yes. if you have the choice go with either of theose two. I always use researchlabsupply.com they carry turemo and excels but the only excel's i got were 18ga for drawing and a box of 25ga for shooting. But the ryvmeds just seemed dull and flimsy even the 23ga. I would almost dread taking a shot because of the bending and popping. But when you think of the bennies of bangin juice the fear seems to dissappate. I'd suggest turemos or b-d easy glides.