Bro, all I can tell you is what my experience was. I had a 20 cc bottle of Trenbolone by tt, and cycled it w/ D-bol, and Test 200. It was my second cycle, and the truth of the matter is, I probably didnt take enough(50mg/day Reforvit for 50 days, 600mg T2 by Tornel, and the Tren aka fina 3 days/wk.) Needless to say I saw nothing off of the cycle. So who knows! To me it remains a mystery! The shit came packaged in a box, and looked real! But that dont mean shit. Cant get mad though!, just part of the journey to greatness! I'll keep on trying!