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21 yo bulking - jaw surgery

dh92

New member
Hi, guys.

I am going to undergo orthognathic surgery in about 5 months' time. My lower jaw is being advanced to fix my underbite. I have been training steadily since November 2011 and have increased my weight from 50 kilos to 65 kilos.

Age: 21
Height: 1,73m
Body fat percentage: 8%
Training schedule: 5 days a week, usually 2 hours a day split up

My diet hasn't always been 100% under control. For the past couple of months, however, it's been my main focus and I can safely say that it's under control now. I usually start off with 6 egg whites, 1 egg yolk. Then 3 to 4 additional meals: 200 grams of lean protein each, brown rice or sweet potatoes on the side, 1 slice of pineapple. Add to that, usually 2 to 3 mass building protein shakes inbetween meals.

When I have orthognathic surgery, I only have to follow a soft foods diet. Apparently I will only lose 1 kg max. But I still want to bulk up.

Because I'm hesitant of steroids at my age (took steroids for 1 week when I was 20 and then stopped), my personal trainer (and steroid supplier) recommended HGH - I asked him which way I could gain muscle mass safely, in small amounts (I would love to gain muscle mass, but I don't want to gain THAT much; the balloon animal look isn't for me) and not lose it. I wanted to try IGF or MGF because only certain muscle groups need additional size (chest, arms), but he said no, HGH, is the way to go.

Since then, I have developed a greater desire to bulk up. So, I adjusted my limits. I asked him for advice on 1 mass bulking cycle. His recommendation: Primobolan, Equipoise (+ maybe Test?).

Will HGH/anabolic steroids have a negative effect on the outcome of orthognathic surgery? Is it too risky? HGH increases jaw size and I don't want to screw around with my jaw anymore than I have to.
Is my diet as perfect as I would want to believe it is?
Is it at all a good idea to run a mass bulking cycle before orthognathic surgery?
The idea of just running 1 'ol cycle and then never taking steroids again is make believe bullshit, right?
HGH versus anabolic steroids? 1 or the other?
Should I just stay away from everything instead?

I am about to go on a raw vegan diet. What influence would that have on my natural training/training on juice?

I sometimes just feel as if I want to go on one cycle and swell and have a normal guy's size and then that would be it. I don't know whether or not the cycle should take place before or after the orthognathic surgery.

I welcome all advice.
 
65 kilos and you're about to go on a raw vegan diet to bulk haha jesus christ my man. First off, I think you're way too small and could easily bulk without any drugs or even natural supplements. If you want to bulk you have to eat regardless of any drug you may take so at this point I would advise a revamped diet and keep your training up. As far as the theory of 1 cycle and stopping, yeah it's possible but after seeing the results many are hooked but it's a personal decision whether to do it again or not. To be honest I would give you some bulking diet tips but wouldn't even know what to suggest for a raw vegan diet, could you even eat quinoa? Nuts are good but that's about all I know to recommend without doing more research haha why raw vegan bro?
 
65 kilos and you're about to go on a raw vegan diet to bulk haha jesus christ my man. First off, I think you're way too small and could easily bulk without any drugs or even natural supplements. If you want to bulk you have to eat regardless of any drug you may take so at this point I would advise a revamped diet and keep your training up. As far as the theory of 1 cycle and stopping, yeah it's possible but after seeing the results many are hooked but it's a personal decision whether to do it again or not. To be honest I would give you some bulking diet tips but wouldn't even know what to suggest for a raw vegan diet, could you even eat quinoa? Nuts are good but that's about all I know to recommend without doing more research haha why raw vegan bro?

Hi, man. Thanks for the reply.

I am not considering a raw vegan diet in order to help with bulking. I am simply considering a raw vegan diet for health reasons. Raw vegan diet wouldn't be ideal for bulking, obviously. I haven't thought of raw vegan diet + way to bulk up yet.

At 65 kilos, I am small. You're right. Perhaps that's why I am so interested in taking up gear. The typical psychology: small guy wanting to be big. At 65 kilos I look tiny in comparison to other 65 kg guys.

Please give any diet tips you have (doesn't have to be raw vegan at all)....
 
When I started high school I was about your size, by the time I hit junior year 2 years later I was 225+. I would drink almost gallon of whole milk a day, size up 1000 mass gainer drinks, but never use a supplement as a meal replacement, only to add to your already 6+ meal a day diet. Frozen pizzas a couple times a week haha seriously look at the nutrition facts on a frozen pizza it's a mass gainers dream. Tuna with mayo, chicken breasts with mayo, turkey with mayo haha you need the calories and if you train hard you'll earn the right to eat like a pig, and at your size you truly need to anyway. Several egg omelettes with cheese, toast/bagel, maybe some oatmeal or quinoa and a meat for breakfast. Have a can of tuna a couple hours later. Fry up some chicken breasts or fish for lunch with some rice and mixed veggies. Maybe a protein shake or mass gainer a couple hours later. A cheeseburger or some kind of ground beef for dinner, maybe a steak and again with some veggies and a sweet potato or regular potato. A couple hours later repeat one of the meals or make something else you like, again you don't have to count calories to bulk, you just have to EAT! Frozen fruit smoothies with greek yogurt and a lil milk. I also whip up some protein powder in my plain greek yogurt and make a chocolate pudding.
 
When I started high school I was about your size, by the time I hit junior year 2 years later I was 225+. I would drink almost gallon of whole milk a day, size up 1000 mass gainer drinks, but never use a supplement as a meal replacement, only to add to your already 6+ meal a day diet. Frozen pizzas a couple times a week haha seriously look at the nutrition facts on a frozen pizza it's a mass gainers dream. Tuna with mayo, chicken breasts with mayo, turkey with mayo haha you need the calories and if you train hard you'll earn the right to eat like a pig, and at your size you truly need to anyway. Several egg omelettes with cheese, toast/bagel, maybe some oatmeal or quinoa and a meat for breakfast. Have a can of tuna a couple hours later. Fry up some chicken breasts or fish for lunch with some rice and mixed veggies. Maybe a protein shake or mass gainer a couple hours later. A cheeseburger or some kind of ground beef for dinner, maybe a steak and again with some veggies and a sweet potato or regular potato. A couple hours later repeat one of the meals or make something else you like, again you don't have to count calories to bulk, you just have to EAT! Frozen fruit smoothies with greek yogurt and a lil milk. I also whip up some protein powder in my plain greek yogurt and make a chocolate pudding.

No offence, but I can tell why you bulked. The food you chowed down on would not exactly count as healthy. I am interested in eating an extremely clean diet. No mayo, no burgers, no pizzas, no dairy, no bread. I would only eat some of your suggested meals as a cheat meal once or twice a week.
 
No offence, but I can tell why you bulked. The food you chowed down on would not exactly count as healthy. I am interested in eating an extremely clean diet. No mayo, no burgers, no pizzas, no dairy, no bread. I would only eat some of your suggested meals as a cheat meal once or twice a week.

You really think bodybuilders got big by eating chicken and rice 7 times a day everyday.. no you need a reality check. If you can't gain mass with out steroids then you won't keep the mass you do gain on cycle. Simple as that

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You really think bodybuilders got big by eating chicken and rice 7 times a day everyday.. no you need a reality check. If you can't gain mass with out steroids then you won't keep the mass you do gain on cycle. Simple as that

Sent from my GT-N7100 using EliteFitness

Perhaps I need somewhat of a reality check, but so do some bodybuilders then. I don't consider gaining "mass" from eating 50% healthy and 50% garbage at all times as something to be proud of. In essence, you swell because you're getting fat. Then years later, you do cutting cycles to get rid of that fat. In REALITY, you could have stayed lean and gradually increased your muscle mass, but NO. We are both looking for quick fixes, our definitions of a "good" quick fix differ, that's all.
 
Perhaps I need somewhat of a reality check, but so do some bodybuilders then. I don't consider gaining "mass" from eating 50% healthy and 50% garbage at all times as something to be proud of. In essence, you swell because you're getting fat. Then years later, you do cutting cycles to get rid of that fat. In REALITY, you could have stayed lean and gradually increased your muscle mass, but NO. We are both looking for quick fixes, our definitions of a "good" quick fix differ, that's all.

I have never in my life been over 12%. I don't eat super clean but I enjoy my food.. I'll eat fast food and fried chicken and drink coke and use sauces on my food.. Nobody would ever call me fat. I started lifting at 137lbs. I gained 30 lbs in my 1st year from eating everything in sight and training like a mad man.. my bf increased maybe 2% so it's not like you will will suddenly become 18% Bf.

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I have never in my life been over 12%. I don't eat super clean but I enjoy my food.. I'll eat fast food and fried chicken and drink coke and use sauces on my food.. Nobody would ever call me fat. I started lifting at 137lbs. I gained 30 lbs in my 1st year from eating everything in sight and training like a mad man.. my bf increased maybe 2% so it's not like you will will suddenly become 18% Bf.

Sent from my GT-N7100 using EliteFitness

My body fat percentage has always been between 8% and 10% and I am way too careful to tolerate any number beyond that. I can eat fast food, fried chicken and I know people won't call me fat either. The problem is, my first year of training I also didn't care about a healthy diet, I ate everything and I gained a lot of weight. Some of it muscle, some of it fat. But suddenly I had the face of a chipmunk and a good body. Since then, I've been training harder, eating cleaner and gaining less. But I have a skinny face again, thank God. I want to know, taking into account that gear isn't an option, how do I make clean eating synonymous with good bulking. How can I do both at the same time?
 
My body fat percentage has always been between 8% and 10% and I am way too careful to tolerate any number beyond that. I can eat fast food, fried chicken and I know people won't call me fat either. The problem is, my first year of training I also didn't care about a healthy diet, I ate everything and I gained a lot of weight. Some of it muscle, some of it fat. But suddenly I had the face of a chipmunk and a good body. Since then, I've been training harder, eating cleaner and gaining less. But I have a skinny face again, thank God. I want to know, taking into account that gear isn't an option, how do I make clean eating synonymous with good bulking. How can I do both at the same time?

Clean eating and good bulking don't really go hand in hand.. A lean bulk is a very slow steady process. That's why so many people will bulk for 6 months and cut for 6 month (guys that aren't on gear). Have you ever tried to eat 4000cals of very clean food. It's a hell of a lot of food

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