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The Myth of Deca Durabolin and Finasteride (VERY IMPORTANT)

Magick69

Magick69

New member
Hi Guys,

yesterday i decided to send an email to one of the most important MD expert in the US about hairloss (they are 3 and all are very good and expreinced in this field with bodybuilders). And asked about the combo deca-finasteride i am pasting the email I bet my reputation on this answer and after this i will try the cycle Deca-fina without worries (at least from the hairside). In May i will start a cycle and will test this myth...hope i have been useful for the bros like me that have problems with the hair

the email:

Hi Dr. X

i started to take care of my hair when i was 20 (now i am 37) and i was diagnosed with alopecia androgenetic by a well known xxxx dematologist. since then i manage with best doctors and products to maintain all my hair.

Now, i decided to do a cycle of Deca durabolin (nandrolone-NPP)at 200/300 mg per week for 8-9 weeks. I stress that here in the UK the personal use of steroids is perfectly legal.


Your genetic disposition is the most important factor in MPB, and Deca durabolin (nandrolone) can exacerbate it if you have a genetic predisposition for MPB.

I have read that the use of finasteride (which i do) and nandrolone would cause hairloss; so i would like to know , if possible,
do you think is a myth in your experience the negative interaction of nandrolone/finasteride ?

It is a myth. If you are going to be taking steroids, there will be an increase in the serum level of testosterone. However, you will be relieved to know that the increased testosterone does not necessarily exacerbate MPB in all patients.
It would be wise to decrease the DHT and that would be fairly simple. I think that the best single product for preventing and reversing MPB is 5% minoxidil / 5% azelaic acid promotes hair growth and prevents the synthesis of DHT in the scalp. The alternative is for you to take finasteride (Propecia or quartered tablets of Proscar). I would still suggest using 5% minoxidil with finasteride because the effects of the two medications are additive and complementary. Perhaps, the most effective medication to decrease both the amount and the effect of DHT in the scalp would be topical spironolactone. There are three distinct benefits of topical spironolactone in the treatment of MPB. (1). Spironolactone significantly reduces the amount of DHT in the scalp by inhibiting the conversion of precursor steroids to DHT. (2). Spironolactone reduces the DHT in the scalp by converting localized testosterone into estrogen, which is thought to be protective of the hair follicles. (3). Spironolactone blocks the follicular androgen receptor sites, thereby rendering any residual or circulating DHT harmless to the hair follicles. Rather than reducing the levels of circulating (serum) DHT like finasteride does, it prevents DHT from making a complex with the androgen receptor protein.

guys it is a myth !! ( i believe we should put this answer in a place in the forum easily accessible for everyone...)
 
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I guess I know who that doctor is. He is indeed an expert and knows what he is talking about.

Unfortunately he is only looking at the testosterone/DHT issue. Many other steroids like trenbolone, stanozolol, oxymetholone...cause hairloss by themselves and do absolutely not "rely to DHT" to do so. Any androgen has the potential to cause hairloss.
He should have looked at the issue of nandrolone/DHN

Although I do think that the nandrolone/finasteride thing is purely based on "bro-ology" rather than facts, I will not be convinced by Dr Lee's arguments untill I see an MPB prone person combining these compounds.
(I mean a real person / not some internet bro who has a friend who knows a dude that "could feel his hairs fall off his head")
 
Hi thanks for all your contribution to the debate; actually there should not be any debate!??

I will be brief

1) I kept my hair in my head after diagnoses of alopecia androgenetica by very well known dermatologists; i remeber i was so fucking depressed!! and instead of giving up i followed medical advices and tackled the problem since the very beginning. I remember at the time advice of people; give up is your gene u will be bald; minoxidil did not work with me; finasteride makes u grows boobs and loss of libido i did not give shit and continued;i still have hair and 3 girlfriends and one wife :chomp:

2) not mean to be rude but between a very very very well known dermatologist which has worked with many bodybuilders with this dilemmas and problems, i believe in the first option and for me the rest are speculations; i put my reputation and hair on it becasue my cycle will be fina and NPP

3) It is not Dr. Lee and if it was i am a serious person and i will never mention names so do not ask me who is; you need to trust me he is very big.

4) if you stop finasteride (and prone to lose your hair) and use nandrolone something is sure you will lose your hair from nandrolone and the stopping of fina

5) peace bros soon i will write an article about hairloss...
 
shorinryu69 said:
guys it is a myth !! ( i believe we should put this answer in a place in the forum easily accessible for everyone...)
Click to expand...

That doctor is a dumbass with regards to steroids - Deca will not increase serum testosterone, it will decrease it. The only steroid that increases serum testosterone is testosterone. What a fucking moron I cant believe he is giving you advice. He has no clue on the metabolites of Deca and how they interact with scalp and hair.
 
I do indeed agree on most points. All this finasteride/nandrolone thing is just "bro-science".
Yet still your dermatologist is wrong saying that "if you are going to be taking steroids, there will be an increase in the serum level of testosterone". He is confusing steroids and testosterone and only looks at the DHT thing.

Anyway, keep us posted on your results with NPP and finasteride. I am myself very prone to MPB and would like to hear a real nandrolone/fina case.
 
Computer said:
I do indeed agree on most points. All this finasteride/nandrolone thing is just "bro-science".
Yet still your dermatologist is wrong saying that "if you are going to be taking steroids, there will be an increase in the serum level of testosterone". He is confusing steroids and testosterone and only looks at the DHT thing.

Anyway, keep us posted on your results with NPP and finasteride. I am myself very prone to MPB and would like to hear a real nandrolone/fina case.
Click to expand...

cool computer actually this is my intention plus i will write my plan for hair protection with websites where to buy stuff.

About our german mate, what can i say bro? you have been warned if you do it at your own risk :rolleyes: i will always advice u, though, on how to stop the crazy shedding caused by the fina stopping and the durabolin action on your hair...

the risk to stop fina ,for a person prone to hairloss, are WAY WAY MORE SERIOUS than get it with nandrolone.....
 
KD1 said:
That doctor is a dumbass with regards to steroids - Deca will not increase serum testosterone, it will decrease it. The only steroid that increases serum testosterone is testosterone. What a fucking moron I cant believe he is giving you advice. He has no clue on the metabolites of Deca and how they interact with scalp and hair.
Click to expand...

wrong. I know for a fact eq, and d-bol will increace testosterone levels
 
Hair loss seems to be more a function of genetics than gear, yes gear will accelerate your hair loss,


But I know people who have tried and abused everything, and still have all there hair, myself included in that group.
 
marvelous thread shorinryu..keep up the good work...i'd like to know what your are taking to prevent your hairloss: supplements,juice etc.
im 36 and using minox and dutasteride
some years ago i did a cycle of deca and var with finasteride 1mg ..it was a great cycle...people noticed that i had put on some weight and that my arms/biceps were bigger.... but when i was on this cycle i was shedding like a mofo man..don' know if it was the combo deca/finasteride or if the var was real or d-bol instead or maybe the shedding came from finasteride itself cause i took it a week before the cycle....BUT after the cycle (stopped also finasteride)my hair returned to normal..It stopped shedding
 
cop said:
marvelous thread shorinryu..keep up the good work...i'd like to know what your are taking to prevent your hairloss: supplements,juice etc.
im 36 and using minox and dutasteride
some years ago i did a cycle of deca and var with finasteride 1mg ..it was a great cycle...people noticed that i had put on some weight and that my arms/biceps were bigger.... but when i was on this cycle i was shedding like a mofo man..don' know if it was the combo deca/finasteride or if the var was real or d-bol instead or maybe the shedding came from finasteride itself cause i took it a week before the cycle....BUT after the cycle (stopped also finasteride)my hair returned to normal..It stopped shedding
Click to expand...

cheers mate! i would exclude nandro and var (i am using var and fingers crossed not prob;) but dianabol or shedding from fina can be possible one is negative it is the steroid action on the follicle.

the shedding from fina are two types

the first at the beginning is a good sign that is working; it occurs the same in minoxidil etcc.( i will explain in details with a post on hairloss and products and stacks)

the second is when u stop and is bad for people which are losing the hair!! fina need to be used always until new treatments are discovered

Duta is a bit triky and again i will explain next in the new post on hair...
 
thanks...i m using dutasteride right now...6 months...looking out for your hairloss thread...
 
shorinryu69 said:
actually bro i have already uploaded one on nandrolone and testosterone???? :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

You didnt read the chart fully did you?

Those readings of higher testosterone were labeled before the study began. There are no readings for testosterone after or while the study was being conducted.

ROFL - some proof!
 
KD1 said:
You didnt read the chart fully did you?

Those readings of higher testosterone were labeled before the study began. There are no readings for testosterone after or while the study was being conducted.

ROFL - some proof!
Click to expand...

Table 2 Summary statistics of the change from baseline to endpoint of the initial treatment period of other body composition parameters, body weight and body mass index (intention-to-treat analysis)

mate i am not here to argue; i wrote this to warn people that if people follow my advice ok if not their choice... :)
 
The testosterone readings were not in table 2 - they are in table 1 !

Look again there are not testosterone levels measured during or after - it even says so in the text!

Admit it - you read the table wrong - it and clearly it states right above the testosterone readings in bold letters..

Table 1 Summary statistics of demographics before start of treatment
 
blut wump said:
I'm in full agreement with computer's assessment of the reply. The doctor seemed not to address the issue of nor-testosterone and DHN.

Here's an old thread for further reading.
http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showthread.php?t=206046
Click to expand...


yup and yup.

he didnty answer the question other than to say "its a myth" then went off explaining something unrelated.

he may know what he's talking about, but certainly didnt give me anything to change my understanding of the problem, which is that unconverted nandriolone is harsher than dhn which is what nandrolone would be converted to absent the finasteride (not DHT that his answer addresses)
 
blut wump said:
Woah! Easy, bro. This didn't call for insults.; we're all adults here.
Click to expand...

Alright sorry - but clearly it shows that the readings were before the study began so I object strongly to incorrect information being passed off as facts.

Sorry for the insults to the original poster - they have been removed from the post.
 
My hair is way too thick. In fact, I have to have the barber use thinning shears everytime I get a haircut. Can anyone recommend a good AAS stack that will aid me in thinning it out a bit?
 
stewfoo said:
My hair is way too thick. In fact, I have to have the barber use thinning shears everytime I get a haircut. Can anyone recommend a good AAS stack that will aid me in thinning it out a bit?
Click to expand...


tren,winny and masteron would put your hair on a diet
 
That "Dr." is obviously not a steroid expert. He said that deca would raise serum testosterone levels, which it won't; it will actually lower them. He also failed to address finasteride's interaction with nandrolone. Your email and your post are useless, just like Dr. fuckhead.
 
right i did not immagine that my post would have created all this controversy :evil:

now about the study i re-read and i agree with you i rushed in posting i should have checked more but i was at work and do not want to get sacked for saving people hairs :)

I do not need to convince anyone; it is not up to us to explain theories but up to the expert of the fields; the email that i have has a signature with headings so the person that wrote this has thought before writing. It is an MD working also with bodybuilders in restoring their hairs or save them who agrees with another not so famous but expressing the same opinion

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=206046

if to this we add also the well written article of Ulter i think is pretty safe to dismiss this myth; again if you stop fina and use any steroid you will surely loose your hair for a paradox effect casued by the medicine and the aggressiviness of any steroid (except anavar) on the hairline

about the german i do not know your insults so is ok for me; but you should check a bit my avatars and pictures with a dictionary ; i also have lots of german friends perhaps we can meet i live in the UK drop me an email ; i can check your hairline :Boomstick I go to munich often to train and not in bodybuilding..... :theshadow
 
shorinryu69 said:
right i did not immagine that my post would have created all this controversy :evil:

now about the study i re-read and i agree with you i rushed in posting i should have checked more but i was at work and do not want to get sacked for saving people hairs :)

I do not need to convince anyone; it is not up to us to explain theories but up to the expert of the fields; the email that i have has a signature with headings so the person that wrote this has thought before writing. It is an MD working also with bodybuilders in restoring their hairs or save them who agrees with another not so famous but expressing the same opinion

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=206046

if to this we add also the well written article of Ulter i think is pretty safe to dismiss this myth; again if you stop fina and use any steroid you will surely loose your hair for a paradox effect casued by the medicine and the aggressiviness of any steroid (except anavar) on the hairline

about the german i do not know your insults so is ok for me; but you should check a bit my avatars and pictures with a dictionary ; i also have lots of german friends perhaps we can meet i live in the UK..... :theshadow
Click to expand...

Quit telling people that if they don't take finasteride with ANY gear they will surely lose their hair. This doesn't apply to gear where there is no interaction with the 5ar enzyme - winny, masteron, proviron, tren, etc. And it does have a reverse effect with deca. If you take deca without test, you will most likely not lose your hair without finasteride, and have greater chances of losing it with finasteride. Finasteride only works with test you retard, even your doctor said so. He just doesn't understand that not all gear causes elevated testosterone. You know what gear does......testosterone!
 
krishna said:
Quit telling people that if they don't take finasteride with ANY gear they will surely lose their hair. This doesn't apply to gear where there is no interaction with the 5ar enzyme - winny, masteron, proviron, tren, etc. And it does have a reverse effect with deca. If you take deca without test, you will most likely not lose your hair. Finasteride only works with test you retard, even your doctor said so. He just doesn't understand that not all gear causes elevated testosterone. You what gear does......testosterone!
Click to expand...

i do not want this thread to be closed so i repsect your opinion buddha
 
sorry Kryshna :chomp:

Ps

it is not my doctor is a famous MD which works also with bodybuilders i trust his word and not yours (Buddha what's your qualification mate?)

now what i say is i will try with my new cycle and we will see..... in the meantime if soemeone consider the hair important please do not stop any medication (fina) that ur Doc gave u while on any steroid than the choice is urs
 
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What will happen if you regularly get finasteride and you stop it.. :chomp:

Q: First off thank you for providing this Blog, it is extremely informative and gives people the opportunity to ask questions of one of the most knowledgeable hair transplant surgeons in the world. You are considered the consummate researcher in the field of hair loss, so I ask this question of you. It appears that all the current hair loss drugs, at one point or another, begin to loose their effectiveness. Have you ever entertained the idea of cycling these drugs, or reducing the dosage for a period of time, to prevent the body from becoming acclimated to these drugs and subsequently making adjustments to receptors causing this? This method is commonly used by bodybuilders and others in the sports profession to elicit the maximum effect from the drugs they employ. Though I have not found any studies along these lines, I believe there are valid reasons why this may work. I hope you may be able to share any information on this subject.

A: Excellent question. I can answer it only indirectly. It has been our experience that when you discontinue finasteride (Propecia), or decrease the dose to a degree that it no longer works, the patient will begin to shed hair. When the drug is re-started or the dose increased again, the medications will begin working, but the patient now maintains his hair at a lower baseline. He doesn’t seem to regain the amount of hair he has before the medication was stopped. For this reason, we don’t stop and start finasteride. The same argument applies to dutasteride, although we have less experience with this medication. This experience would speak against using pulse therapy for hair loss.

http://www.bernsteinmedical.com/blog/
 
Well I hope your experiment will bring light to this discussion.

We know that nandrolone is more androgenic than dhn, but we don't know to what proportion.
There is no data on all this - let's give shorinryu69 some time to prove his point with a real experience.
 
Is this the doctor who sells topical spironolactone? Is he objective (non-biased) with regard to topical spiro?
 
shorinryu69 said:
right i did not immagine that my post would have created all this controversy :evil:

now about the study i re-read and i agree with you i rushed in posting i should have checked more but i was at work and do not want to get sacked for saving people hairs :)

I do not need to convince anyone; it is not up to us to explain theories but up to the expert of the fields; the email that i have has a signature with headings so the person that wrote this has thought before writing. It is an MD working also with bodybuilders in restoring their hairs or save them who agrees with another not so famous but expressing the same opinion

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=206046

if to this we add also the well written article of Ulter i think is pretty safe to dismiss this myth; again if you stop fina and use any steroid you will surely loose your hair for a paradox effect casued by the medicine and the aggressiviness of any steroid (except anavar) on the hairline

about the german i do not know your insults so is ok for me; but you should check a bit my avatars and pictures with a dictionary ; i also have lots of german friends perhaps we can meet i live in the UK drop me an email ; i can check your hairline :Boomstick I go to munich often to train and not in bodybuilding..... :theshadow
Click to expand...

Use punctuation so we can follow what you're saying without stopping to think where you are starting a new thought. Periods or just commas would really help. Who needs a headache and a stiff neck trying to decipher your posts?
 
BBkingpin said:
Is this the doctor who sells topical spironolactone? Is he objective (non-biased) with regard to topical spiro?
Click to expand...

it is a well know MD; i cannot say more.....the important point is to avoid people to stop the fina and for something un proved put them in condition to lose their hair. About your comment; i think it is widely aknowledged that topical spiro is a very effective anti-hairloss treatment so nothing new...

The post of the last doc is clear about the consequences of stopping fina regardless nandrolone.

this is a new one:

gday doc,

great blog.

l’ve been on 1mg finasteride for about 9 mths and have recently noticed increased shedding (about 2-3 times more hair than usual).

lve read that finasteride causes synchronization of the hair cycle and as such this can occur and might be taken as a sign that the medication is effective.

Is this correct?

No one really knows for sure. I have heard reports from patients and readers such as yourself that starting finasteride may cause shedding. Aside from the anecdotal evidence, I have not heard or read about a scientific research on this phenomenon. I would hope that the shedding is the result of the drug and the hair going into another growth cycle rather than an acceleration of the hair loss that is due to your genetics. Time will tell the answer here as the shedding should stop and reverse by the 4th month if it is caused by a change in your hair cycle.

Nevertheless, the effectiveness of finasteride (Propecia) has been well studied and documented. Thus, it would not be a good idea to stop taking the medication if you are experiencing hair loss. The hair loss will be worse if you stop the medication as your body will play “catch up” and go back to the state as if you were never on the drug







BBkingpin, no intention to disrespect u ,just out of curiosity, but when u took the pic of your avatar did you lose your belt??
 
good work shorinryu69.....and for the others give him a break...i found it all interesting...dont forget to post your results bro (npp+finasteride)
 
BBkingpin said:
Use punctuation so we can follow what you're saying without stopping to think where you are starting a new thought. Periods or just commas would really help. Who needs a headache and a stiff neck trying to decipher your posts?
Click to expand...
I use topical spironolactone but it is not approved by the FDA to make claims of helping prevent baldness or grow hair. Apparently, in addition to propecia and finasteride, the only other FDA approved hair growth product is a laser comb. So, if a friggin' laser comb can prove its claims, why not topical spironolactone, if it's so effective?
 
shorinryu69 said:
What will happen if you regularly get finasteride and you stop it.. :chomp:

Q: First off thank you for providing this Blog, it is extremely informative and gives people the opportunity to ask questions of one of the most knowledgeable hair transplant surgeons in the world. You are considered the consummate researcher in the field of hair loss, so I ask this question of you. It appears that all the current hair loss drugs, at one point or another, begin to loose their effectiveness. Have you ever entertained the idea of cycling these drugs, or reducing the dosage for a period of time, to prevent the body from becoming acclimated to these drugs and subsequently making adjustments to receptors causing this? This method is commonly used by bodybuilders and others in the sports profession to elicit the maximum effect from the drugs they employ. Though I have not found any studies along these lines, I believe there are valid reasons why this may work. I hope you may be able to share any information on this subject.

A: Excellent question. I can answer it only indirectly. It has been our experience that when you discontinue finasteride (Propecia), or decrease the dose to a degree that it no longer works, the patient will begin to shed hair. When the drug is re-started or the dose increased again, the medications will begin working, but the patient now maintains his hair at a lower baseline. He doesn’t seem to regain the amount of hair he has before the medication was stopped. For this reason, we don’t stop and start finasteride. The same argument applies to dutasteride, although we have less experience with this medication. This experience would speak against using pulse therapy for hair loss.

http://www.bernsteinmedical.com/blog/
Click to expand...

This question applies to a normal patient who is not on nandrolone. Again, you're pointing out common sense that is useless to your case. This has nothing to do with someone taking nandrolone, tren, or any dht based gear. Go pop 60mg a day of dbol with 100mg a day of winny while taking your precious finasteride and see if you lose hair. Take at least 600 a week of npp too for your little experiment and don't use test so that there will be no excuse. And even if you don't lose hair, you wouldn't of anyway because deca suppresses your natural test and you have very reduced levels of dht.
 
BBkingpin said:
I use topical spironolactone but it is not approved by the FDA to make claims of helping prevent baldness or grow hair. Apparently, in addition to propecia and finasteride, the only other FDA approved hair growth product is a laser comb. So, if a friggin' laser comb can prove its claims, why not topical spironolactone, if it's so effective?
Click to expand...

I cannot answer to this question; sometimes FDA approval is related to other variables disconnected with the efficiency of the compound. What i know from a pratical point of view is that all major dermatologists prescirbe spiro and i have read many threads in forum about hairloss (which are connected with dermatologists specialised in hair or patients suffering with hairloss) speaking very well about spiro.

i think Lee's site has studies on spiro....

the forum of hairlosshelp is one of the best and you can have an idea about which stuff works and which not..
 
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This seems to me like this guy is simply trying to prove his point by exagerating the claims about this "famous MD".
"one of the most important MD expert in the US about hairloss (they are 3 and all are very good and expreinced in this field with bodybuilders)." - yeah sure!

He very clearly knows nothing of steroids. He has simply bitten off a big chunk of the usual media hype about steroids and bunched them all together. As previously mentioned by many others, your supposed famous MD is making very generic comments that actually only relate to testosterone. In fact, he even stated as much - It is a myth. If you are going to be taking steroids, there will be an increase in the serum level of testosterone.
It would be wise to decrease the DHT and that would be fairly simple. " - to quote him - "if you are going to be taking STEROIDS"!! - So all steroids are the same????? He either knows nothing about gear, or has overlooked what you actually asked him about - that being Nandrolone. I suspect he is the usual ignorant doc type that simply believe all gear is the same.

Nandrolone converts to DHN, and if left alone - i.e. not used with finasteride, DHN will not harm your hair line. When taken with Finasteride, it cannot convert to DHN and so could cause hair loss as DHN is much safer than deca.
To come on here and suggest that what your "famous MD" has told you is gospel because he works with many bodybuilders blah blah blah... when you are clearly making up those facts about him should see you thrown off here imo. If he was a famous MD and specialised in working with bodybuilders as you keep suggesting, then he would have a much better knowledge - or at least some knowledge - of the DIFFERENT effects DIFFERENT steroids can have on the hair line.
Now I for one know very little about hair loss, but it is something that massively concerns me. I would be seriously pi**ed if I had read your thread and took your word on it and used deca with fina only to see my hair falling out.
Serioulsy, if your going to quote some one else, at least do it with an objective view point and not exagerate/make up claims about the guy to support his theories. i.e:
"2) not mean to be rude but between a very very very well known dermatologist which has worked with many bodybuilders with this dilemmas and problems, i believe in the first option and for me the rest are speculations."

"It is an MD working also with bodybuilders in restoring their hairs or save them who agrees with another not so famous but expressing the same opinion"
"it is not my doctor is a famous MD which works also with bodybuilders i trust his word and not yours (Buddha what's your qualification mate?)"

And comments like this serioulsy p**s me off:
"in the meantime if soemeone consider the hair important please do not stop any medication (fina) that ur Doc gave u while on any steroid than the choice is urs" - so your telling people to use fina with any gear regardless of the thousands of posts from people who have experienced adverse effects over the years of doing exactly that, not to mention all of the scientific/medical evidence to support the reasons why this would happen. good idea!
 
chilledandy said:
This seems to me like this guy is simply trying to prove his point by exagerating the claims about this "famous MD".
"one of the most important MD expert in the US about hairloss (they are 3 and all are very good and expreinced in this field with bodybuilders)." - yeah sure!

He very clearly knows nothing of steroids. He has simply bitten off a big chunk of the usual media hype about steroids and bunched them all together. As previously mentioned by many others, your supposed famous MD is making very generic comments that actually only relate to testosterone. In fact, he even stated as much - It is a myth. If you are going to be taking steroids, there will be an increase in the serum level of testosterone.
It would be wise to decrease the DHT and that would be fairly simple. " - to quote him - "if you are going to be taking STEROIDS"!! - So all steroids are the same????? He either knows nothing about gear, or has overlooked what you actually asked him about - that being Nandrolone. I suspect he is the usual ignorant doc type that simply believe all gear is the same.

Nandrolone converts to DHN, and if left alone - i.e. not used with finasteride, DHN will not harm your hair line. When taken with Finasteride, it cannot convert to DHN and so could cause hair loss as DHN is much safer than deca.
To come on here and suggest that what your "famous MD" has told you is gospel because he works with many bodybuilders blah blah blah... when you are clearly making up those facts about him should see you thrown off here imo. If he was a famous MD and specialised in working with bodybuilders as you keep suggesting, then he would have a much better knowledge - or at least some knowledge - of the DIFFERENT effects DIFFERENT steroids can have on the hair line.
Now I for one know very little about hair loss, but it is something that massively concerns me. I would be seriously pi**ed if I had read your thread and took your word on it and used deca with fina only to see my hair falling out.
Serioulsy, if your going to quote some one else, at least do it with an objective view point and not exagerate/make up claims about the guy to support his theories. i.e:
"2) not mean to be rude but between a very very very well known dermatologist which has worked with many bodybuilders with this dilemmas and problems, i believe in the first option and for me the rest are speculations."

"It is an MD working also with bodybuilders in restoring their hairs or save them who agrees with another not so famous but expressing the same opinion"
"it is not my doctor is a famous MD which works also with bodybuilders i trust his word and not yours (Buddha what's your qualification mate?)"

And comments like this serioulsy p**s me off:
"in the meantime if soemeone consider the hair important please do not stop any medication (fina) that ur Doc gave u while on any steroid than the choice is urs" - so your telling people to use fina with any gear regardless of the thousands of posts from people who have experienced adverse effects over the years of doing exactly that, not to mention all of the scientific/medical evidence to support the reasons why this would happen. good idea!
Click to expand...

You're right on track brutha! Glad to see someone who actually understands how things work a little bit.
 
I'v heard doing deca and fina at the same time distroy the libido even with test boosters it takes months to come back. here is a link where u can buy spiro in the U.S. http://www.minoxidil.com/ if you use spiro and minoxidil u have to time it right if they are mixed it smells like rotten eggs. from what i've read u can drop azelic acid flakes into a bottle of minoxidil and make what they sell at site for $30 they sell the flakes at www.fishersci.com. i usually buy 4 bottes of minoxidil 5% at costco for $20 then drop 2 or 3ml of flakes in, mix and let it sit for 24 hours before use. hope this helps save some $$$.
shorinryu69 said:
Hi Guys,

yesterday i decided to send an email to one of the most important MD expert in the US about hairloss (they are 3 and all are very good and expreinced in this field with bodybuilders). And asked about the combo deca-finasteride i am pasting the email I bet my reputation on this answer and after this i will try the cycle Deca-fina without worries (at least from the hairside). In May i will start a cycle and will test this myth...hope i have been useful for the bros like me that have problems with the hair

the email:

Hi Dr. X

i started to take care of my hair when i was 20 (now i am 37) and i was diagnosed with alopecia androgenetic by a well known xxxx dematologist. since then i manage with best doctors and products to maintain all my hair.

Now, i decided to do a cycle of Deca durabolin (nandrolone-NPP)at 200/300 mg per week for 8-9 weeks. I stress that here in the UK the personal use of steroids is perfectly legal.


Your genetic disposition is the most important factor in MPB, and Deca durabolin (nandrolone) can exacerbate it if you have a genetic predisposition for MPB.

I have read that the use of finasteride (which i do) and nandrolone would cause hairloss; so i would like to know , if possible,
do you think is a myth in your experience the negative interaction of nandrolone/finasteride ?

It is a myth. If you are going to be taking steroids, there will be an increase in the serum level of testosterone. However, you will be relieved to know that the increased testosterone does not necessarily exacerbate MPB in all patients.
It would be wise to decrease the DHT and that would be fairly simple. I think that the best single product for preventing and reversing MPB is 5% minoxidil / 5% azelaic acid promotes hair growth and prevents the synthesis of DHT in the scalp. The alternative is for you to take finasteride (Propecia or quartered tablets of Proscar). I would still suggest using 5% minoxidil with finasteride because the effects of the two medications are additive and complementary. Perhaps, the most effective medication to decrease both the amount and the effect of DHT in the scalp would be topical spironolactone. There are three distinct benefits of topical spironolactone in the treatment of MPB. (1). Spironolactone significantly reduces the amount of DHT in the scalp by inhibiting the conversion of precursor steroids to DHT. (2). Spironolactone reduces the DHT in the scalp by converting localized testosterone into estrogen, which is thought to be protective of the hair follicles. (3). Spironolactone blocks the follicular androgen receptor sites, thereby rendering any residual or circulating DHT harmless to the hair follicles. Rather than reducing the levels of circulating (serum) DHT like finasteride does, it prevents DHT from making a complex with the androgen receptor protein.

guys it is a myth !! ( i believe we should put this answer in a place in the forum easily accessible for everyone...)
Click to expand...
 
i just woke up and i briefly read through these posts.. the hairloss issue is a myth? i completely disagree. i'm mid cycle right now, and i'm shedding again.. just like i do 4 weeks into every cycle, and will be for six weeks after the cycle.
 
chilledandy said:
This seems to me like this guy is simply trying to prove his point by exagerating the claims about this "famous MD".
"one of the most important MD expert in the US about hairloss (they are 3 and all are very good and expreinced in this field with bodybuilders)." - yeah sure!

He very clearly knows nothing of steroids. He has simply bitten off a big chunk of the usual media hype about steroids and bunched them all together. As previously mentioned by many others, your supposed famous MD is making very generic comments that actually only relate to testosterone. In fact, he even stated as much - It is a myth. If you are going to be taking steroids, there will be an increase in the serum level of testosterone.
It would be wise to decrease the DHT and that would be fairly simple. " - to quote him - "if you are going to be taking STEROIDS"!! - So all steroids are the same????? He either knows nothing about gear, or has overlooked what you actually asked him about - that being Nandrolone. I suspect he is the usual ignorant doc type that simply believe all gear is the same.

Nandrolone converts to DHN, and if left alone - i.e. not used with finasteride, DHN will not harm your hair line. When taken with Finasteride, it cannot convert to DHN and so could cause hair loss as DHN is much safer than deca.
To come on here and suggest that what your "famous MD" has told you is gospel because he works with many bodybuilders blah blah blah... when you are clearly making up those facts about him should see you thrown off here imo. If he was a famous MD and specialised in working with bodybuilders as you keep suggesting, then he would have a much better knowledge - or at least some knowledge - of the DIFFERENT effects DIFFERENT steroids can have on the hair line.
Now I for one know very little about hair loss, but it is something that massively concerns me. I would be seriously pi**ed if I had read your thread and took your word on it and used deca with fina only to see my hair falling out.
Serioulsy, if your going to quote some one else, at least do it with an objective view point and not exagerate/make up claims about the guy to support his theories. i.e:
"2) not mean to be rude but between a very very very well known dermatologist which has worked with many bodybuilders with this dilemmas and problems, i believe in the first option and for me the rest are speculations."

"It is an MD working also with bodybuilders in restoring their hairs or save them who agrees with another not so famous but expressing the same opinion"
"it is not my doctor is a famous MD which works also with bodybuilders i trust his word and not yours (Buddha what's your qualification mate?)"

And comments like this serioulsy p**s me off:
"in the meantime if soemeone consider the hair important please do not stop any medication (fina) that ur Doc gave u while on any steroid than the choice is urs" - so your telling people to use fina with any gear regardless of the thousands of posts from people who have experienced adverse effects over the years of doing exactly that, not to mention all of the scientific/medical evidence to support the reasons why this would happen. good idea!
Click to expand...

HAHA! never laughed so much.......i think is becoming ridiculous why do i need to prove 'my point' ??? What do i earn? Mate do u think they pay me for you becoming bald????

:FRlol:

I said what I know and i thought doing that i would help lots of people not losing their hair if they decide to try nandrolone...then as i said millon of times i give the information then you can use or not.....

about the loss of libido that is another issue which sincerely i need to try to find out; but for people like me that value having hair and gain from nandrolone a little loss of libido for 8-9 weks or whatever (i read a good thread here how to avoid loss of libido using only deca) is a price to pay.

They told me that i would have lost my libido using finasteride and actually i am using since 1992 and no effects at all actually i am always horny that is my problems :chomp:

i am not an expert in steroids but i know few things about supplements; when i try NPP and finasteride i will use tribex gold of biotest 4-6 a days 5 days on 2 off (very expensive company but every time i tested their products they worked). One guy which was using high dose of anavar was using tribex and did not experience any problem in libido

now knowing the types of people in this thread please do not start about tribulus read first this thread
http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showthread.php? p=6954776#post6954776

actually i come clean i need to confess i have been paid by an organization that wants you becoming all bald from the combo nandrolone-finasteride; they pay a % for each hair you will lose :laugh2:
 
matty420 said:
i just woke up and i briefly read through these posts.. the hairloss issue is a myth? i completely disagree. i'm mid cycle right now, and i'm shedding again.. just like i do 4 weeks into every cycle, and will be for six weeks after the cycle.
Click to expand...

so you are using finasteride and nandrolone only? When did you start finasteride ? and now much nandrolone you are using?
 
Interesting thread........I used finasteride for 8yrs or more and found that last year i was shedding alot. switched to dutasteride 2 months ago the shedding stopped. 12 days ago i started 500mg wk test-e and 250deca . i will run the test 10wk, deca 8. and i will be watching for excessive shedding. i'm 53, use minox and this is my first cycle.
 
ole farte' said:
Interesting thread........I used finasteride for 8yrs or more and found that last year i was shedding alot. switched to dutasteride 2 months ago the shedding stopped. 12 days ago i started 500mg wk test-e and 250deca . i will run the test 10wk, deca 8. and i will be watching for excessive shedding. i'm 53, use minox and this is my first cycle.
Click to expand...

may advice you for your safety to use this combo

minox-azelaic acid

spironolactone 5 %

and to continue duta
 
just4kuts said:
I'v heard doing deca and fina at the same time distroy the libido even with test boosters it takes months to come back. here is a link where u can buy spiro in the U.S. http://www.minoxidil.com/ if you use spiro and minoxidil u have to time it right if they are mixed it smells like rotten eggs. from what i've read u can drop azelic acid flakes into a bottle of minoxidil and make what they sell at site for $30 they sell the flakes at www.fishersci.com. i usually buy 4 bottes of minoxidil 5% at costco for $20 then drop 2 or 3ml of flakes in, mix and let it sit for 24 hours before use. hope this helps save some $$$.
Click to expand...


How important is the azelick acid? Ive been using topical minoxodil alone. Do I Really need the acid?
 
stressman13 said:
How important is the azelick acid? Ive been using topical minoxodil alone. Do I Really need the acid?
Click to expand...

It is common practice prescribe azelaic acid and minoxidil together all dermatologists doing so and this is the reason (from my first post)

I think that the best single product for preventing and reversing MPB is 5% minoxidil / 5% azelaic acid promotes hair growth and prevents the synthesis of DHT in the scalp.
 
had a bit of time did few further research and i have found this post on the hair loss help forums (one of the largest one)


Friday April 05, 2002 3:03 PM


4inguy, Deca will not make u lose any hair, and I know this for experience. I went through a deca cycle about 6 months ago while on propecia. When I started with deca I had already gained about 20 pounds from some non steroidal pills that I took called cyproheptadine. I didn't gain one pound with deca and I always thought this was because I had already put a lot of weight on and I was on a plateu, but soul said that propecia would hinder ur gains??? Sould where did you read that? I always heard it wasnt a good idea take both because of ur hair but not because it would hinder ur gains. By the way d-bol is not mild on the hair at all! Go into a dbol cycle and you'll be bald in 1 month... not really but, I wouldnt do it seriously.
4inguy... EliteFitness.com<<< A site about everything related to steroids, go there, they have a message board. I recommend you use their search engine to search for previous posts about this matter cause this is definitely not the nicest site on the internet. They will either not answer you or call you a newbie. By the way they will try to brain wash you and make u go into cycle with megadoses of test plus deca plus d-bol plus everything else, you'll be dealing with genetic freaks in there... not good for ur health and most important your hair...
Good luck bro.

obviously the focus here is not if propecia hindered the deca gains but the use of propecia with deca that did not make him to lose his hair

by the way the finasteride myth which hindered gains is a myth i am using it now and start my cycle of anavar at 80-81 kg now i am 85,5 and 3 % of fat .
down
 
Last edited:
hi folks

i have mpb hair recession and thinning


i use anywhere from 250 to 750 test and take 2,5mg finasteride twice a day


is this a good strategt? is minoxidil really relevant?


please help me i dont want to be bald
 
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