A cycle for those on HRT?

[kinda5150]

well, this is my first post and can relate to this situation. i'm 33 and have been on hrt for about two years. it took me to actually diagnose the f'ing problem though. first doc told me i was depressed and gave me celexa. took that for several months and really didn't feel any better. pretty much gave up on getting help for several months. then i started researching the net for the symptoms i was having and boom there it was--low test.

decided to go try a different doc. told him my symptoms and told him about not responding to the anti-depressant. he said he would do some blood work to rule out any physiological problems. i asked him specifically what would be tested--liver, blood cell counts, yadda yadda. i told him to i wanted my test and estradiol levels checked too. in a very condescending tone he asked why in the world would i need that, to which i informed him that was what my research had concluded as a strong possibility. this attitude coming from a dr who didn't even know what CLA or ALA was!!

the funny part--i get a letter from him about a week later with the lab results showing my test was 197 and note telling me i did in fact have low test. he included a prescription for androgel and told me to come back in four weeks. that's it, didn't explain anything else or any other alternatives. i was more interested in restoring my own levels than going on some lifelong medication. to make a long story longer i sought out an endocrinologist who immediately had more blood work done and a MRI of my head. he wanted to make sure i didn't have a pituitary lesion/tumor. which i didn't. tsh and igf1 levels were also low, albeit the very bottom f'ing number of the "normal" range. get this, this asshole tried to tell me that by taking anti-depressants i could get my levels back in the normal range! wtf?!! if somebody else has heard this, then please enlighten me.
well after leaving that dude too, i finally found a cool ass doc. he lifts and has no problem getting me to the level i want. started me off on test enth 200mg for the first month, then 400 a month--to which i told him i'd rather take the 200 every two weeks. after going back the next month for testing--i still felt like ass--my levels came back lower than when i started-167. on top of that i was having some massive conversion to dht--i assume this because acne was horrendous, hairline crept back even further, grew hair in places it shouldn't, and my beard grew quicker and thicker and grayer then before. this is all after just ten f'ing weeks and 800mg total. he was puzzled as was i. i mean, i knew about the probable dht conversion, but couldn't figure out why my levels would be lower than baseline 14 days after last shot.

he directed me to another endocrinologist--she explained that whole peak/trough business and said i was at the bottom of the trough at 14 days and the peak is like 4 days. either way, i told her i didn't wanna stab myself anymore right now--so i could hord the shit for later--so she wanted me to use testim. i'm thinking great, another damn topical piece of crap. oh, forgot to mention i never got my test level above 290 with the androgel. four weeks after using testim my level was right at 790. ok, so i'm pretty f'ing stoked about this. considering i've been under 200 for who knows how long, this was at least psychologically uplifting. although i still didn't feel any better. at the six week mark i developed some serious skin problems anyplace i applied the stuff. started like little flea or mosquito bites, only they wouldn't stop itching!! i'm thinking great, i finally find something that i know works and i can't even take the shit anymore. so my only remaining alternatives were going back to the shot, patch, or pellet. i don't know about you, but ain't nobody inserting anything around the johnson. shaving my nuts and attaching an adhesive object to them also didn't sound viable. lastly she mentioned the striant--which was mentioned in a previous reply. i'm in my fifth week of it and still don't feel any better. however, a few weeks ago and many complaints of fatigue and decreased energy, the doc put me on adderral (amphetamines). no you can't have any!! there mine, mine i say!! ha ha. these work pretty well but not wonderful. the rebound is aweful and i have to take them every three or four hours. they have an extended release version which i'll probably snag when i go back for my blood work.

damn, i'm sorry for being so long winded to those few of you who actually read it all. i just wanted to put it out there that i've been through the ringer trying to get straightened out and i'm still not all the way there. however, for the first time in a long time i'm starting to feel somewhat normal again.

i actually do have a question--since my thyroid levels are low, would it be wiser to take some t4 or t3 instead of the amphetamine to help with energy levels and actually lose some fat?

thanks for hearing me out guys and i appreciate any help.

 

[Dial_tone]

There are more studies proving AS doesn't affect your prostate than there are concluding it does. Again I say myth. Even LEF literature doesn't support prostate issues as a concern. Liver is silly to worry about with injectables and with Glucorell R your liver cells excellerate their reproduction. You'll be fine.

You should go over to our Bjaarki Library at AnabolicFitness.com and check out some of the AS literature reviews. All the studies in the library are the full studies and not abstracts.

I would if I could figure out how to get to it.

 

[strongsmartsexy]

I would if I could figure out how to get to it.

If you're a member of anabolicfitness.com, just select the message boards, then the anabolics board. At the top in the center you'll see a link to those libraries. TONS of stuff.

 

[Jack Stack]

I,m also new to the Forum and this is my 2nd post and I guess,my first reply to any thread.I also am a HRT man(Depot-Test 100-200mg IM self-injection about every 10-14 days).My levels got down there(about 79ng/dl)when I began therapy 6 mos.ago.What has really caught my attention about this whole 3 page trhead is the fact that I ain,t seen not one person even mention PSA levels or Prostate problems or concerns.Where I live,if you got high PSA or a bit of swell in the P-gland= NO TEST!What,s it like elsewhere?BTW,I live in the Piedmont Triad area of NC.Jack Stack

 

[satchboogie]

politically involved bump

 

[strongsmartsexy]

I,m also new to the Forum and this is my 2nd post and I guess,my first reply to any thread.I also am a HRT man(Depot-Test 100-200mg IM self-injection about every 10-14 days).My levels got down there(about 79ng/dl)when I began therapy 6 mos.ago.What has really caught my attention about this whole 3 page trhead is the fact that I ain,t seen not one person even mention PSA levels or Prostate problems or concerns.Where I live,if you got high PSA or a bit of swell in the P-gland= NO TEST!What,s it like elsewhere?BTW,I live in the Piedmont Triad area of NC.Jack Stack

You'll find PSA levels discussed in other topics ad nausea. I've yet to see a study where levels of testosterone below 600mg/wk caused an elevation in PSA levels which would begin to cause concern. Secondarily, you're likely to find that the real concerns when it comes to prostrate have more to do with excess estrogen than with testosterone. There is still significant debate about this however.

 

[topcat51]

I'm 51 yrs and am currently going to an endo in my area to get prescribed hgh. He is also concerned with my test levels being low and has me on a measly 100mg eow. But thats all good and fine because I went initially for the growth hormone . He will not give me a scipt so I drop by eow for my injection . I also know that this small amount does not even phase me so I supplement with my own 600 mg a week of cyp. I have researched and have found out that I should get off a month before bloodwork to get my test levels back in the range that he will be happy with . I have no prob getting test at rediculously low cost but have to play his game so I can keep my presciption for the humatrope . I did have to go through all of the lab work and do have hypo pituitarism , which anyone over 45 has , and have been prescibed the humatrope . Each time my blood levels are checked I have still been in the low range and he has upped my dosage by 1/2 iu a time . I have been on the humatrope for about 8 months and am currently doing 2iu daily . I have lost about 10 lbs of fat , skin elasticity is much better , feel sharper mentally and hair growth is faster and seems thicker . Not to sure at this point about muscle growth . Everything that I read says that it takes at least 4iu daily to effect muscle growth . Anyway , My endocrinologist says that he will keep me on for life and my insurance pays 90%. I will enjoy the anti-aging benefits from the hgh and I do assure you that it works . Any questions, feel free to ask . Goodluck ! Topcat51

 

[40butpumpin]

hey bro, thanks for posting this. i can't figure why i now get such severe night sweats from deca, i used to love the stuff. is the doc accessible online?

Hello everyone my name is Ulter and I am a steroid user.

I have been using steroids most of the last 20 years. When I was young my testes didn't make enough test. I didn't know this until much later and never gave it much thought. There were upsides like not getting acne in high school, but there were down sides like not growing facial hair, having a normal sex drive, or being able to hold more than 140 pounds on my 6 foot frame. In my mid 20's I discovered steroids. They changed everything. By 31 I was 255 pounds and screwed everything in my path.
Fast forward to July 4, 2000. I am 44 and discovered Dr Scruggs. What a great doctor. He would write me a script for 200mg/wk of test and 200mg/wk of deca and gh and oxandrolone and my insurance paid for it all. I was on my first cycle with him about 6 weeks when I asked him, "when do I have to come off". He said, "why do you want to come off?". Well, I didn't have an answer for that. So I stayed on. In my research I learned that, as was mentioned here, researchers were now using up to 600mg/wk of test to measure it's effects. The U of Iowa was using 500mg/wk. After looking at the Shandi and several other reviews of steroids literature I learned that the use of test at 500mg/wk was not dangerous at all. In fact there was no evidence that there was any linear decline in health from 100mg/wk to 600mg/wk. NONE. So I called Dr Scruggs and we talked about it for about an hour. In his 20 years of giving out test/deca to body builders he had found that there was no decline in the health of his patients even after many years of 300mg/wk test and 300mg/wk of deca. Well that was enough for me.

Right now and for the last 3 years I have used 400-500mg/wk of test and 300-400mg of deca. My blood work is clear and my echostress shows the heart of a track star. The cardiologist tells me I am his healthiest patient.
When I want to cycle, which is about 5 times a year for 6 weeks, sometimes 8, I will adjust the doses according to what I want to do with my body at the time and then just go back to me 500/400 dose when I am done.
I should add here that I use the deca because when I don't I can't even put my coat on by myself without great pain in my shoulders that have been scoped twice to no avail. And for those of you who wonder about sterility. That’s a myth. My sperm count is excellent.

My current cycle is to add size I lost last year when I couldn’t train due to a metal plate/bone fusion in my neck. Where it meets my traps. I guess I herniated it over the years setting the bar back there for squats.
Anyways, I added NPP at 800mg, dropped the deca and rose the test to 800mg. THIS is working very well for me now that I added the ISO AGB we sell as a my protein supplement. I had always used food for protein. I am only about 10-15 pounds away from my target of 230 and my legs suck not doing squats anymore.
I will finish this cycle and go back to my 500/400 routine in about 3 weeks from now.

That’s my story and I’m sticking to it.

 

[JKurz1]

DId any on you experience very low ejaculation, lack of sesation, etc. before HRT? ANy of you guys under 30 years old? How is your fertility?

 

[Jack Stack]

It never ceases to amaze me how the Docs around here where I live(Piedmont Area of North Carolina)can stay so far behind the times.I been keepin up with the replies to this thread and can,t believe the doses of Test and other stuff some of you guys get from your Docs!I got checked in Dec.,2003 and the report showed my Test levels at 79 ng/dl.My conservative doc put me on Depot inj. at 100mg etw,so in 6 mos.,I went back in,this time it was 180ng/dl so she raised it to 150mg etw!What is the deal?Jack Stack