Why do we ...

[CSB]

spend so much on cutting cycles ? its an honest question.

i will admit i am more of a bulking slut , and spend my money there .

with very little experience in the pure cutting department , a popular cutting cycle usually would include for an experienced user test tren masteron hgh amongst other things such as eca / clen

now i can see the usefullness in hgh (i use often when funds allow) and most def eca's, clen as well but not my choice of compound.

reason i ask is because the ultimate goal when dieting down is muscle retention, a basic test base should be more than sufficient to achieve this while relying on diet and hard training to get shredded , as we know there isnt anything AAS wise that actually cuts , its more a case of what retains the least water , for me when dieting being on low carbs i dont retain much any ways

so where does the benefit of tren and say adding winny or masteron come into play whilst dieting down, what do you feel they add to the cycle, as we know again, unless we genetically gifted we dont really add much muscle in a calorie deficit anyways no matter how much one pumps into there system.

that said i should have my own answer soon enough, as i am dieting down now on a test base using sust , and will in a few weeks add tren and winny to finish it off as my bodyfat gets closer to 10% before dropping back onto test for awhile before embarking on another lean bulker .

 

[Nelson Montana]

spend so much on cutting cycles ? its an honest question.

i will admit i am more of a bulking slut , and spend my money there .

with very little experience in the pure cutting department , a popular cutting cycle usually would include for an experienced user test tren masteron hgh amongst other things such as eca / clen

now i can see the usefullness in hgh (i use often when funds allow) and most def eca's, clen as well but not my choice of compound.

reason i ask is because the ultimate goal when dieting down is muscle retention, a basic test base should be more than sufficient to achieve this while relying on diet and hard training to get shredded , as we know there isnt anything AAS wise that actually cuts , its more a case of what retains the least water , for me when dieting being on low carbs i dont retain much any ways

so where does the benefit of tren and say adding winny or masteron come into play whilst dieting down, what do you feel they add to the cycle, as we know again, unless we genetically gifted we dont really add much muscle in a calorie deficit anyways no matter how much one pumps into there system.

that said i should have my own answer soon enough, as i am dieting down now on a test base using sust , and will in a few weeks add tren and winny to finish it off as my bodyfat gets closer to 10% before dropping back onto test for awhile before embarking on another lean bulker .

Tren has specific fat burning properties, but other than that, I think using steroids in a calorie deficit is not the best use of them. I also think catabolism in a calorie deficit is overstated. But the idea of building more muscle while losing fat is appealing and that's why it's done so often.

 

[stevesmi]

its a constant war trying to keep your muscle while trying to not gain fat. as bodybuilders (i'm not talking about powerlifters or strongmen) this is our ultimate goal.

what i found that works well is bulking on cycle, and cutting off... it does get frustrating losing strength when i cut and my buddies at the gym (mostly older powerlifter types) not understanding why I cut cause to them I am 'not fat' but to me I want to shred every ounce of fat off my body without sacrificing a lot of strength and size.

so essentially i agree with your premise that its better to bulk on, and cut off. however when i ran deca i bulked way too much and it took me a while to lose all the fat i put on in the process. but boy did it change my body structure and fast.

 

[CSB]

Tren has specific fat burning properties, but other than that, I think using steroids in a calorie deficit is not the best use of them. I also think catabolism in a calorie deficit is overstated. But the idea of building more muscle while losing fat is appealing and that's why it's done so often.

thanks Nelson

I have just been curious as stated its an area i dont delve into alot , reading some comments from Chris Aceto about training someone like Jay cutler, who seems to grow into a comp, he said its purely because he is a genetic freak and not all the guys he trains can basically accomplish that whilst dieting down. thats what got me really thinking about it.

I do understand the effects say eq has on vascularity, and the hardening effect tren and say winny or masteron can have on ones physique when starting under 10% bodyfat , but in general its alot of money to spend for the average dude

 

[CSB]

its a constant war trying to keep your muscle while trying to not gain fat. as bodybuilders (i'm not talking about powerlifters or strongmen) this is our ultimate goal.

what i found that works well is bulking on cycle, and cutting off... it does get frustrating losing strength when i cut and my buddies at the gym (mostly older powerlifter types) not understanding why I cut cause to them I am 'not fat' but to me I want to shred every ounce of fat off my body without sacrificing a lot of strength and size.

so essentially i agree with your premise that its better to bulk on, and cut off. however when i ran deca i bulked way too much and it took me a while to lose all the fat i put on in the process. but boy did it change my body structure and fast.

i see your point, but instead of "off" lol i mean why use so many compounds when cutting instead of just a test base of say 500-750mg to keep muscle loss at bay, keep strength up etc , would this not achieve almost 99% of the same "look" if diet is spot on etc, as you would have achieved with say test tren masteron combo ?

 

[stevesmi]

i see your point, but instead of "off" lol i mean why use so many compounds when cutting instead of just a test base of say 500-750mg to keep muscle loss at bay, keep strength up etc , would this not achieve almost 99% of the same "look" if diet is spot on etc, as you would have achieved with say test tren masteron combo ?

not at all. test will aromatize... masteron is a DHT.. and tren suppresses appetite. so when you combine them together you get good synergy.

 

[CSB]

not at all. test will aromatize... masteron is a DHT.. and tren suppresses appetite. so when you combine them together you get good synergy.

Makes sense , tren completely wrecks my appetite

will see soon, currently running 700mg sust a week, after a 2 week frontload , currently in week 3

will switch to sust 700 tren 75ed and winny 50 ed in a few weeks and complete cut to hopefully below 10%

start weight - 234 lbs
Current weight - 225 lbs

diet low carb with a few moderate and high days thrown in

 

[stevesmi]

^^^ I run single compounds all the time. its cheaper and less injections.

but i do like to stack things together for special situations and experiment.

 

[ConanX]

If you cut and use Tren, Masteron, Winny, etc, you will see why they are so popular. Instead of just looking ripped, you look like a freak. Crazy striations, amazing vascularity, rock hardness, and you will probably still look huge instead of flat.

Some people bulk on low dose and easy compounds and use the strong stuff for the cut.

 

[CSB]

Thanks for your input,coming back from injury and a short layoff i am just using a test base and diet to get closer to 10 to 12 percent over the next few weeks hopefully,think it will be more beneficial then to throw in the tren and winny and continue to diet hard for a further 8 weeks and see where I am at

 

[louisiana]

not at all. test will aromatize... masteron is a DHT.. and tren suppresses appetite. so when you combine them together you get good synergy.

Dont this depend on that persons genetics. I was on another board this morning and this guy was 240lbs he only used test 250mg e/k and lost 30lbs. If you look at him you would think he stacked all kind of shit like tren,winny or masteron to acheive that look. He posted his diet and said it was all about his diet. He was cut and vascular after losing 30lb in 4 months. So i think a person could acheive the same results from 1 compound that they could on 3 compound while cutting. It's all about the diet right?

 

[stevesmi]

Dont this depend on that persons genetics. I was on another board this morning and this guy was 240lbs he only used test 250mg e/k and lost 30lbs. If you look at him you would think he stacked all kind of shit like tren,winny or masteron to acheive that look. He posted his diet and said it was all about his diet. He was cut and vascular after losing 30lb in 4 months. So i think a person could acheive the same results from 1 compound that they could on 3 compound while cutting. It's all about the diet right?

he was in bad shape to begin with. the AAS merely got him motivated. he would of lost that weight with or without AAS if he had worked out and ate well.

its like saying i gained 100 pounds on my bench in 4 months.. well if the person never lifted in their life and could only lift 85 pounds then getting to 185 isn't a big deal

diet is crucial and I think also what you do for a living makes a difference.. if you dig ditches all day then you are burning calories and it will be easy to stay thinner than a guy who sits on a computer all day and isn't burning much at all.

there are many factors to consider

 

[louisiana]

he was in bad shape to begin with. the AAS merely got him motivated. he would of lost that weight with or without AAS if he had worked out and ate well.

its like saying i gained 100 pounds on my bench in 4 months.. well if the person never lifted in their life and could only lift 85 pounds then getting to 185 isn't a big deal

diet is crucial and I think also what you do for a living makes a difference.. if you dig ditches all day then you are burning calories and it will be easy to stay thinner than a guy who sits on a computer all day and isn't burning much at all.

there are many factors to consider

What make u think he was in bad shape to begin with? I will post this guy's picture at 240lbs and I bet he Is built better than you! Just because a person lose weight don't mean they was in bad shape! He lost the weight while maintaining all his muscles, he even look bigger. One compound with a proper diet did wonders for him. This guy is also 6 foot tall!!!


Sent from my iPhone using EliteFitness

 

[stevesmi]

What make u think he was in bad shape to begin with? I will post this guy's picture at 240lbs and I bet he Is built better than you! Just because a person lose weight don't mean they was in bad shape! He lost the weight while maintaining all his muscles, he even look bigger. One compound with a proper diet did wonders for him. This guy is also 6 foot tall!!!

you said in your first post that he changed his diet correct? so his diet wasn't up to par by his own admission. you misinterpreted what I posted because i used an example of benching and that confused you bro.

he could be built huge and be strong as an ox and eat shitty.. means nothing. also there is a dude at my gym who is 5 9 and 240 who has a huge gut.. but can bench 500. does that make him in good shape? no... he is strong but not in good shape. you look at him and wouldn't even believe he works out at all. now if this guy were to change his diet and drop 30 pounds he would probably look great just like your friend does, but he can kiss a lot of his strength goodbye.

but my original point is he doesn't need AAS to accomplish that. you are totally missing what I am saying. yes diet is #1. you can shed a lot of fat quick running a catabolic diet, and with AAS being run with it you will limit muscle loss cause you still mantain an anabolic body. however that isn't the most ideal way to run AAS. i still encourage people to eat muscle building foods and run AAS to bulk, not cut. use your off cycle to catch up on cardio and cut. steroids help you GROW, so take advantage of that.

 

[zwhit]

U

you said in your first post that he changed his diet correct? so his diet wasn't up to par by his own admission. you misinterpreted what I posted because i used an example of benching and that confused you bro.

he could be built huge and be strong as an ox and eat shitty.. means nothing. also there is a dude at my gym who is 5 9 and 240 who has a huge gut.. but can bench 500. does that make him in good shape? no... he is strong but not in good shape. you look at him and wouldn't even believe he works out at all. now if this guy were to change his diet and drop 30 pounds he would probably look great just like your friend does, but he can kiss a lot of his strength goodbye.

but my original point is he doesn't need AAS to accomplish that. you are totally missing what I am saying. yes diet is #1. you can shed a lot of fat quick running a catabolic diet, and with AAS being run with it you will limit muscle loss cause you still mantain an anabolic body. however that isn't the most ideal way to run AAS. i still encourage people to eat muscle building foods and run AAS to bulk, not cut. use your off cycle to catch up on cardio and cut. steroids help you GROW, so take advantage of that.

I'm pretty sure you misinterpreted what he was saying. I think he was saying this guy was a bulky 240 and dieted down only using test and now he looks better than most people that run huge cutting cycles with 3 or more compound. You just assumed he was out of shape. He could've been 240 @ 15% bf (which isnt bad shape) and cut down to 210 @ around 7% bf. It was a bad assumption on your part.

 

[louisiana]

U

I'm pretty sure you misinterpreted what he was saying. I think he was saying this guy was a bulky 240 and dieted down only using test and now he looks better than most people that run huge cutting cycles with 3 or more compound. You just assumed he was out of shape. He could've been 240 @ 15% bf (which isnt bad shape) and cut down to 210 @ around 7% bf. It was a bad assumption on your part.

I will post a picture of this dude later, he was not out of shape by any stretch of the imagination! He look good from the start but dieting with a low dose of one compound made him better. Only 250mgs of test with Proper diet made him look as if he was running 3 compounds.


Sent from my iPhone using EliteFitness

 

[stevesmi]

^^^doesn't matter what one guy did like i said above I run single compounds all the time. it saves money and it doesn't require turning myself into a pin cushion.

but there are situations where stacking is a good idea. stacking a kickstart, a DHT, and something very anabolic is a good combo.

 

[louisiana]

i see your point, but instead of "off" lol i mean why use so many compounds when cutting instead of just a test base of say 500-750mg to keep muscle loss at bay, keep strength up etc , would this not achieve almost 99% of the same "look" if diet is spot on etc, as you would have achieved with say test tren masteron combo ?

Yes it will, it depends on your genetics,diet and rest. I ran tren 3 times in the past and it didn't supress my appetite. Give it a try yourself before you take anyone advice on this. It want hurt u to give it a go if this is what you choose. The best I ever looked was when I ran a winny only cycle but that is blasphemy on this site.


Sent from my iPhone using EliteFitness