ANOTHER carb-up question

[SteelWeaver]

I'm wondering about the pre-comp carb-up and calories, and the necessity for protein during the carb up.

So we all know by now my calories are stupidly low - OK, fine. But now when I carb up, is it gonna make much difference how far beyond current daily cals I go if the final total is still below maintenance? It was suggested to me that I don't go much beyond what I'm on now, cal-wise, but the way I see it, that's not going to give me a good carb load, unless I leave out all the protein, and I figure whatever I load up in the last 2 days is not going to be stored as fat, so it doesn't matter too much, really.

Any opinions?

 

[JJFigure]

Well, this has been working for me - I don't eat protein on my carb load days. Since I've switched to the anabolic diet for this comp, I have been adding a little fat to my carb loads (per Dr. Di Pasquale's recommendation of 30% fat on carb load days), and that's actually helped prevent bloating and carb hangovers. I'm eating 300-400 grams/carb on Sat and Sun with minimal water retention. Plus, that oatmeal tastes damn good w/ a tablespoon of PB added in.

 

[MS]

Just do what your trainer tells you!

If you do a moderate glycogen depletion, then your muscles are primed to take up ALL nutrients (not just carbs). If you don't 'deplete', then just increasing you carbs in place of proteins and fats will work fine. This is the method that Wilson6 recommends for endurance athletes, and I believe he's also prepped some pretty decent looking BBs. Remember, in those last few days you won't be doing much exercise, so even if your caloric intake is the same as it's been all along, it is effectively an increase in nett nutrients as far as you body is concerned.

 

[wilson6]

I've always suggested keeping protein high and fat low on carb up days. Who needs a lot of trigs floating around when all the lipogenic enzymes are turned on because of insulin and the protein will potentiate the insulin response and drive more glycogen into the muscle.

W6

 

[MS]

I might add that I personally go for ~25% protein, 65% carbs and a little fat (less than 10%) until the night before the show when I drop all carbs, but this assumes that I'm 'full' by Friday night. In any event, I stick to flaxseed oil and nuts for my fats....less impact on insulin mediated glucose uptake that way. But no way would I suggest mixing lots of fat AND carbs at the same time. Either you're carbing up, or you're not, and fats have no place in a carb-load.

 

[SteelWeaver]

Great, thanks. Yeah, I know about the no/low fat thing, and I definitely don't have room in my calorie allowance for fat anyway. I was just wondering if the protein is necessary. I am following what my trainer told me angel: ) (of course), but I like CHECKING too

She said I don't need the protein, and must just load with carbs up to the calorie level I'm on now, for two days. That only gives me about 200g or so of carbs, though, per day. If protein will help with the load, I figure I can throw in 10-15g per meal and still keep the calories low, no? Like you say, there won't be any fat storage so soon.

If I only go on for pre-judging at 3pm, does the carb load also only start at 3pm 2 days before? Is a carb load always 2 days? Is this a period that has been found to be optimal in some way?

 

[wilson6]

"If I only go on for pre-judging at 3pm, does the carb load also only start at 3pm 2 days before? Is a carb load always 2 days? Is this a period that has been found to be optimal in some way?"

Do what works for you. 48 hrs is fine, but you have to be careful with water retention. That's were working with sodium and water is essential.

Look at some of the other threads on this subject.

W6

 

[JJFigure]

I've been playing with my weekend carbloads, and 36 hours seems to work best for me (~700 grams total carbs). You don't have enough time to really play with it, but hopefully you can play around a little more for your next contest. That's been the best part of switching to the anabolic diet from NHE - carb loading over the weekend instead of splitting it into two separate days (T and Sat) has let me simulate my pre-contest-week diet every week, so I have a much better feel for the carb load process.

 

[SteelWeaver]

Thanks everybody. You're right W6 - I should have browsed a few more posts - OK, well I checked that out - answered my sodium and timing questions etc. Decided to start Fri pm, not am, and only cut sodium on Sat am. Should be fine. Plan's all worked out.

I just have one more question. How much protein is actually required to decently potentiate the insulin response? I've heard as low as 6-10g in some post-w/o carb/pro shake studies. Is that true?

JJ - you can be sure I will do lots more practice in the coming months and years - this year has taught me a great deal in terms of what not to do

 

[wilson6]

Probably has to do with the amino acid content. Certain aminos are better at potentiating an insulin response than others. I'd say about 20 grams of a good whey protein should do it, but a lower amount might work.

W6