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restrictions on who is allowed to procreate

nimbus

nimbus

New member
yay or nay? we can prob never ban having kids but i can see one day restricting who is allowed to be a full-fledged citizen and receive all the benefits from the government

I think that's the way we're headed; too many useless peeps to take care of and the ratio of productive to non-productive is probably shrinking.

if yes how would you set the restrictions? Can't have been on welfare for the last year? Income determines how many you're allowed to have? Incorporate criminal record into the screening process? Evidence of stable fam? Mental and physical health assessments?
 
Don't restrict procreation. Restrict making other people pay for them. Problem solved!

Not exactly true... problem reduced is a more accurate description.
 
mrplunkey said:
Don't restrict procreation. Restrict making other people pay for them. Problem solved!

Not exactly true... problem reduced is a more accurate description.
Click to expand...


so do you suggest different classes of citizenship? where some people get access to tax-funded infrastructure, facilities, welfare, and healthcare - and others don't?


i dunno if you can just say "don't make other people pay" because i don't think a society where EVERYTHING is privatized would function too well; it seems like you have to find a way to reduce access to services funded by tax money instead
 
also i'd rather stop people from being born in the first place than having them die in the streets or prison because they couldn't take care of themselves and didn't have anybody or the government to help
 
nimbus said:
so do you suggest different classes of citizenship? where some people get access to tax-funded infrastructure, facilities, welfare, and healthcare - and others don't?


i dunno if you can just say "don't make other people pay" because i don't think a society where EVERYTHING is privatized would function too well; it seems like you have to find a way to reduce access to services funded by tax money instead
Click to expand...

I'm not talking about anarchy. We just need to remove any and all incentives to have more children in terms of government payouts.

If someone can't support their children, there should be private organizations that place kids into new homes and monitor their welfare. Those organizations could receive public support, but they can't be typical government bureaucracies.
 
nimbus said:
yay or nay? we can prob never ban having kids but i can see one day restricting who is allowed to be a full-fledged citizen and receive all the benefits from the government

I think that's the way we're headed; too many useless peeps to take care of and the ratio of productive to non-productive is probably shrinking.

if yes how would you set the restrictions? Can't have been on welfare for the last year? Income determines how many you're allowed to have? Incorporate criminal record into the screening process? Evidence of stable fam? Mental and physical health assessments?
Click to expand...


this worked so well in china
the pseudo-restriction part that is
 
What would happen if you accidently had a child outside of these restrictions? Forced abortions? No thx

I was thinking China too, huge fail
 
cindylou said:
The idea is good, I belong to a women's forum for support for new families and so many women are there are trying to conceive with NO money and NO health insurance...nothing. Some of them using fertility treatments such as clomid etc. They finally conceieve and are so overwhelmed. I don't understand why people do that to themselves. People are so self destructive.
Click to expand...

yes...and unfortunately, the lives that really get wrecked are the rugrats...poor little bastards don't stand a chance :(
 
The idea is good, I belong to a women's forum for support for new families and so many women are there are trying to conceive with NO money and NO health insurance...nothing. Some of them using fertility treatments such as clomid etc. They finally conceive and are so overwhelmed. I don't understand why people do that to themselves. People are so self destructive.
 
I vote we cut Nimbus' balls off right now, problem solved..... Oh snap nevermind he ain't getting no poosie anyways, my bad. In for killing the first, second and third born of people with no jobs.
 
Anybody ever see the movie Idiocracy? Yeah, I see that as the future. You got high income, high powered A+ personality couples pulling in six figures having ONE kid, then dipshits like the Duggars having 19 or that stupid cow that gave birth to eight.

Let the Bible thumpers have their way and we'll be headed the route of eating our dead and it'll happen way sooner than we can figure out how to get off this planet.

The truth of the matter is the whole planet (America included) should be shooting for ZERO population growth, and ideally, population decline. We need to cut a couple billion.
 
musclemom said:
Anybody ever see the movie Idiocracy? Yeah, I see that as the future. You got high income, high powered A+ personality couples pulling in six figures having ONE kid, then dipshits like the Duggars having 19 or that stupid cow that gave birth to eight.

Let the Bible thumpers have their way and we'll be headed the route of eating our dead and it'll happen way sooner than we can figure out how to get off this planet.

The truth of the matter is the whole planet (America included) should be shooting for ZERO population growth, and ideally, population decline. We need to cut a couple billion.
Click to expand...

If somebody thumps my bible they get kicked in the nuts. And possibly siccors kicked in the head.
 
digimon7068 said:
yes...and unfortunately, the lives that really get wrecked are the rugrats...poor little bastards don't stand a chance :(
Click to expand...

I know. I understand that accidents happen...but WTF is up with people TRYING :confused: Unmarried women with no jobs on state insurance going on clomid...WTF. I would consider it to be a blessing if I was poor and wasn't ovulating.
 
so for those of you who believe in some sort of government control over the process, do you think it should only be done on the basis of finances? or should something else be looked at in addition, like aptitude or the circumstances of why they are in poor financial shape?
 
cindylou said:
I know. I understand that accidents happen...but WTF is up with people TRYING :confused: Unmarried women with no jobs on state insurance going on clomid...WTF. I would consider it to be a blessing if I was poor and wasn't ovulating.
Click to expand...

This happens do to a lot of crap in society that puts the idea/burden in women that their life is pretty much worthless without children, that they are here to have children, that it is a blessing each and every woman should experience.... to which I personally say FUCK THAT.... but many fall into the "my biological clock is ticking" "I'm not a spring chicken anymore" and all that crap and nonsense....
 
If you want to fix humanity it's best you start snipping the Strongbows of the world and freezing my sperm.
 
$10,000 to any male that wants a vasectomy..

in one generation crime will be down by 50%

unemployment will be below 3%

and poverty will be gone..
 
musclemom said:
Anybody ever see the movie Idiocracy? Yeah, I see that as the future. You got high income, high powered A+ personality couples pulling in six figures having ONE kid, then dipshits like the Duggars having 19 or that stupid cow that gave birth to eight.

Let the Bible thumpers have their way and we'll be headed the route of eating our dead and it'll happen way sooner than we can figure out how to get off this planet.

The truth of the matter is the whole planet (America included) should be shooting for ZERO population growth, and ideally, population decline. We need to cut a couple billion.
Click to expand...

Here's the interesting question: if high income, high powered A+ personality couples wanted to have 8 kids, should we condone it?
 
cindylou said:
The idea is good, I belong to a women's forum for support for new families and so many women are there are trying to conceive with NO money and NO health insurance...nothing. Some of them using fertility treatments such as clomid etc. They finally conceive and are so overwhelmed. I don't understand why people do that to themselves. People are so self destructive.
Click to expand...
I read somewhere that men and women need to feel important, but they do it in different ways,

Women have kids.
 
nimbus said:
if yes how would you set the restrictions? Can't have been on welfare for the last year? Income determines how many you're allowed to have? Incorporate criminal record into the screening process? Evidence of stable fam? Mental and physical health assessments?
Click to expand...

would never work, who are you or anyone to put limitations on who has the right to have kids. procedures and assessments can not determine good parents. the people of this country fought for freedom for waaaay too long, are still fighting for rights. this violates the basic rights to life, liberty and happiness promised to everyone. cant see these prejudices/discrimination coming to pass in the US.
 
*ebony* said:
would never work, who are you or anyone to put limitations on who has the right to have kids. procedures and assessments can not determine good parents. the people of this country fought for freedom for waaaay too long, are still fighting for rights. this violates the basic rights to life, liberty and happiness promised to everyone. cant see these prejudices/discrimination coming to pass in the US.
Click to expand...


not really interested in whether or not it can pass; i'm just trying to weigh the pros and cons to decide whether or not it would benefit society
 
nimbus said:
not really interested in whether or not it can pass; i'm just trying to weigh the pros and cons to decide whether or not it would benefit society
Click to expand...

the problems it will create will far outweigh any perceived pros. its better to go by historical results than intentions/theories. the exercise of increased government oppression doesn't usually work out too well. People today got a humongous taste of freedom, imposing such restriction will cause massive uproar, especially with a society with such high individualist values.

like i said your first problem is how to develop guidelines/rules to use for such a restriction process. How can one construct a test that will not exclude the majority of Americans? being a democracy and all, you gotta at least get most of the people on your side to keep some peace. only middle class rich? cerntian intelligence level perhaps? race? idk, what is considered burdensome on society? what will happen to social stratification after such eliminations?

good parent and kids can not be pre-determined. allow on seemingly "outstanding and financially stable citizen" of society to procreate and produce the same? this will relieve economic financial burdens caused by poor people's kids?no
 
PuddleMonkey said:
Where's my right to opt out of paying for everyone else kids? Especially those who are already on the system and continue to have more children.
Click to expand...
it's a valid point and i don't neccessarily disagree with it, but your taxes pay for the upkeep of roads whether or not you have a license or a vehicle. you'll always be taxed the same regardless of the need. if we take away those tax dollars that are used to fund welfare babies, that money isn't going to go back into our pockets, the government will just find another place to sink it. especially when you figure a lot of states (and our country as a whole) are running defecits.
 
redshirt27se said:
it's a valid point and i don't neccessarily disagree with it, but your taxes pay for the upkeep of roads whether or not you have a license or a vehicle. you'll always be taxed the same regardless of the need. if we take away those tax dollars that are used to fund welfare babies, that money isn't going to go back into our pockets, the government will just find another place to sink it. especially when you figure a lot of states (and our country as a whole) are running defecits.
Click to expand...

the idea is that the government will start finding places to sink tax money that are more productive and beneficial than simply keeping deadbeats alive. For example, our nation's infrastructure, which is lagging behind that of a lot of countries now. Also, subsidized health care and welfare would be a lot more successful with less people draining the system and more people contributing to it
 
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