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This is basically why I have a PS3 and not an Xbox 360

hanselthecaretaker

High End Bro
Platinum

Q: Of all five videogame systems on the market now (PS3, PSP, PS2, DS, Wii and 360)only the Xbox 360 has had such major hardware failure problems. Microsoft being the only company based in the US making a videogame system. What part of Microsoft's way of doing things do you think caused this situation to happen.


"First, MS has under resourced that product unit in all engineering areas since the very beginning. Especially in engineering support functions like test, quality, manufacturing, and supplier management. There just weren't enough people to do the job that needed to be done. The leadership in many of those areas was also lopsided in essential skills and experience. But I hear they are really trying to staff up now based on what has happened, and how cheap staff is compared to a couple of billion in cost of quality.

Second, MS was so focused on beating Sony this cycle that the 360 was rushed to market when all indications were that it had serious flaws. The design qual testing was insufficient and incomplete when the product was released to production. The manufacturing test equipment had major gaps in test coverage and wasn't reliable or repeatable. Manufacturing processes at eall levels of suppliers were immature and not in control. Initial end to end yields were in the mid 30%. Low yields always indicate serious design and manufacturing defects. Management chose to continue to ship anyways, and keep the lines running while trying to solve problems and bring the yields up. Whenever something failed and there was a question about whether the test result was false, they would remove that test, retest and ship, or see if the unit would boot a game and run briefly and then ship. 360 is too complex of a machine to get away with that.

In the end I think it was fear of failure, ambition to beat Sony, and the arrogance that they could figure anything out, that led to the decision to keep shipping. That management team had made some pretty bad decisions in the past and had never had to pay a proportional consequence. I'm sure they thought that somehow they would figure it out and everything would end up ok. Plus, they tend to make big decisions like that in terms of dollars. They would rationalize that if the first few million boxes had a high failure rate, a few 10's of millions of dollars would cover it. And contrasting that cost with a big lead on Sony, would pay it in a heartbeat. They weren't even thinking about Nintendo.

Compare that to Sony, who delayed their launch, even though they were behind, when their box wasn't ready.
"

http://www.8bitjoystick.com/archive...about_xbox_360_red_ring_of_death_failures.php

Do you think MS learned their lesson for their next console? I suppose we'll find out someday.
 
hanselthecaretaker said:

Q: Of all five videogame systems on the market now (PS3, PSP, PS2, DS, Wii and 360)only the Xbox 360 has had such major hardware failure problems. Microsoft being the only company based in the US making a videogame system. What part of Microsoft's way of doing things do you think caused this situation to happen.


"First, MS has under resourced that product unit in all engineering areas since the very beginning. Especially in engineering support functions like test, quality, manufacturing, and supplier management. There just weren't enough people to do the job that needed to be done. The leadership in many of those areas was also lopsided in essential skills and experience. But I hear they are really trying to staff up now based on what has happened, and how cheap staff is compared to a couple of billion in cost of quality.

Second, MS was so focused on beating Sony this cycle that the 360 was rushed to market when all indications were that it had serious flaws. The design qual testing was insufficient and incomplete when the product was released to production. The manufacturing test equipment had major gaps in test coverage and wasn't reliable or repeatable. Manufacturing processes at eall levels of suppliers were immature and not in control. Initial end to end yields were in the mid 30%. Low yields always indicate serious design and manufacturing defects. Management chose to continue to ship anyways, and keep the lines running while trying to solve problems and bring the yields up. Whenever something failed and there was a question about whether the test result was false, they would remove that test, retest and ship, or see if the unit would boot a game and run briefly and then ship. 360 is too complex of a machine to get away with that.

In the end I think it was fear of failure, ambition to beat Sony, and the arrogance that they could figure anything out, that led to the decision to keep shipping. That management team had made some pretty bad decisions in the past and had never had to pay a proportional consequence. I'm sure they thought that somehow they would figure it out and everything would end up ok. Plus, they tend to make big decisions like that in terms of dollars. They would rationalize that if the first few million boxes had a high failure rate, a few 10's of millions of dollars would cover it. And contrasting that cost with a big lead on Sony, would pay it in a heartbeat. They weren't even thinking about Nintendo.

Compare that to Sony, who delayed their launch, even though they were behind, when their box wasn't ready.
"

http://www.8bitjoystick.com/archive...about_xbox_360_red_ring_of_death_failures.php

Do you think MS learned their lesson for their next console? I suppose we'll find out someday.

Word, I have a 360 and the fucking thing broke. I got those red rings of death. I sen it into microsoft for them to fix it. They send it back, with an attempt to fix it. It broke after like 30 minutes of playing again, so I called microsoft back up and told them they didn't fix it right. So, I have it sent back to microsoft only to get it back 3 days letter with a failed warranty note saying they can't fix it because of warranty breach for "Improper use" What the fuck is that? I put a game in and I play the the thing, and it fucking broke. How is that misuseing the product? Oh, and since they had already tried fixing it once, I call them back asking them what the fuck, because they didn't fix my damn the thing the first time. they told me sorry, and to stick it basically.

Luckily, my dad is a big wig in business, he calls his boss in northridge who knows Robert Bach, the Entertainment Division president, and they sent me a new one free.

Microsoft is shitty with their Xbox 360 customer service. Fuck them. even after I get a free one.
 
Typical of all microsoft products. Windows has sucked since day 1...the whole concept is flawed. It's just to bad a different company didnt have a product that could compete in business at the time, which essentially gave them a monopoly. As a result, people buy their shitty gaming systems because microsoft has a big name.
 
ps3 plays bluray right?
 
Ps3 blows, mines collecting dust now. Better investment would be 500 worth of crack
 
so I guess is better to have both...
 
PuddleMonkey said:
You're worse than john kerry with the flip flopping lol

I could have swore you said awhile back you were about to sell your PS3 and get a 360


lol. Dude couldn't say how many systems I've bought and later sold since eBay's been around. I've managed to keep my PS3 for almost a year and a half though! The games are starting to come around too.
 
Historically Nintendo has always been head and shoulders above Sony and Microsoft when it comes to reliable platforms. I don't think I've ever heard of issues with a Wii, Gamecube, whatever. I've owned all 3 at one point or another and I have to say my PS2 lasted forever but still had occasional disk reading issues, as does my 360.

I got my 360 for free, and I like it but if I had to go out and buy something right now it would be a Wii. If they included Blu-Ray somehow they would be killing Sony.
 
calveless wonder said:


I think it's a blessing that I haven't been able to sell my PS3.

The first time I tried selling it on eBay, it was "bought now" by some scam ebayer in Nigeria. Fuck that.

Second time, I tried on Craigslist, and the buyer later called back saying he was moving and couldn't afford it right now.

Thirdly and most recently I post up about selling it here and a couple weeks later get an email from kano saying he'll he wants it but spent all his cash on a bunch of Xeon PC's or something and had to hold off on it.


Well in the meantime I played MGS4 and have pretty much forgot all about selling it. I think it wanted me to keep it haha.

The quote in the o.p. is kinda like icing on the cake. I'll support MS when they give a better reason to be supported than they have with Xbox 360.
 
myway said:
I have both.

I had a 360 when Gears came out but got bored with it.
I grew up in the Genesis vs. SNES days so it's kinda in my blood to stick with one lol. I Kinda see MS this generation as the new Genesis, quantity over quality. Also, I'd have to update my entire entertainment center other than the TV if I wanted to have more than one console out. Not worth it to me, plus it looks cleaner with just one.
 
I wish I could play online.. my shitty little town only has DSL and wont let fios in cause of their boro politics bullshit. I told them they better get that shit settled before I start buying property and getting it section 8 ready and have some of those non tax paying mofo's move in.
 
drsketch said:
ps3 sucks cock, its slower and the online gaming is shit.


They have 1st party dedicated servers. Resistance 40 player battles top Halo 3 multiplayer. It didn't have the marketing that Halo did but oh well, there you go.
 
ponyfitness said:
Historically Nintendo has always been head and shoulders above Sony and Microsoft when it comes to reliable platforms. I don't think I've ever heard of issues with a Wii, Gamecube, whatever. I've owned all 3 at one point or another and I have to say my PS2 lasted forever but still had occasional disk reading issues, as does my 360.

I got my 360 for free, and I like it but if I had to go out and buy something right now it would be a Wii. If they included Blu-Ray somehow they would be killing Sony.


Wii is already killing Sony and MS. I'd like to play the 1st party games (Mario, Metroid, etc.) but other than that the Wii is a gimmick. Most 3rd party developers have all but written it off. Nintendo has kinda alienated themselves this gen. This doesn't matter to casual gamers though if you look at their sales.
 
hanselthecaretaker said:
Wii is already killing Sony and MS. I'd like to play the 1st party games (Mario, Metroid, etc.) but other than that the Wii is a gimmick. Most 3rd party developers have all but written it off. Nintendo has kinda alienated themselves this gen. This doesn't matter to casual gamers though if you look at their sales.


I bought a Wii, the first party games are pretty kick ass.
 
drsketch said:
halo 3 is a shitty little kids game.. I played COD4 on a ps3 and it is slower than shit.


Infinity Ward server problem. Same thing happened on Xbox Live. Overall though multiplat titles have performed better online for MS. But you also have to pay for it.
 
My 360 is back in the shop for the second time due to hardware malfunctions. At least MS extended their warranty to 3 years for RROD probs.
 
drsketch said:
I wish I could play online.. my shitty little town only has DSL and wont let fios in cause of their boro politics bullshit. I told them they better get that shit settled before I start buying property and getting it section 8 ready and have some of those non tax paying mofo's move in.

:lmao:
 
xbox 360 is konwn for it's hw problems. Though if you get a new generation xbox (look up how to find that out) it is much more stable. Only the fact the xbox 360 and xbox live totally kick-ass, is what's keeping it alive. I lvoe the controllers and the games are much moer fun.

r
 
Razorguns said:
xbox 360 is konwn for it's hw problems. Though if you get a new generation xbox (look up how to find that out) it is much more stable. Only the fact the xbox 360 and xbox live totally kick-ass, is what's keeping it alive. I lvoe the controllers and the games are much moer fun.

r


+1!!
 
The Wii is way to kiddy and the PS3 has too few games.

I have an XB360 and have never had any problems with it..plus the online experience is top notch.
 
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