focus is though. If all you care about is your deadlift, then yeah, do it first.
Click to expand...

nah that sounds like a better idea...to do them last...would you still do hyperextensions even though you did deads or are you good after deadlifts?
 
swordfish151 said:
some do deadlifts first......good idea?
Click to expand...

I like to do them after the upper back has already recieved some stimulation so that the deadlifts call more upper back than lower and other muscle groups into play. helps keep symetry good as well
 
swordfish151 said:
nah that sounds like a better idea...to do them last...would you still do hyperextensions even though you did deads or are you good after deadlifts?
Click to expand...


I wouldn't do hyperextensions after I dead...I do 5 sets of deadlifts. My erectors are wasted after that
 
Workout one:

Deadlifts: pyramid up to a heavy single or double
Chinups 2 inches wider than shoulders: 5 sets of 6-10 reps (add weight if all of your sets are 10)

Workout Two: (the next time you train back)

Barbel-bent-over-row: 3 x 6-8 reps
Cable pulldowns, close grop: 3 x 8-10
Hyperextensions: 2 x 10-15
 
swordfish151 said:
5 sets at the end for your deads? whats your back routine look like?
Click to expand...


I included warmup sets in that figure. I work up to a heavy single. I have my upper and lower back days split up. I give upper back it's own day, and I deadlift after I work chest (which is Day 5 out of 5)
 
RuggerMU said:
My opinion deads are the best back exercise if not best single lift out there. You will gain mass like crazy in your back as well as others like forearms legs bis. Yes I like to do them first. Just for example I do back like this
Click to expand...
sorry forgot where I was going with that. Like this

Deads
chin ups
bent over bbell row
heavy shrug
close chins
dbell row
dbell shrugs
 
I do a thickness routine and a width routine 5 days later...........

DEADS
STR8 ROWS
DBELL ROWS
SEATED CABLE NARROW
AND LAT PULL NARROW SS W/ HYPERS

SHRUGS
LAT PULL WIDE
SEATED ROW WIDE TO NECK
PULLOVERS
WIDE GRIP TBAR ROWS
 
This is indeed starting to get interesting to me..i only do back one day out of the week..i see some that are hitting it twice..some say lower and upper...
 
JKurz1 said:
I do a thickness routine and a width routine 5 days later...........

DEADS
STR8 ROWS
DBELL ROWS
SEATED CABLE NARROW
AND LAT PULL NARROW SS W/ HYPERS

SHRUGS
LAT PULL WIDE
SEATED ROW WIDE TO NECK
PULLOVERS
WIDE GRIP TBAR ROWS
Click to expand...

i was thinkign of trying something like that when i cut
you liking that?
 
Heres a sample of one of my routines from my journal:

Back:

Lat Pulldowns:

165x15
195x15
225x15
255x15
300x15 (stack)
345x8 (PR.Stack plus 45 pinned to machine)

Dumbbell Rows on Bench:

150x20 (Both arms, one at a time)

Hammer Strength Iso Lateral High Row/pulldown:

270x15
360x15
450x9
500x7 (10 45lb plates and 2 25's)
450x7

Cybex Eagle Row:

190x15
230x11
250x10


I get a good variety of reps but take most all my sets to failure and use a minimum of 15 sets for back. Deads Ive found completely unnecessary for back size, and as much fun as they were to do, they ended up being more detrimental to me then anything. Despite going from 405 to 505lbs on standard deads my back size didnt increase at all. Traps got slightly thicker and the waist measurement. Couldve built those areas with heavy hyper extentions had shrugs though. This is what has worked well for me.
 
Ive never done deads for back although i think i might start. I just dont see how a dead lift can work your back isnt it mostly legs? WHat part of the motion hits your back?
 
swordfish151 said:
nah that sounds like a better idea...to do them last...would you still do hyperextensions even though you did deads or are you good after deadlifts?
Click to expand...

do your deadlifts first. and if you are going to do the bent over rows, do them with a bar, and not on the smith machine
 
swordfish151 said:
why on the bar not the smith bro?
Click to expand...
ok...your goal for the next lifetime is to NEVER use the Smith machine again......


Christ......it's the first piece of equipment I'd burn if I wouldn't get thrown in jail............ :worried:
 
JKurz1 said:
ok...your goal for the next lifetime is to NEVER use the Smith machine again......


Christ......it's the first piece of equipment I'd burn if I wouldn't get thrown in jail............ :worried:
Click to expand...

hjahahahah funniest thing i've heard today. Have to agree 100% though.
 
JKurz1 said:
ok...your goal for the next lifetime is to NEVER use the Smith machine again......


Christ......it's the first piece of equipment I'd burn if I wouldn't get thrown in jail............ :worried:
Click to expand...

actually moved away from the smith (for squats) a month ago and just did the squat rack...lets just say the squat rack is a REAL MANS machine...well not a machine but you know what i mean...legs were sore for days!!!!
 
I used to do this for back:

Deadlift 4 x 6-8
Weighted pullups - What I used to do is target 30 reps. However many sets it took to get me there. Once I got it in 3 sets I'd add weight.
Some kind of row - T-bar supported, seated cable, whatever. 3 x 8-10

Pretty typical stuff.

I also tried a Poliquin 'Flying Squirrel' workout. I think I'd spend an hr at the pull up station doing various types - sternum pullups, varying widths and grips. Can't remember all the details and progressions but I do remember it was grueling.
 
swordfish151 said:
why on the bar not the smith bro?
Click to expand...

i guess its just my personal preference. i am not a very big fan of the smith machine, and i try to advocate against the use of it. the smith machine tends to put the movement into an unnatural path. i know we are talking about doing rows here, but i see a lot of people squatting and benching on the smith machine, and it kills me. especially when i see people squatting, the angle that the legs are in when at the bottom of the squat makes me cringe, because its just inviting injury.
when rowing on the smith machine, a person could pull back against the bar and get a little more leverage due to the fact that the poles guide the bar up in a fluid motion. if you were to get into the habit of doing this, and tried it with a bar, you would end up losing your balance.
ultimately the choice is up to you. try doing them with a bar next time, and see if you like it. you will probably notice a world of difference.
 
camshaft said:
what about deads twice a week?
Click to expand...

everybody will have their opinion about this, but i would suggest that you dont do them twice a week. im making the assumption that because you deadlift, that you also do squats. is this correct? keep in mind that the deadlift and the squat both put a tremendous strain on the lower back. so you can see where this would lead to overtraining in your lower back. and trust me, having your lower back give out on you is no fun. i have been battling with it for about a month now (i fucked mine up squatting 500, but that's a different story.)
i know most of you guys here are more into BBing, but if you look at routines of PLers, most will only go for a heavy/max pull once a month at the most when it comes to deads. if you look at the basic set up of the Westside Barbell routine, there is a max effort (ME) day for squat/deadlift on monday, and dynamic effort (DE) day for squat/deadlift on friday. obviously, the ME squat/dead day you are going to be going for a max attempt on some type of squat, deadlift (be it a sumo/conv. dead, or some type of rack pull) or GM (standing or seated.) this is followed up with accessory work for the hams, glutes, lower back, and abs. the DE squat/dead day, the workout is always started with speed work on a box squat. in contrast to the ME day where you are trying to lift the most amount of weight possible, on the DE day, you are taking a weight that is approx. 50% of your max, and trying to move it as fast as possible with very short rest periods between sets (30secs.) next, some will work speed deads in the same fashion, again, concentrating on pulling the weight as fast as possible. the key to the DE day is not to let the ego get the best of you, and keep the weight light. occassionally, some will work up to a max single.
 
I'll second that. The deadlift is the maximum pull that the body can muster. As a lifter progresses one finds that it becomes very very taxing on the body's recuperative ability (CNS is included in this) - there is a big reason why Westside's Elite lifters avoid training the lift frequently. If you are going to pull heavy once a week and do some light pulls on another day you might get away with it.

There is a good program that has you deadlift 3x per week (Korte's 3x3) but also figure that it includes absolutely no assistance work and all you do is bench, squat, and dead every day 3x per week for around 8 weeks. If your max is somewhat respectable this program is a nightmare because you always have to pull last before you leave the gym. You can find Korte's write ups along with a lot of Louie's (WSB) in the Deepsquatter archives here: http://www.deepsquatter.com/strength/archives/index.htm

Anyway, the point being is that you had better either be a beginner or you'll have to manage this very carefully if you intend to deadlift 2x per week. This is actually a really good reason to learn the olympic lifts (or even just clean and snatch pull variants) because it gives you a ton of possible pulling variants that are for the most part concentric only, far less taxing, and have a very solid carry over to the dead. Louie, WSB, tends to steer clear of them but this has never made sense to me as the same article that talked about the carry-over from the goodmorning listed the power clean, high pull, and power shrug along with it - it was written by Bill Starr BTW after he set a DL record without training it explicitly - he was an OL. With OLs you can pull mutliple times per week, acceleration is implicit, and you can redistribute your recovery away toward other lifts. Steering clear of the whole "teaching" argument by using clean/snatch pull style varriants this is pretty logical to me and it's probably the only thing that irks me about Westside.

Here's the original article: http://www.americanpowerliftevolution.net/New Folder 1969/dlapproach1.html

Here's someone who recently did an OL assist program which lead him to a PR in the dead without training it. Do notice he had issues with locking out the heavier weight but also notice the one exercise he neglected was the dynamic shrugging (power shrug) which specifically overloads the top portion to supplment this:
http://www.ruggedmag.com/index.php?type=Article&i=15&a=9

Interesting stuff anyway. Good tools to have in the arsenal as the deadlift didn't earn the title as the "ultimate test of full body strength" by being easy to recovery from so train smart and use each tool to the best of your abilities.
 
Last edited:
Madcow - your goal for the next few posts is to make them one to two lines....christ dude...every post is a book......lol

You on the clock? :chomp:
 
JKurz1 said:
Madcow - your goal for the next few posts is to make them one to two lines....christ dude...every post is a book......lol

You on the clock? :chomp:
Click to expand...
Oh I hear you but that's my strategy. I do it once right and I post it into my thread and later update the TOContents with the new info. This is a fairly valuable explanation with good links so it'll make a nice addition. I expect that within another 30 days I won't ever have to write a long post again. I'll just provide links. There might even be less questions too as this stuff will be more accessible.
 
Madcow2 said:
Oh I hear you but that's my strategy. I do it once right and I post it into my thread and later update the TOContents with the new info. This is a fairly valuable explanation with good links so it'll make a nice addition. I expect that within another 30 days I won't ever have to write a long post again. I'll just provide links. There might even be less questions too as this stuff will be more accessible.
Click to expand...


I agree that was a good post. Those were interesting as well.
 
muscelove said:
Ive never done deads for back although i think i might start. I just dont see how a dead lift can work your back isnt it mostly legs? WHat part of the motion hits your back?
Click to expand...


oooh my, youre not one of those hammer strength people ru???

anyway, do heavy deadlifts once a week for 8-10 weeks, 2-3 days after a heavy squat day. or better yet, try the madcow 5x5, or any routine that has deading in it.

youll see results in your lats/traps as well as grip and legs.

trust me
 
All the above are good ideas. My current routine has my back constantly sore:

Tuesday: Power cleans singles to failure, Bench

Thursday: Dead lifts (Coan Phillipi routine: http://www.powerpage.net/coanphildead.html)

Saturday: Clean and press 100 reps (not light weights! You should be ready to passout on the last lift. Here is where I got the idea: http://danjohn.org/100reps.html)

Sunday: Squat 5x5

I also throw in pullups and straight leg deadlifts as I see fit but never on Saturday.
 
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