why pct?

[cadey]

i was thinking. why do we even bother with pct? why not just stay on forever if you intened on doing loads of cycles okay if you intend to do 1 cycle then fair enough pct and recover. but what confuses me is people who cycle do a proper pct and recover then only to hop back on cycle to shut them selves down again.its like crashing your car getting it fixed then purposely crashing it again. i mean if any of us actualy valued our testicles we wouldnt do steds in the first place. just a rant really.........

 

[LftHndPwrHouse]

I hate my testicals...they get in the way when doing heavy squats!!

 

[gyle]

Well long-term AAS use could sut you down for good n' leave ya steril wit peanut sized BOYS for life. Some people want kids, big BOYS, etc...

 

[Nelson Montana]

i was thinking. why do we even bother with PCT - post cycle therapy - - post cycle therapy - ? why not just stay on forever if you intened on doing loads of cycles okay if you intend to do 1 cycle then fair enough PCT - post cycle therapy - and recover. but what confuses me is people who cycle do a proper PCT - post cycle therapy - and recover then only to hop back on cycle to shut them selves down again.its like crashing your car getting it fixed then purposely crashing it again. i mean if any of us actualy valued our testicles we wouldnt do steds in the first place. just a rant really.........

I actually agree.

However, even while on, I think it's a good idea to keep as much natural T flowing as possible -- something that's curiously neglected.

 

[cadey]

I actually agree.

However, even while on, I think it's a good idea to keep as much natural T flowing as possible -- something that's curiously neglected.

yes but usimg hcg for peolonged periods shuts down the bodys own production of hcg so when you do come off the hcg your body may not be making any. so its like a viscious circle.

 

[702daswoll1]

Good thread..Good points all around. Im about 2/3's of the way through a 20 weeker and Im already thinking why quit. PCT blows but I do it anyway.

 

[ukkared]

I was having the same questions. The pro's rarely go off if they do at all. I wonder if pct will turn out to be just "the way we did it" type of thing like pyramiding has become, we all know better know.

 

[cadey]

after my last cycle which ended in jan now ive recovered what was the point in me stoping cus as soon as i get back im jus gona be shut down again in a few weeks.( i do want children) the whole shut down thing is why im hesitating getting back on as i have loads of gear ready to go.

 

[cadey]

Well long-term anabolic androgenic steroids use could sut you down for good n' leave ya steril wit peanut sized BOYS for life. Some people want kids, big BOYS, etc...

so why take gear in the first place? we all know the risks. To me having children is more important than being jacked.

 

[sshadoww]

I hate my testicals...they get in the way when doing heavy squats!!

Rotflmao!

 

[Nelson Montana]

yes but usimg HCG - human chorionic gonadotropin - for peolonged periods shuts down the bodys own production of HCG - human chorionic gonadotropin - so when you do come off the HCG - human chorionic gonadotropin - your body may not be making any. so its like a viscious circle.

Who said anything about HCG???

 

[cadey]

Who said anything about HCG - human chorionic gonadotropin - ???

o.k you didnt but i assumed thats what you were talking about. so what do you use to keep natural test flowing while on?

 

[NickyE3]

o.k you didnt but i assumed thats what you were talking about. so what do you use to keep natural test flowing while on?

^^^

 

[5x10]

IMO, long term use without getting off opens yourself up to some sides cycling doesnt

 

[Nelson Montana]

o.k you didnt but i assumed thats what you were talking about. so what do you use to keep natural test flowing while on?

Lots of things

1: Don't go too long.

After approx 6 weeks supression increases exponentially. Although some people feel this is when gains seem to kick in, others find that's when gains seem to taper off.

2: Don't use overly suppressive compounds.

Deca and tren are the biggest culprits.

3: Keep estrogen at bay.

But not too much! Why wait till the cycle is over? Use anti e's or a SERM (though I'm not a big fan of them) DURING the cycle. Also, supplement your fav anti e with a natty anti e.

4: HC G?

After a month, it isn;t a bad idea to give the boys a little boost. Once again, most guys go way overboard. 500 i.u.s for 2 days every month is enough.

5: Lower S H B G

No suprise here. Of course this can be done with proviron, winniee and to a degree avar, but it's best to do it naturally so there's no further suppression. That's where UNLEASHED comes in. It keeps natural T active while the HPTA is supressed. Remember, supressed doesn't mean SHUT DOWN. You're still producing some. Why not make the most of it?

6: Eat right.

The foods most favorable to the development of testosterone are eggs, red meat, and interestingly garlic, which may have an effect on keeping androgen repetors active.


Also...


7: Sleep

Increases T and GH

8: Squat

The same

9 Avoid cardio

Cardio decreases T.

And just to make it an even 10, I'd say maintain an active sex life.


There ya go. Do it.

 

[cadey]

good post nelson but the only one of them id have trouble with would be 7. when im on have trouble sleeping especially test. never used tren tho. thanks for all the input

 

[hyp1]

Good thread..Good points all around. Im about 2/3's of the way through a 20 weeker and Im already thinking why quit. PCT - post cycle therapy - blows but I do it anyway.

I'm precisely in the same fucking boat,bro
I'm loving the cycle that I'm on and don't want it to end............but I suppose its something that must happen

I'm going to run it about another month and a half then run my PCT then take a long break.......only to come back later do it all over again

 

[krbn08]

i was thinking. why do we even bother with PCT - post cycle therapy - - post cycle therapy - ? why not just stay on forever if you intened on doing loads of cycles okay if you intend to do 1 cycle then fair enough PCT - post cycle therapy - and recover. but what confuses me is people who cycle do a proper PCT - post cycle therapy - and recover then only to hop back on cycle to shut them selves down again.its like crashing your car getting it fixed then purposely crashing it again. i mean if any of us actualy valued our testicles we wouldnt do steds in the first place. just a rant really.........

I don't think that staying on steroids for prolonged periods of time is safe.

Really think about the drawbacks and hazards associated with that..

 

[hyp1]

I don't think that staying on steroids for prolonged periods of time is safe.

Really think about the drawbacks and hazards associated with that..

literally thousands of hormone replacement therapy clients would argue about that and they remain on cycle for years,they're not dropping dead left and right by any means.

I think the dangers of androgen use have been hyped out by the media to the extent of being absurd...are there dangers?quite possibly,but not to the fucking extent they want you to think.

 

[cadey]

I don't think that staying on steroids for prolonged periods of time is safe.

Really think about the drawbacks and hazards associated with that..

im my eyes bro nothing is safe i mean i could walk out my house and get hit by a truck. i understand staying on has more sides than cycling. the sides start to hit me really bad after about 10 weeks. but why do we go to all the hassle of pct jus to shut down again. like i said its like crashing your car,getting it repaired then purposely crashing it again.

 

[r1]

literally thousands of hormone replacement therapy clients would argue about that and they remain on cycle for years,they're not dropping dead left and right by any means.

I think the dangers of androgen use have been hyped out by the media to the extent of being absurd...are there dangers?quite possibly,but not to the fucking extent they want you to think.

Yep, but the difference is that HRT guys (like me) are taking SMALL doses of stuff and keeping levels within physiological range.

There is a big difference between 100mg/week of Test for life and 500mg/week. Above HRT doses, long term control of Estrogen and related sides becomes a serious problem for a lot of guys. That, your lipid profiles getting wrecked, keeping DHT in check, etc. Sometimes I am amazed that guys can get away with the stuff that they take, but I have to remember that it's only ~12 weeks at a time. You can abuse the shit out of your body and it will generally always recover and the sides are bearable for that period of time. When you're talking about day in and day out for the rest of your life, it's a different game.

I'm sure Nelson will chime in and attest to the fact that going from 100mg/week to 200mg/week of Test presents more challenges (particularly E2 control) that are just a pain in the ass to deal with.

R1

 

[5x10]

literally thousands of hormone replacement therapy clients would argue about that and they remain on cycle for years,they're not dropping dead left and right by any means.

I think the dangers of androgen use have been hyped out by the media to the extent of being absurd...are there dangers?quite possibly,but not to the fucking extent they want you to think.

you honestly dont think long term use opens you to more side effects?
i use juice so im not on the media bandwagon but i do think that abuse of any drug isnt a good thing

 

[Nelson Montana]

Yep, but the difference is that HRT guys (like me) are taking SMALL doses of stuff and keeping levels within physiological range.

There is a big difference between 100mg/week of Test for life and 500mg/week. Above HRT doses, long term control of Estrogen and related sides becomes a serious problem for a lot of guys. That, your lipid profiles getting wrecked, keeping dihydrotestosterone in check, etc. Sometimes I am amazed that guys can get away with the stuff that they take, but I have to remember that it's only ~12 weeks at a time. You can abuse the shit out of your body and it will generally always recover and the sides are bearable for that period of time. When you're talking about day in and day out for the rest of your life, it's a different game.

I'm sure Nelson will chime in and attest to the fact that going from 100mg/week to 200mg/week of Test presents more challenges (particularly E2 control) that are just a pain in the ass to deal with.

R1

Agreed. 100 mgs of test will provide and extra (approx) 500 ngs of circulating T. So for a guy with a natural output of let's say 300 ngs, that puts him in the high healthy range of 800. Now, take 200 mgs and that will increase your circulating T to over 1000, which is not anywhere near where nature intended it. PLUS, you wind up supressing more of your endogenous T and the impotance of that balance is still largly unknown.

It would behoove us all if we were a little more humble about what is uncertain instead of thinking it's just a matter of reading the latest research and assuming we know everything. Just because the dangers are overestimated doesn't mean none exist.

 

[hyp1]

you honestly dont think long term use opens you to more side effects?
i use juice so im not on the media bandwagon but i do think that abuse of any drug isnt a good thing

I'm not stating that long term androgen use won't open you up to side effects and that no dangers exist,what I am saying is that the supposed dangers have been overblown,hyped out and not backed up substantial evidence.

I'm not claiming to know everything,but I'm also not falling for the paranoia and bullshit anti steroid propaganda that the media seems to have a love affair with.

 

[krbn08]

im my eyes bro nothing is safe i mean i could walk out my house and get hit by a truck.

 

[Magick69]

i was thinking. why do we even bother with PCT - post cycle therapy - ? why not just stay on forever if you intened on doing loads of cycles okay if you intend to do 1 cycle then fair enough PCT - post cycle therapy - and recover. but what confuses me is people who cycle do a proper PCT - post cycle therapy - and recover then only to hop back on cycle to shut them selves down again.its like crashing your car getting it fixed then purposely crashing it again. i mean if any of us actualy valued our testicles we wouldnt do steds in the first place. just a rant really.........

wtf???