The original pioneer of D-bol, John Ziegler's dying words...

[geoboy]

I hear ha Juice. The whole tendon thing got me to thinking. I
Whiskey

search here on collegen for lots of info on which steroids promote tendon/collegen health and which cause degradation or deposition of abnormal nerw collegen/elastin.

if i recall,
var,deca,eq good,
winny, primo,tren,masteron bad.
test and i think dbol about neutral.

also, the hdl/cardiovascular issue is probably the only valid real side effect that should be played up, but isnt.

 

[satchboogie]

He shouldn't be so upset. They didn't what doses to use, about PCT, liver damage or anything else for that matter. In 1962-63 the San Diego Chargers had a bowl of dbol in the training room and guys would just eat them by the handful.
John Z has nothing to do with steroids today and would be relieved to know what we know now about using them and what they can do when used safely. In 1983, when he died, no one knew jack about PCT. In fact, there was none. You just crashed when you came off. Nobody knew about possible liver damage from 100mg/day of dbol for 5-6 months straight.
When he died we were all pretty stupid about steroids and he wasn't much smarter.

totally bro.

 

[Mavy]

I dont like his scare tactics either. I like facts. You cant compare then to now with the way science is always evolving. Why doesnt he go on about anit-es, aromatise inhibitors, liver protectants, cholesterol drugs, anti-prog drugs, HCG, blood tests ...etc etc..

No doubt there is sides ... but most of the smart users out there are well aware of these and do there research on the best ways to prevent or combat these.

Another thing .. fuck the tendon issue ... I admitt he really did scare me with this ...

"One biggie that accompanies steroids, is silent and symptomless thickening of the left ventricle of the heart, until it can no longer function in correct rhythm with the right ventricle.(6, 7) "

 

[Singleton]

Not all steroids cause tendon damage.

Primo, deca, and var (, and eq?) all promote stronger tendons.

 

[ironhorse242]

bla bla bla, if steroids din't work why would people use them.

 

[karachi183]

Tendon damage is obvious when ur busting ur ass. Creatine is by far one of the best supps i've ever used with very little sides ( i did have blurred vision and was dry (meaning thirsty all the time but worh it)as sand but for other obvious reasons). These are things that common sense tell us. either we are just smarter now or people from back in the days ignored what they could have prevented. PCT in AAS users IMO is more important than the compounds we take. Low test leads to man not bieng a man and having to deal with it. That alone an cause worlds or problems

 

[weightroom1984]

fact is=cough syrup,medications.,etc......certain foods we EAT.all have side effects and if abused can lead to an early death.....knowledge=AAS, now is abundant and because of those who suffered an early death......we of the present have to be thankful....no one twisted these guys arms..they saw the amazing gains and went after it like a pig to slop=and with the gains=they had to know there were conflicts...alcohol,cigs etc have just as many sides if not more.....smart people do the homework and math for cycles,those who don't =deserve =the inevitable outcome.....aas ARE NOT FOR EVERYONE.after 2 trips=by helicopter to a major university medical center and having=my HEART stopped and restarted=twice.I learned=less is more.I am wiser because of stupidity but live to tell of it..if you abuse AS ..you will sooner or later live out its demons.....lots of famous new/old PRO bb NOW,have medical complications but you just don't hear about the leaks.I choose aas for personal reasons...bloodwork is the key.if YOU don't get your levels checked frequently..you could become a statistic...i choose aas......my choice..my decision......i live with it!