Advanced 5 day a week version of the 5x5 routine?

[Nathan]

I have this thing in my head that I should be in the gym 5 days a week. So I am wondering if anyone has ever taken the 5x5 routine and added a day for light arm work, and maybe another day for light hamstring, forearm and calf work? And if so did you find this was overtraining?

I'm just thinking 15 sets of squats a week sounds like a fuckload and a good way to overtrain really fast, so adding in anything extra could easily push things too far. Never tried the 5x5 routine though and all you jackasses keep discussing it so figured I had might as well give it a go so I can actually comment on it.

 

[s8nlilhlpr2]

If you are used to doing trad. bb type splits, it does not seem like enough volume/work and most people hate doing all the squats. It worked well for me, though because I had not organized my training properly before. As long as you can recover enough for the next day, I don't see why adding a "little" fluff work on off days would hurt. Most people feel the first 4 weeks are too easy, then burnout on the 6-7th. If you can find AB's old log or ZgazZ they each had a LONG run of breaking PR's.

For me personally, it took me from struggling with 225 DL and 185 BS to more than double my lifts. I use military press a lot mroe than bench, and am comfortably pressing 155 for reps, or jerking 225+.

If your only goals are hypertrophy, you may or may not like it. It was originally designed for high school coaches who insisted weight training would make players "muscle-bound and slow". It is simple b/c of the age group is was designed for....ever try to explain something to a 16-17 yr old? They MUST know better b/c they are younger.....

As written, the program has "beach work" scheduled for friday, usually suggesting pullups/chinups/dips with assorted ab work during the week. It is difficult to pull of tons of PR's on a caloric deficiet, but has been useful in maintaining mass for some. I've been using the training/programming from the 5x5 in my current lifts for almost 2yrs now. Except from a slight belly from dirty bulking, I've gone from ~165-70 to 220+.

 

[Nathan]

That makes sense. I think I'll just make up my own routine then again. I was just noticing how my imagination has seemingly been limited with it as my last few routines have more or less been variations of the same type of thing - though that could be because of my goals. You bring up some good points. Thanks.

 

[Cynical Simian]

The MWF setup with a squat, press, and pull each day and varying intensity/volume is generally a good way to train, but it's by no means the only one (although I wouldn't say adding more days, by itself, would make a program more "advanced). Like s8n mentioned, the cookie-cutter 5x5s popularized by madcow (and the Bill Starr stuff that he/Rippetoe/Pendlay adapted them from) were designed primarily with athletes in mind, but of course volume and progression on the basic lifts are a good way to add mass as well (with proper diet, it should go without saying). That origin also provides another part of the explanation for the setup: 3 days per week with minimal fluff work is a very efficient way to train, leaving time for sport-specific training in the week.

For most of us, non-bodybuilding/weightlifting sport training isn't a concern, so the only things competing with training for our time are "real life" and cardio. Basically, if you have the time and want to do 5 days per week, there's nothing wrong with that. Take a look at some of BiggT's old journals for examples of how to spread the volume on the basic lifts over more days (and add in some Oly lifts if you do those). In fact, if you want to keep the basic MWF squat-press-pull structure and just make the additions you mentioned, that wouldn't be a problem (with the possible exception of hamstring work, since your posterior chain is already getting quite a bit of work from squats, deads and Pendlay rows). Some extra arm/calf/forearm/etc. work on Saturday wouldn't add enough to your total training load to be a problem at all, and you could shift the placement of your other arm work within the week so you're not doing it two days in a row on Friday and Saturday.

 

[Nathan]

Man, I can't decide what to do today. Guys, quick, somebody hook me up with a routine.

 

[Cynical Simian]

Uhh...if you're going to try madcow's 5x5, take the time to do it right by getting some accurate 5RMs and ramping up to them appropriately. In other words, if you're trying to figure out what to do today, my answer is "not the 5x5."

 

[Nathan]

I know my 5 rep maxes though my man. I do heavy squats and deads most weeks as it is. And yeah, I'm off of hte 5x5 - I no longer believe in it to be perfectly honest after reading up on it. It's just not a solid routine for anyone with BBing goals in mind as near as I can tell. It's just simple, easy to understand and has low volume - that's its charm. Great starting point but that's all I've been able to take away from it.