1ST CYCLE-Which theory do you...?

[stalker]

Simlpe stack is best in my opinion. Use test and add some dbol first 3-4 weeks if you're using a mixed ester one like omna, sust, etc.

I think the "first cycle is best" is a little bit misleading. Of course it is "best". It's when you are the furthest from your body's maximum size. But it's just a matter of how fast you want to get to your goal. My first four cycles were 2 week cycles. I gained 20 pounds total from them. My fifth was my first long one (375mg omna, 30mg dbol/day) and I gained just under 20 pounds from that one as well. I got to where I want to be, and while it took somewhat longer, I saved both money (less gear) and side effects.

I feel if you start with the entire bag, where do you have to go? Using 2 grams of test and GH for next cycle? Then what? Only use what you need to grow, otherwise you are wasting money and exposing yourself to side effects needlessly. Once you plateau, then you step it up another notch.

Besides, the old timers had fucking great bodies, and many of them used dosages that would be considered very small by today's standards.

 

[FOZY]

I siagree with time on = time off....You could really skrew your HPTA with that equation...( not everyone but I would have) I say time on and then blood work determines time off..

 

[THE PROTOTYPE2000]

Do you consider Omna@500mgs for 10 weeks,EQ@400mgs for 10 weeks,and D-bol@ 30mgs a day for the 1st 4 weeks alot for a first cycle? Mind you,I do weigh 250-255 pounds already.-THE PROTOTYPE

 

[THE PROTOTYPE2000]

Anyone there?

 

[THE PROTOTYPE2000]

Last call!!!

 

[Horny]

Do you consider Omna@500mgs for 10 weeks,EQ@400mgs for 10 weeks,and D-bol@ 30mgs a day for the 1st 4 weeks alot for a first cycle? Mind you,I do weigh 250-255 pounds already.-THE PROTOTYPE

substitue enanthate for omna and I would go only 8 weeks if it is your first cycle and don't go higher than what you have here even if you are tempted and curious.

You realize all the drugs in this stack aromatise? You will need antiestrogens.

If you take the omna you wil have problems timing the clomid therapy correctly.

 

[gtaman]

For the majority (95%) of us, it is not desireable psychologically to "blow up" 40 lbs. on a first cycle or to be introduced to anabolic steroids with a very harsh regimen which may actually have a surprisingly big impact on your body image, interactions with others, etc. And 40 fast lbs. may evaporate fast, causing more psychological confusion.

Just look at that really big juiced up looking guy at your gym, the one who is maybe not naturally a big guy but now is at 5'9" 240 or something. Now ask yourself if you're really sure you want to be that guy. Take a gram on your first cycle, and you'll be getting closer to that guy than maybe you realized, and maybe closer than you wanted if you were being honest about it. The people around you will react to the difference. It is far easier to shrug off / explain 20 lbs. than 40.

So, if in doubt, go with less and take care of your diet, training, and rest.

The other side of it is, you just might not be ready to train hard enough and eat enough calories to justify 750 mg. a week of sus. So it could be wasted gear and the same gains could be achieved on 250 mg sus stacked with something like deca or dbol (or both).

Why not try 250 mg/ wk sus, 200-300 mg/wk EQ, and 25 mg of dbol a day for only the first 4 wks.? You should get 15 permanent pounds off that.

If you should decide later you want to be huger, nothing is stopping you from going on another cycle and upping the dosages then when your body is more accustomed to the weight.

 

[1911]

Re:

I posted this on AF a while back - FWIW re: first cycle strategy:

I found myself in a somewhat similar situation determining the appropriate cycle that would meet my objectives. I need to minimize rapid, excessive gains (career issue) and allow for manageable sides while still meeting my goals for growth. After much research I decided upon Sustanon, Primo and Arimidex. I am not suggesting this is right for you, only you can make that decision.

My logic (in general):

1. Objective: ~15-20 lbs. of retainable LBM in the end.

2. Cycle length: I wanted ~90 days in duration (discounting Primo self-taper).

3. I decided to administer Sustanon every 4th day to leverage the prop but yet extend the test a little longer than the traditional 8-weeks (1 amp every 4th day, 16 amps total = 437mgs Sustanon per 7-day week).

4. I wanted to use an anabolic during the mid-point (@200mgs. week) to slowly build blood levels then hit the anabolic heavier (Primo @400mgs) at the end and run it 3 weeks past the Sustanon to solidify (20 amps total).

5. I decided to maintain moderate doses and never exceed 2ml/2cc per injection. I have set my cycle up to meet this objective.

6. I did not want to fight possible gyno on two fronts, hence my choice of Primo over Deca for the anabolic (I did not want to use EQ, you may).

7. My administration schedule limits injections to a total of 22 (not bad re: scar tissue).

8. No bloat, no tits (a must for me). The obvious choice, Arimidex at .5mg EOD well past the last test injection. Clomid therapy is a given.

Cons:

1. Vets will (rightfully so) discourage Sustanon and suggest Enanth. I did not because I wanted to do “a Test” and all my research indicated Sustanon was a proper choice for a first cycle (certainly debatable). Regarding the cost of Sustanon vs. enanth, that was a non-issue for me.

2. Possibility of sides with Test/Primo - all the obvious and documented stuff.

3. Cost - Sustanon, Primo, Arimidex and "every-fucking-thing else." My cycle is/was not cheap. But...this is an investment and I wanted my experience to be a quality one. I did not allow the cost to skew my judgment or affect my decisions re: objectives, health, etc.

Later,

 

[stalker]

Prototype:

If it's not a big hassle, get blood work done beforehand. Test levels can vary naturally from 200-1,000, and I was at the low end (I'm a real hardgainer) so I don't need much to get my body going. If you are already a big guy, and you have naturally high levels, then the stack you mention is probably just about right. Keep us informed of how it goes. And a big bump for the guys who mention Arimidex!

 

[mranderson]

sust250 or omnadren250
500mg first 2 weeks
250mg evrey 5 days
after that for 8 weeks
during week 2 start winny50mg EOD
Nolv 10mg a day through out cycle
10 day after last test inject start 100mg
a day of comid for 7 days, then 50mg a day for
7 days, also throw in some milk thistle, cranberry
extract and some ALA do detox your live post cycle.
awwwesome first cycle, remember this is totaly new
to you body, your boby will eat this shit up your first cycle, no reason to do big amounts.