pgerardone so much you said i agree with as a friend of mine said when i was starting out lifting.
(you could have the biggest arms in the world but if you dont have the stomach/waist to match,it looks like shiiit) i grew up and lived by his words....
hell,i saw a lady at wallmart with huge arms but she was at least 300lbs.
mine are cold and off just over 17 but you cant even grab skin with your finger tips around the house.