The IRA

[Rex]

Can anyone give me some information on the Irish Republican Army. In the past week I have read Jack Higgin's "Season In Hell" which had the IRA in it. I just started Patriot Games which also involved the IRA. Figured if I had some background knowledge on them I'd better understand the books.

 

[bluepeter]

I don't but read all of Higgins books on this type of thing if you're interested. They're great.

 

[Rex]

I finished The Night of the Fox a few weeks ago by Higgins. Great book. I was going to get the Eagle Has Flown, but it's a sequel and they don't sell the Eagle Has Landed on base.

The book store here sucks dick. I can't find the Illiad, Makavelli, or much else. I finished all of Mario Puzo's collection with the exception of a few I can't find in store. Tom Clancy's material is sometimes dry and dragged out. Though I'm finding Patriot Games to be good.

Any other authors or novels you would suggest. Few things are better than getting lost in a good book.

 

[Mandinka2]

I finished The Night of the Fox a few weeks ago by Higgins. Great book. I was going to get the Eagle Has Flown, but it's a sequel and they don't sell the Eagle Has Landed on base.

The book store here sucks dick. I can't find the Illiad, Makavelli, or much else. I finished all of Mario Puzo's collection with the exception of a few I can't find in store. Tom Clancy's material is sometimes dry and dragged out. Though I'm finding Patriot Games to be good.

Any other authors or novels you would suggest. Few things are better than getting lost in a good book.

What do you need to know ? The organisation has splintered so many times that it's completely unrecognisable from what it started out as (the civil war in 1921 changing it completely for example).

 

[theoak01]

http://www.freewebs.com/irishrepublicanarmy/

here is a brief overview explaining how they have splintered etc and what they originally were

 

[Dante Alighieri]

Fenian scum . UVF 1690 For God and for Ulster UVF 1690. Quis Seperabit

 

[Wrongun]

Here you go

http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/war/troubles/factfiles/rira.shtml

Wrongun!

 

[Razorguns]

most ex-IRA's are living here in the US now actually.

 

[Wrongun]

most ex-IRA's are living here in the US now actually.

Its where as lot of the funding comes from that is for sure!

Wrongun!

 

[Mandinka2]

Bullshit , most of the IRA's funding comes from organised crime.

 

[theoak01]

Bullshit , most of the IRA's funding comes from organised crime.

exactly

Dante Alighieri your a idiot ,that is all

 

[The_Ghost]

Good links, I love reading about this stuff and getting different view of what went on.

My Nana used to tell me stories of what it was like growing up in Belfast. Scary stuff.

St Patty's day next week, time to celebrate part of who I am

 

[theoak01]

good stuff Bigdawg,Im going to have a few pints of Guinness myself while listening to some irish pipers

you got a kilt big man? if so its time to don it

 

[The_Ghost]

good stuff Bigdawg,Im going to have a few pints of Guinness myself while listening to some irish pipers

you got a kilt big man? if so its time to don it

no that's one thing I don't have. Gotta get me one sometime soon though.

 

[theoak01]

sportkilt.com sells nice cheaper models if ya arent into blowing 500+,and they are comfy also and various tartans

 

[Hojo]

Can anyone give me some information on the Irish Republican Army. In the past week I have read Jack Higgin's "Season In Hell" which had the IRA in it. I just started Patriot Games which also involved the IRA. Figured if I had some background knowledge on them I'd better understand the books.

Scum is all they have ever been or ever will be.

 

[theoak01]

Scum is all they have ever been or ever will be.

what about the red hand commando's uvf etc...? are they ok in your books

 

[Rex]

Thanks for the links.

Karma for all.

This St. Patrick's Day I turn 20. At first I hated being born on a day that celebrates drinking. Now that I'm older I like it. I'm half Irish, but you'd never know it looking at me b/c I look my father, the Italian.

I found it funny that growing up in a neighborhood where ethnicity was a concern [old neighborhood where the ethnic groups stuck together in Philly] those two get together and had a family. I asked my dad about it. He said "Son, there are few vices you'll come across. Irish women will be one of them". I didn't know what he meant until I fell in love with an Irish girl. No matter how many times she breaks my heart, the fool I am still loves her.

 

[Rex]

I checked out the links.

What actually got them started? Independance from Britain? They broke into so many splinters that I get the impression that it nothing more than a bunch of cells who claim the title IRA.

 

[Mandinka2]

Scum is all they have ever been or ever will be.

Poor understanding of history , almost certainly due to your own prejudices. You will get nowhere and learn nothing with such a view but I suspect that this is not your aim:

Origins:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/war/troubles/origins/partition.shtml
Also look up Michael Collins as well - he was an even greater man than portrayed in the film.

The original IRA was started to GAIN independence from Britain , the modern group started because of oppression from the Unionists in Northen Ireland and collusion with the British security forces. Ironically it was the Catholics/Nationalists who asked that the British Government bring in the army to provide protection for them against the Unionist mobs.

The modern IRA are nothing more than a band of thugs who since they cannot persuade people of their insidious Marxist agenda (reunification of Ireland is only the romantic ideal and a marketing ploy) , take on violent means. In this they are altogether similar to their Unionist counterparts UVF , Shankhill butchers, Red Hand Commando etc. etc.
They (the IRA) control prostitution , drugs and arms North of the border and smuggling South of the border. If the British and Irish governments put both sets of dumbasses behind bars for the remainder of their natural lives (a la Johnny Adair) then no one would rue their passing.

 

[Mandinka2]

Thanks for the links.

Karma for all.

This St. Patrick's Day I turn 20. At first I hated being born on a day that celebrates drinking. Now that I'm older I like it. I'm half Irish, but you'd never know it looking at me b/c I look my father, the Italian.

I found it funny that growing up in a neighborhood where ethnicity was a concern [old neighborhood where the ethnic groups stuck together in Philly] those two get together and had a family. I asked my dad about it. He said "Son, there are few vices you'll come across. Irish women will be one of them". I didn't know what he meant until I fell in love with an Irish girl. No matter how many times she breaks my heart, the fool I am still loves her.

If she breaks your heart then walk away and never go back , Irish women are tremendously tough but they don't sleep around.

 

[Mandinka2]

They broke into so many splinters that I get the impression that it nothing more than a bunch of cells who claim the title IRA.

Correct in the most part , they are mostly a cover for a very organised criminal gang - now hoping to develop political power. Look up the INLA for their more brutal sister organisation. Dominic "Mad Dog" McGlinchey in particular.

 

[The_Ghost]

If she breaks your heart then walk away and never go back , Irish women are tremendously tough but they don't sleep around.

Very true, the half irish girl I used to see was the most loyal woman I have ever seen.

 

[Dante Alighieri]

Dante Alighieri your a idiot ,that is all

I'm thinking of flying over to Boston on St Pat's day and parading around in a black suit + bowler hat, cane and an orange sash along with some of the lads aswell

Loyalists and Republicans, Rangers and Celtic, Protestant and Catholic. The whole bloody thing is a pile of horse shite and living in Glasgow, Scotland I get to see both factions make complete arses of themselves daily (usually stupid chav teenagers going around tooled up with knives, hammers and bats, wearing England, Ireland, Celtic or Rangers football tops and taunting each other. They shout shite like "Erin go bragh" and "Quis Separabit" and they haven't a clue what they're on about). Come to the shitty parts of Glasgow or Belfast and see the sons of these cities - a few days here and ideas such as nationality and religion will disgust you.

Seriously though, Rex, try reading Nelson DeMille's novel Cathedral. It's an excellent fictional story (with some factual basis/ events) revolving around the IRA. I think you'd quite like it.

 

[Rex]

If she breaks your heart then walk away and never go back , Irish women are tremendously tough but they don't sleep around.

Being away all the time doesn't make the me number one contender for the boyfriend of the year award. The Marine Corps keeps me away from her. I'm kept occupied to the point where I go to work, eat, sleep, and do it again. She deserves more than what I can give right now. She is loyal though. Had the "balls" to end it instead of cheating on me and leading me to believe that we're still together.

We're still young though so maybe we'll get it right some day.

My mother is 100% Irish, she cheated on my dad. Great mother, awful wife in the end.

Dante, I'll see if I can find Cathedral at the book store tomorrow when I pass through the other camp. Thanks.

 

[Mandinka2]

My mother is 100% Irish, she cheated on my dad. Great mother, awful wife in the end.

Sould have been put head first into a pot of boiling tar for letting the side down like that.

 

[Rex]

Sould have been put head first into a pot of boiling tar for letting the side down like that.

My grandmother (her mother) was/is seriously pissed about it. Happened almost 13 years ago. She tells me dad everytime she talks to him, and me when talking about him "I don't care how long Rick and Elaine have been divorced. Rick will always be my son. Elaine was stupid for doing what she did and got what she deserved".

I held a grudge against my mom for the longest time about the affair. My dad talked to me about it and made me realize she was an awful wife at the end, but not my wife. She is a great mother, and that much is true. It doesn't change what she did, or that I love her. I just won't go to her for marital advice.

 

[Mandinka2]

My grandmother (her mother) was/is seriously pissed about it. Happened almost 13 years ago. She tells me dad everytime she talks to him, and me when talking about him "I don't care how long Rick and Elaine have been divorced. Rick will always be my son. Elaine was stupid for doing what she did and got what she deserved".

I held a grudge against my mom for the longest time about the affair. My dad talked to me about it and made me realize she was an awful wife at the end, but not my wife. She is a great mother, and that much is true. It doesn't change what she did, or that I love her. I just won't go to her for marital advice.

Back in the old country , a long time ago , people weren't quite as forgiving - and that went equally for men too. That must be a very very hard thing for any son to know about his mother. Sorry for your (and your ol man's) pain man.

 

[The_Ghost]

My grandmother (her mother) was/is seriously pissed about it. Happened almost 13 years ago. She tells me dad everytime she talks to him, and me when talking about him "I don't care how long Rick and Elaine have been divorced. Rick will always be my son. Elaine was stupid for doing what she did and got what she deserved".

I held a grudge against my mom for the longest time about the affair. My dad talked to me about it and made me realize she was an awful wife at the end, but not my wife. She is a great mother, and that much is true. It doesn't change what she did, or that I love her. I just won't go to her for marital advice.

My Nana was the same way with her loyalty, my mother kicked my Nana's son, my Dad, out for cheating and to my Nana, my Mom was always her daugther. Even after my Dad got remarried, my Mom was still first in her heart until the day she passed. Wasn't a visit I had with her that she didn't want an update on my Mom. The loyalty part of me I definetly got from my Nana, the stubborn part to LOL.

 

[Y_lifter]

Irish were Mostly Catholics in the old days and Independent from the Brits
Brits were mostly Protestant(church of england) and came into Ireland all full of themselves to *help*
Irish say "We don't need your help thank you very much.."

Catholics(irish) and Protestants(british) started hating and killing each other

fast forward a hundred years to today...

 

[Dante Alighieri]

Scum is all they have ever been or ever will be.

You know I'm right

 

[Mandinka2]

You know I'm right

LOL at BIG IAIN!

 

[Hojo]

Irish were Mostly Catholics in the old days and Independent from the Brits
Brits were mostly Protestant(church of england) and came into Ireland all full of themselves to *help*
Irish say "We don't need your help thank you very much.."

Catholics(irish) and Protestants(british) started hating and killing each other

fast forward a hundred years to today...

Thats a load off shit the Irish have never been independent. The bulk off the protestants there Scotish or north Irish, Ireland was ruled by the Irishs kings for the english crown the Irish where put down not by the english but by their Irish over lords. O,Neil who rulled over the north in 1641 and lead a revolt against the protestants in the north which was the spark that set off the english civil war. Who was after the revolt left in power to run the place for the english.

Before they were roman catholics they where more like protestants, this was long before the protestants started up in germany. Rome didn't like the irish form off christianity which was started by st patrick and ordered the english to make changes just like they ordered the french to make changes.




BIG IAIN is the daddy now so stick your Irishness up you ass because we don't want it.

 

[Mandinka2]

Thats a load off shit the Irish have never been independent. The bulk off the protestants there Scotish or north Irish, Ireland was ruled by the Irishs kings for the english crown the Irish where put down not by the english but by their Irish over lords. O,Neil who rulled over the north in 1641 and lead a revolt against the protestants in the north which was the spark that set off the english civil war. Who was after the revolt left in power to run the place for the english.

Before they were roman catholics they where more like protestants, this was long before the protestants started up in germany. Rome didn't like the irish form off christianity which was started by st patrick and ordered the english to make changes just like they ordered the french to make changes.




BIG IAIN is the daddy now so stick your Irishness up you ass because we don't want it.

First of all are you literate?
Secondly where in God's name did you get this specimen of historical and grammatical falsity? :"O,Neil who rulled over the north in 1641 and lead a revolt against the protestants in the north which was the spark that set off the english civil war. Who was after the revolt left in power to run the place for the english. "
I suggest you find yourself a vat of chloroform and donate yourself to a museum.

 

[theoak01]

I think we all can agree that without the IRA Catholics in the north would not have the rights they do today,they would be treated like garbage by the protestants,and now considering most of NI is catholic it will only be a matter of time before this hatred stops

will NI every be part of NI I dont know,but the IRA is certainly trying to work with the North by holding its cease fire, this shows they are more then the scum most claim they are,and they do want peace. Now the RIRA and groups of those likes are scum bastards.

 

[Y_lifter]

Thats a load off shit the Irish have never been independent. The bulk off the protestants there Scotish or north Irish, Ireland was ruled by the Irishs kings for the english crown the Irish where put down not by the english but by their Irish over lords. O,Neil who rulled over the north in 1641 and lead a revolt against the protestants in the north which was the spark that set off the english civil war. Who was after the revolt left in power to run the place for the english.

Before they were roman catholics they where more like protestants, this was long before the protestants started up in germany. Rome didn't like the irish form off christianity which was started by st patrick and ordered the english to make changes just like they ordered the french to make changes.

BIG IAIN is the daddy now so stick your Irishness up you ass because we don't want it.

WOW !

I was just being funny I thought...

Sorry to offend you Ghalic sensibilities broly...

 

[Mandinka2]

I think we all can agree that without the IRA Catholics in the north would not have the rights they do today,they would be treated like garbage by the protestants,and now considering most of NI is catholic it will only be a matter of time before this hatred stops

will NI every be part of NI I dont know,but the IRA is certainly trying to work with the North by holding its cease fire, this shows they are more then the scum most claim they are,and they do want peace. Now the RIRA and groups of those likes are scum bastards.

My brother , there is some truth to what you say but if you knew the level of lying and deceit that is at the very heart of the IRA's leadership then you might not consider them "good" people and they are certainly not "working" for peace , they are working to make themselves rich. The RIRA is nothing more than the disenfranchised splinter part of the IRA , the guys who didnt get much (or enough) in the carve-up.
Don't get fooled by the romantic notion of re-unification , that will happen as soon as the Unionists come to their senses and realise that they are killing their children's chance for a future. But whether before or after reunification , the IRA will have to be dismantled.

 

[Robert Jan]

Hm. They want northern ireland to become a part of Ireland dont they

 

[Hojo]

First of all are you literate?
Secondly where in God's name did you get this specimen of historical and grammatical falsity? :"O,Neil who rulled over the north in 1641 and lead a revolt against the protestants in the north which was the spark that set off the english civil war. Who was after the revolt left in power to run the place for the english. "
I suggest you find yourself a vat of chloroform and donate yourself to a museum.

Where did you get yours?

Here a few links to Irish history you will never here the IRA shouting about, the Irish have reaped what they have sown. Like I saided always have been scum always will be.(That goes for the uff/uda rhc lvf) The UVF was not always scum but today they are.

http://www.ferdinando.org.uk/timeline/1641.htm

http://www.scotchirish.net/1641.php4

http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/timelines/ni/rebellion_1641.shtml

http://mamaynooth.freeservers.com/colonial ulster.htm

http://www.battlehill395.freeserve.co.uk/corrs bridge.htm

The Irish where down troden in the north form 1641 and to this very day have never been trusted. They have only themselfs to blame.

 

[Hojo]

I think we all can agree that without the IRA Catholics in the north would not have the rights they do today,they would be treated like garbage by the protestants,and now considering most of NI is catholic it will only be a matter of time before this hatred stops

will NI every be part of NI I dont know,but the IRA is certainly trying to work with the North by holding its cease fire, this shows they are more then the scum most claim they are,and they do want peace. Now the RIRA and groups of those likes are scum bastards.

The north is not mostly catholic and they where treated like shit by the protestants because off the genoicide they infelted on the protestants.

 

[Dante Alighieri]

WOW !

I was just being funny I thought...

Sorry to offend you Ghalic sensibilities broly...

I found you amusing

Some people are taking their nationality/ religion somewhat more seriously than usual, what with St pat's coming up and what not.

The bottom line is, both paramilitary factions are not wanted, the Irish are cracking folk, make love not war blah de blah de blah.

 

[Mandinka2]

Where did you get yours?

Here a few links to Irish history you will never here the IRA shouting about, the Irish have reaped what they have sown. Like I saided always have been scum always will be.(That goes for the uff/uda rhc lvf) The UVF was not always scum but today they are.

http://www.ferdinando.org.uk/timeline/1641.htm

http://www.scotchirish.net/1641.php4

http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/timelines/ni/rebellion_1641.shtml

http://mamaynooth.freeservers.com/colonial ulster.htm

http://www.battlehill395.freeserve.co.uk/corrs bridge.htm

The Irish where down troden in the north form 1641 and to this very day have never been trusted. They have only themselfs to blame.

That Scottish Irish one is a laugh alright! A logo with a pic of Northern Ireland and a red hand over it!!!!
As a matter of historical fact Ireland WAS INDEPENDENT prior to 1066.
If you had bothered to pay attention in school you would have learned about the Brehon laws and the Ard Riotha na hEireann , or the high kings of Ireland which WERE NOT SUBJECTS of any Englishman.

In fact some of your own links serve to prove you are a conceited imbecile equally incapable of eloquence and grammar in either of the language of the land your forefathers "settled" or the one you cling to like the last vestige of grace that you will be allowed:
"Native Irish

The late sixteenth century attempt to diminish the powers of the Gaelic lords in EU was by reducing their landholding, making their title to land dependent on the queen and lessening their influence over their followers so that they would no longer be guaranteed an army to follow them into rebellion. This was carried into the 17th c. In 1605, LD Chichester issued a proclamation that all the inhabitants of Ulster were free and subjects of the king rather than of any lord. Contractual nature of landlord-tenant relationship evolved.

By early 17th c., the only native Irish family with substantial power base in EU was Magennis. Worried about his title to his land, Sir Arthur Magennis actually requested surrender and regrant in 1605. Immediately seized by authorities as chance to weaken his power: thirteen of his biggest freeholders were made to hold their land directly from the crown.

Crown also attempted to bring the natives to ‘civility’ by having some of their sons educated in England. Mixed results. By 1641, the natives were under control and were declining in importance as they were forced to sell and mortgage their lands to meet increasing debts.

"
ON a final point sites hosted by the Orange order have about as much credibility as those hosted by hOglaigh na hEireann.

The north is not mostly catholic and they where treated like shit by the protestants because off the genoicide they infelted on the protestants.

"Because" of the genocide ??? Say pal , what part of Scotland did Irishmen "settle" ??? Your ancestors came and TOOK that land and BUTCHERED those people . I am no IRA supporter but would not hesitate to remind the likes of you that you are standing on a piece of IRELAND and if you are so bothered by its rightful owners daughters and sons you would do well to start swimming now. Like it or not the clock is ticking for clowns like yourself.

"Numbers of Protestants and Catholics are closer than ever before. The 2001 survey showed that just under 46% of the province's 1.7 million people considered themselves Protestant and 40% Catholic, while almost 14% did not disclose their religion.

Statisticians allocated 7% of these to the Protestant community and 4% to the Catholic, making the adjusted figures 53% Protestant 44% Catholic.
"
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Northern_Ireland/Story/0,2763,863453,00.html

 

[Hojo]

That Scottish Irish one is a laugh alright! A logo with a pic of Northern Ireland and a red hand over it!!!!
As a matter of historical fact Ireland WAS INDEPENDENT prior to 1066.
If you had bothered to pay attention in school you would have learned about the Brehon laws and the Ard Riotha na hEireann , or the high kings of Ireland which WERE NOT SUBJECTS of any Englishman.

In fact some of your own links serve to prove you are a conceited imbecile equally incapable of eloquence and grammar in either of the language of the land your forefathers "settled" or the one you cling to like the last vestige of grace that you will be allowed:
"Native Irish

The late sixteenth century attempt to diminish the powers of the Gaelic lords in EU was by reducing their landholding, making their title to land dependent on the queen and lessening their influence over their followers so that they would no longer be guaranteed an army to follow them into rebellion. This was carried into the 17th c. In 1605, LD Chichester issued a proclamation that all the inhabitants of Ulster were free and subjects of the king rather than of any lord. Contractual nature of landlord-tenant relationship evolved.

By early 17th c., the only native Irish family with substantial power base in EU was Magennis. Worried about his title to his land, Sir Arthur Magennis actually requested surrender and regrant in 1605. Immediately seized by authorities as chance to weaken his power: thirteen of his biggest freeholders were made to hold their land directly from the crown.

Crown also attempted to bring the natives to ‘civility’ by having some of their sons educated in England. Mixed results. By 1641, the natives were under control and were declining in importance as they were forced to sell and mortgage their lands to meet increasing debts.

"
ON a final point sites hosted by the Orange order have about as much credibility as those hosted by hOglaigh na hEireann.

"Because" of the genocide ??? Say pal , what part of Scotland did Irishmen "settle" ??? Your ancestors came and TOOK that land and BUTCHERED those people . I am no IRA supporter but would not hesitate to remind the likes of you that you are standing on a piece of IRELAND and if you are so bothered by its rightful owners daughters and sons you would do well to start swimming now. Like it or not the clock is ticking for clowns like yourself.

"Numbers of Protestants and Catholics are closer than ever before. The 2001 survey showed that just under 46% of the province's 1.7 million people considered themselves Protestant and 40% Catholic, while almost 14% did not disclose their religion.

Statisticians allocated 7% of these to the Protestant community and 4% to the Catholic, making the adjusted figures 53% Protestant 44% Catholic.
"
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Northern_Ireland/Story/0,2763,863453,00.html

The scots where an irish tribe that defeated the pix in the south off scotland, the scots came form ulster.

Do you realy think that growth off the catholic community is going to grow more now than that off the protestants? Not very many people now-a-days in the north live in poverty, catholic family sizes are getting smaller in a few years time it may very well be the other way round. Also the Protestant have not been fighting in to many costly wars off late. Also add to this the immigrant from over seas and the fall in people trying to get away from the troubles. You may well be very dissappointed that a united ireland is not going to happen, now that down south has got its house in order alot off catholic may well start moving back down south in look for look. I have also noticed that a lot off english people are moving over here in search off cheaper living. So all in all you view off the north seems some what clouded.



I'll give you a clue its not about prods and taig is all about nationality alway has been always will. I myself have never been christen, I don't subscribe at any chruch popist or other wise but I'm british 100% Irish 0%. If any Irish man trys to change that I'll take up arms.

 

[theoak01]

Mandinka,I do agree they will eventually have to go,and they arent good ,but I see them as no worse then the other organizations,atleast for now the killing has stopped

from our conversations you know where I stand on this whole topic,I just dont think discussing it in this thread will benefit anyone and will be a a mud slinging match

 

[Mandinka2]

The scots where an irish tribe that defeated the pix in the south off scotland, the scots came form ulster.

Do you realy think that growth off the catholic community is going to grow more now than that off the protestants? Not very many people now-a-days in the north live in poverty, catholic family sizes are getting smaller in a few years time it may very well be the other way round. Also the Protestant have not been fighting in to many costly wars off late. Also add to this the immigrant from over seas and the fall in people trying to get away from the troubles. You may well be very dissappointed that a united ireland is not going to happen, now that down south has got its house in order alot off catholic may well start moving back down south in look for look. I have also noticed that a lot off english people are moving over here in search off cheaper living. So all in all you view off the north seems some what clouded.

So now you are saying that Ulster was not planted by Scotsmen from Scotland???? You are a joke pal.
Northern Ireland is a fucking financial eyesore on the island of Ireland, you were so busy beating the tits off each other that you forgot the more important things.... like the economy. Britain does not want you as opinion pole after pole has shown and whats more we will not TAKE you unless you cop yourselves on. I have NEVER heard of an Irish family moving North of the border but know many who moved South to get away from Orange intimidation.

I'll give you a clue its not about prods and taig is all about nationality alway has been always will. I myself have never been christen, I don't subscribe at any chruch popist or other wise but I'm british 100% Irish 0%. If any Irish man trys to change that I'll take up arms.

Of course it's got nothing to do with religion - less than 5% of Prods attend church regularly in the North! I'm not surprised you've never been ChristenED. It makes perfect sense since you've never been educatED. Listen you illiterate mentally challenged political ostrich , the quality of your posts are a perfect indication of your education which is a damn good indicator of the state of Northern Ireland and the gulf that has opened up between it and its VASTLY more successful parent nation south of the border. Your idol Big Ian Paisley (June 23rd 1991 - "Sunday Life" newspaper)has even gone on record as saying that he is an Irishman : " I would never repudiate the fact that I am an Irishman " which kinda throws your percentages off a little.
Dumbass.

 

[Mandinka2]

Mandinka,I do agree they will eventually have to go,and they arent good ,but I see them as no worse then the other organizations,atleast for now the killing has stopped

from our conversations you know where I stand on this whole topic,I just dont think discussing it in this thread will benefit anyone and will be a a mud slinging match

They are worse Oak , they are worse because they are more organised and the leaders are clever men , not just hate filled psychopaths a la the Shankhill Butchers. These guys are not in this for the short term thing - they want a Marxist state - and to be honest with you if you cannot defend your views against an individual who can barely string a full sentence together then what hope is there for your views and hopes to prevail?

 

[theoak01]

you do hold a good point,I just dont see how slinging mud on here would ever get me anywhere,both views on all this are stubborn as hell and think they are right.

 

[Mandinka2]

you do hold a good point,I just dont see how slinging mud on here would ever get me anywhere,both views on all this are stubborn as hell and think they are right.

Oak , you know that Im not a hardliner here , hell , Im barely nationalist! As far as I'm concerned Northern Ireland can slide further into the economic abyss rather than cop itself on... doesnt change whose land it was/is , he knows it , I know it and the vast majority of his "British" know it.

 

[theoak01]

I know where you stand bro and I have learned a ton from our conversations,stuff I would have never learned before,and Im thankful for having the chance to talk about such things with you.

as for this guy,your right ,he is very uneducated and doesnt know his arse from a hole in the ground,nor history or the english language

NI will eventually come around like we have discussed,when they have absolutley nothing and cant feed or house themselves

I also dont understand why they are so loyal to britain when they dont give two licks about them

 

[Hojo]

Oak , you know that Im not a hardliner here , hell , Im barely nationalist! As far as I'm concerned Northern Ireland can slide further into the economic abyss rather than cop itself on... doesnt change whose land it was/is , he knows it , I know it and the vast majority of his "British" know it.

An economic abyss was part off the IRA goal in destroy the north, it worked a bit back in the 80s but things have moved on. I very much dout that you have been up north in the last few years, if you were you would know that its far from an economic abyss.


TheOak01
"I also dont understand why they are so loyal to britain when they dont give two licks about them"

We are loyal to britain because that is what we are british, but yet again there would not be too many people upset if we broke away to form an indepentant Ulster. In many ways that may be the only way to sort out the mess, you want the brits out and we want the Irish out. You can never have a united ireland if up north the prods don't want it, we will make what the IRA did look like childs play.

 

[The_Ghost]

An economic abyss was part off the IRA goal in destroy the north, it worked a bit back in the 80s but things have moved on. I very much dout that you have been up north in the last few years, if you were you would know that its far from an economic abyss.


TheOak01
"I also dont understand why they are so loyal to britain when they dont give two licks about them"

We are loyal to britain because that is what we are british, but yet again there would not be too many people upset if we broke away to form an indepentant Ulster. In many ways that may be the only way to sort out the mess, you want the brits out and we want the Irish out. You can never have a united ireland if up north the prods don't want it, we will make what the IRA did look like childs play.

You want the Irish out. The country belongs to the Irish!!! Not Britan.

If the same shit happened here in Canada I would be the first in line to whip British asses back to Britan.

 

[Dante Alighieri]

We are loyal to britain because that is what we are british, but yet again there would not be too many people upset if we broke away to form an indepentant Ulster. In many ways that may be the only way to sort out the mess, you want the brits out and we want the Irish out. You can never have a united ireland if up north the prods don't want it, we will make what the IRA did look like childs play.

Look mate, we don't want Ulster. As far as I'm concerned the Irish can have it back and turn it into a great place like the rest of the Republic. If you folks up in the North, who hold British passports, consider themselves British and speaking English, fancy being relocated to places on mainland Britain, then that would be grand - better to have British passport holding, fluent English speaking folk swamping into Britain than all those "refugees". Afterall, you're rightfully the Queen's subjects .

I don't see any problem with my idea, though it wouldn't work, as you're hell bent on being pains in the arses and fighting and killing each other, rather than seeking a higher quality of living. I got another hardcore Loyalist, Ian Paisley loving mate in Norn Iron aswell - once you relocate to Glasgow we can hit the pubs and even watch Rangers getting mauled

 

[Mandinka2]

we will make what the IRA did look like childs play.

which would make you in your own words:


scum

 

[Hojo]

which would make you in your own words:


scum

Very true if we can't have it we will do just as the IRA has done and do are best to destroy it.


Dante Alighieri
"Look mate, we don't want Ulster"

You don't have Ulster we do and its us who want to keep it. If Westminster had have keep its nose out off it, the problems would have been sorted out long ago.

Bigdawg1468
"You want the Irish out. The country belongs to the Irish!!! Not Britan".

No the country belongs to us, the Irish can claim all they like. We have it and we will not give it up. The prods have learned one thing from the IRA and that is the only thing that matters is violence, both goverments bend over backwards to the threat off it and sideline anyone who refrains form it. If the troubles ever startup again the rule off law is going to have a very hard time stop the loyalist because the unionists have lost all faith in it.

 

[theoak01]

Hojo,if your British then you best have a talk with alot of your fellow countrymen about what they consider themselves,all of the NI I have talked to except you consider themselves Irish not British

 

[Wrongun]

Bullshit , most of the IRA's funding comes from organised crime.

I said a lot of funding comes from the USA i did NOT i repeat NOT say most of funding.

Just thought i would put the record straight

Wrongun!

 

[Hojo]

Hojo,if your British then you best have a talk with alot of your fellow countrymen about what they consider themselves,all of the NI I have talked to except you consider themselves Irish not British

Look I live in belfast and yes there are people who consider themselfs Irish but they are not my fellow countrymen. I know its hard to grasp that not everyone who lives on this rock is Irish but that is just the way it is.

If you don't mind tell me where do you live? I ask cause it very clear that you not form here as you have a very simplistic view off the main issues.

 

[Mandinka2]

I said a lot of funding comes from the USA i did NOT i repeat NOT say most of funding.

Just thought i would put the record straight

Wrongun!

You're right man , I take it back and respectfully apologise , not much money stems from NORAID these days in relative terms - the takings from crime are so enormous , they also have some semi-legitimate businesses on both sides of the border.
Whilst I detest these people I do understand how people can get worked up with bitter attitudes like this Hojo individual.

 

[Mandinka2]

Look I live in belfast and yes there are people who consider themselfs Irish but they are not my fellow countrymen. I know its hard to grasp that not everyone who lives on this rock is Irish but that is just the way it is.

If you don't mind tell me where do you live? I ask cause it very clear that you not form here as you have a very simplistic view off the main issues.

His views seem infinitely more logical and informed than yours - not even big Ian considers himself not Irish , you're just too bitter to want to see it. Rather than let the other side have its day in the sun (and we're not too fond of some of that crowd either in the South) and get on with more important issues , you'd rather burn it to the ground. Your entire raison d'etre is a policy of opposition - you do not care really if you continue to be a "part of Britain" so long as you cannot be a part of Ireland.

 

[Hojo]

His views seem infinitely more logical and informed than yours - not even big Ian considers himself not Irish , you're just too bitter to want to see it. Rather than let the other side have its day in the sun (and we're not too fond of some of that crowd either in the South) and get on with more important issues , you'd rather burn it to the ground. Your entire raison d'etre is a policy of opposition - you do not care really if you continue to be a "part of Britain" so long as you cannot be a part of Ireland.

TheOak01 views are a mirror off your own let me quote him
"I know where you stand bro and I have learned a ton from our conversations,stuff I would have never learned before,and Im thankful for having the chance to talk about such things with you". Poor young lad doesn't have a clue.

Bitter well that was what I was born into 30 years off republician violent opposition. Big Ian is a cleaver man and at times says what ever he needs to said to get what hes after, he is probly after the first minister job so as to be the head of NI before he dies. Your wasting your time trying to tell me what I am, I view republicians as the enemy and nationalists with great distrust and they view us in the same light. Where your going wrong is to think that we are Irish a very long time ago are grandfathers were but all the generations born after the start off the troubles view themselfs as ulsterman/british. Before the troubles we all use to live togetter and it could be saided that we where one(the working class we all hard it bad). It was not like that every where but it was slowly changing, the change was not the result off the IRA but the changes happening all around the world. It they had have keep the opposition peaceful they may even have got the united Ireland, ratter funny thinking that the IRAs main goal could have become if they never existed.

Back to the IRA why do you think they called the ceasefire?

 

[Mandinka2]

TheOak01 views are a mirror off your own let me quote him
"I know where you stand bro and I have learned a ton from our conversations,stuff I would have never learned before,and Im thankful for having the chance to talk about such things with you". Poor young lad doesn't have a clue.

Bitter well that was what I was born into 30 years off republician violent opposition. Big Ian is a cleaver man and at times says what ever he needs to said to get what hes after, he is probly after the first minister job so as to be the head of NI before he dies. Your wasting your time trying to tell me what I am, I view republicians as the enemy and nationalists with great distrust and they view us in the same light. Where your going wrong is to think that we are Irish a very long time ago are grandfathers were but all the generations born after the start off the troubles view themselfs as ulsterman/british. Before the troubles we all use to live togetter and it could be saided that we where one(the working class we all hard it bad). It was not like that every where but it was slowly changing, the change was not the result off the IRA but the changes happening all around the world. It they had have keep the opposition peaceful they may even have got the united Ireland, ratter funny thinking that the IRAs main goal could have become if they never existed.

Back to the IRA why do you think they called the ceasefire?

Doesn't have a clue? Unlike you , you poor son of a bitch who's been fed nothing but a diet of lies and propoganda from day 1,Oak is from a neutral country - he knows what he sees , reads and hears from folks close to him and even a little bit from myself. As I worte above I am NOT a nationalist - Northern Ireland is failed land as far as I'm concerned - I'm against it's integration at the present moment because people like you would only drag it down.
And you have an interesting point - the difference between Sinn Fein supporters and the loyalist working classes is miniscule - but rather than simply getting on with bettering their lives together they chose to subvert each other - their only comfort coming from knowing of the other's discomfort. Quite frankly it's bizarre - it's obvious you're both Irish since only the Irish could fight so bitterly amongst themselves.
Why do I think the IRA called the ceasefire ? Well I think that the republican leadership felt that there were real political and commercial opportunities up for grabs at the time and the Unionist parties selling point to their electorate was simply "No" , in fact the party who seems to shout "No" the loudest seems to do best in the North. It's not a question of capitulation , it's a question of recognising that you are slowly sinking into a deeper pile of your own shit (relative to the rest of the country). I've been to the North many times , even as a schoolboy my old school tried to arrange an exchange with a Protestant school in the North under "Co-operation North" - none would take us , in the end we went to a school in South Armagh - bandit country and we saw who the foot soldiers of the IRA were - mostly disaffected unthinking uneducated people. And that is the problem - you do not WISH to even engage in real dialogue , despite the fact that there are quite a number of Protestants in the South who Catholics have no problem with - they are just like us - no different. WE DON'T CARE - we have moved on and so should you. In the end I hope that a unified Europe will solve all of this.

There is no place in the whole island of Ireland that the IRA are more villified than the South , our own minister of justice Michael McDowell is doing his level best (and a damn sight better than any Northern politician ever did) to bury Sinn Fein. Adams is lying about his membership of the army council , we all know it.

 

[theoak01]

My views are certainly not a Mirror of Mandinka's,he has already stated he isnt a nationalist where I lean more that way,he just presented me with facts,cold hard facts of present information,the rest I learned from my granddad and great granddad,all very supportive of those things,they just grew tired of the bullshit and wanted a better life for the enitre family so they up rooted and came here

 

[Hojo]

Doesn't have a clue? Unlike you , you poor son of a bitch who's been fed nothing but a diet of lies and propoganda from day 1,Oak is from a neutral country - he knows what he sees , reads and hears from folks close to him and even a little bit from myself. As I worte above I am NOT a nationalist - Northern Ireland is failed land as far as I'm concerned - I'm against it's integration at the present moment because people like you would only drag it down.
And you have an interesting point - the difference between Sinn Fein supporters and the loyalist working classes is miniscule - but rather than simply getting on with bettering their lives together they chose to subvert each other - their only comfort coming from knowing of the other's discomfort. Quite frankly it's bizarre - it's obvious you're both Irish since only the Irish could fight so bitterly amongst themselves.
Why do I think the IRA called the ceasefire ? Well I think that the republican leadership felt that there were real political and commercial opportunities up for grabs at the time and the Unionist parties selling point to their electorate was simply "No" , in fact the party who seems to shout "No" the loudest seems to do best in the North. It's not a question of capitulation , it's a question of recognising that you are slowly sinking into a deeper pile of your own shit (relative to the rest of the country). I've been to the North many times , even as a schoolboy my old school tried to arrange an exchange with a Protestant school in the North under "Co-operation North" - none would take us , in the end we went to a school in South Armagh - bandit country and we saw who the foot soldiers of the IRA were - mostly disaffected unthinking uneducated people. And that is the problem - you do not WISH to even engage in real dialogue , despite the fact that there are quite a number of Protestants in the South who Catholics have no problem with - they are just like us - no different. WE DON'T CARE - we have moved on and so should you. In the end I hope that a unified Europe will solve all of this.

There is no place in the whole island of Ireland that the IRA are more villified than the South , our own minister of justice Michael McDowell is doing his level best (and a damn sight better than any Northern politician ever did) to bury Sinn Fein. Adams is lying about his membership of the army council , we all know it.

Like I said the IRA are scum and as Sinn Fein are the mouth off the IRA why should we or why would we want to unite with them as in your words they are "disaffected unthinking uneducated people" at grassroots that is. At the upper levels off the IRA they are very educated clear thinking ruthless people, who kill on mass anyone how trys to stand in their way.

The propoganda that I was brought up on was no propoganda, it was very real. It was bombings, bomb scares, unrest, murder, gunmen and all the rest. That is where the Irishness that you are so keen on was driven out off the unionist/loyalists. It was the murder off are soldiers, police, friends and family that makes us bitter and its that bitterness that with divide Ireland forever(maybe not forever but for a long time yet).

Ask an American to forgive al-Qaeda off 9/11 and you will get that very same bitterness that I hold.

TheOak01 your granddaddy couldn't tell you much about todays Ireland north or south, you may think off it as the old country but NI could very well be younger that him, peace to you dude.

 

[Mandinka2]

Like I said the IRA are scum and as Sinn Fein are the mouth off the IRA why should we or why would we want to unite with them as in your words they are "disaffected unthinking uneducated people" at grassroots that is. At the upper levels off the IRA they are very educated clear thinking ruthless people, who kill on mass anyone how trys to stand in their way.

AS you've already admitted to you're just like them - you would do exactly the same thing as they have done if they were pushing you around. And I'm not exactly talking about you guys joining the IRA , I'm talking about the working classes on both sides of the divide just saying "Fuck this for a game of soldiers" and getting on with making a crust. You are also like them in being "disaffected and unthinking" in that you are STILL bothering with this futile crusade. I've already commented upon your education - Adams is clever I'll give you that , but the other guys , Martin Ferris ??? McGuinness and good Lord save me Mitchell McGloughlin??? None of these guys went far in education , sure they are relatively careful what they say on tv but that's it.
Problem is you've also got some of the dumbest folks imaginable in Peter Robinson et al. in charge of the DUP.

The propoganda that I was brought up on was no propoganda, it was very real. It was bombings, bomb scares, unrest, murder, gunmen and all the rest. That is where the Irishness that you are so keen on was driven out off the unionist/loyalists. It was the murder off are soldiers, police, friends and family that makes us bitter and its that bitterness that with divide Ireland forever(maybe not forever but for a long time yet).

Listen you posted a pile of bullshit on history before , you're not even aware of the long reign of the Ard Riotha na hEireann , you know nothing of the rich culture of Ulster or even Fionn Mac Cuhaill I'll wager. Listen , let me try and help you one more time see the light , you are stuck up there in a small part of the country with a shower of murdering thugs (although you've developed your own) , now we on the other hand in the South get on with folks amongst and we don't give a shit about you or your little handbag fight , which would you feel safer amongst??? Get it through your head that you would be infinitely better off if you gave Sinn Fein what the bastards wanted - they'd be wiped out in the morning - no longer free to moan and bitch about their so called objective of a United Ireland they'd be exposed for the criminal commie pinkos they are. You are your own worst enemies.

Ask an American to forgive al-Qaeda off 9/11 and you will get that very same bitterness that I hold.

TheOak01 your granddaddy couldn't tell you much about todays Ireland north or south, you may think off it as the old country but NI could very well be younger that him, peace to you dude.

You're dumb , put down the colouring books and the crayons and go and have a good think about this whole thing - you'll see that true victory (I'll couch it in terms that you'll understand) is within your grasp.

 

[Hojo]

AS you've already admitted to you're just like them - you would do exactly the same thing as they have done if they were pushing you around. And I'm not exactly talking about you guys joining the IRA , I'm talking about the working classes on both sides of the divide just saying "Fuck this for a game of soldiers" and getting on with making a crust. You are also like them in being "disaffected and unthinking" in that you are STILL bothering with this futile crusade. I've already commented upon your education - Adams is clever I'll give you that , but the other guys , Martin Ferris ??? McGuinness and good Lord save me Mitchell McGloughlin??? None of these guys went far in education , sure they are relatively careful what they say on tv but that's it.
Problem is you've also got some of the dumbest folks imaginable in Peter Robinson et al. in charge of the DUP.



Listen you posted a pile of bullshit on history before , you're not even aware of the long reign of the Ard Riotha na hEireann , you know nothing of the rich culture of Ulster or even Fionn Mac Cuhaill I'll wager. Listen , let me try and help you one more time see the light , you are stuck up there in a small part of the country with a shower of murdering thugs (although you've developed your own) , now we on the other hand in the South get on with folks amongst and we don't give a shit about you or your little handbag fight , which would you feel safer amongst??? Get it through your head that you would be infinitely better off if you gave Sinn Fein what the bastards wanted - they'd be wiped out in the morning - no longer free to moan and bitch about their so called objective of a United Ireland they'd be exposed for the criminal commie pinkos they are. You are your own worst enemies.


You're dumb , put down the colouring books and the crayons and go and have a good think about this whole thing - you'll see that true victory (I'll couch it in terms that you'll understand) is within your grasp.

You just don't grasp it do you? We don't want anything to do with the south or the scum in the north, we have what we want. There is only one last thing we want and that is to see the back off IRA, if nationalist in the north want peace they had better get rid off the IRA. Because as long as they give them a mandate they will never know true peace.

Your very stuck on the education thing aren't you, a typo here a typo there who gives a shit on a message board apart form school kids and teachers. What realy matters is the money you earn, you can be highly educated but if you don't earn shit wants the point. Which brings me to my point if down south is so great and your so educated why to fuck are your living in Germany?

 

[Mandinka2]

You just don't grasp it do you? We don't want anything to do with the south or the scum in the north, we have what we want. There is only one last thing we want and that is to see the back off IRA, if nationalist in the north want peace they had better get rid off the IRA. Because as long as they give them a mandate they will never know true peace.

Your very stuck on the education thing aren't you, a typo here a typo there who gives a shit on a message board apart form school kids and teachers. What realy matters is the money you earn, you can be highly educated but if you don't earn shit wants the point. Which brings me to my point if down south is so great and your so educated why to fuck are your living in Germany?

You will never beat the IRA unless you paint them into the corner I describe above - why is that so bothersome to you - you will be slitting these guy's throats...... you have what you want? A financially bankrupt part of a small island teetering perpetually on political meltdown ? Would the security forces pull out of the North in the morning , the place would be utterly bereft.

Your history is off , not just typos but your syntax is miles off - you betray that you are exactly the same as the IRA but under a different coloured flag. And on the subject of flags , tell me what the tricolour represents , something that those loving DUP boys don't shout about too much. I lived and worked in the South , I go home on business every now and again but i have still much more to learn and Germany is a grand place if you give it a chance.

 

[theoak01]

here we go with a fun fact courtesy of Oak

The Leader of the Orange order took part in a St Patty's day parade claiming St Patrick is the Patron Saint OF ALL OF IRELAND
http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=9&si=1145710&issue_id=10586

sure seems like even the orangemen think they are Irish
ya best start getting your facts right before you spout off lad

its good to see such unity

 

[Hojo]

here we go with a fun fact courtesy of Oak

The Leader of the Orange order took part in a St Patty's day parade claiming St Patrick is the Patron Saint OF ALL OF IRELAND
http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=9&si=1145710&issue_id=10586

sure seems like even the orangemen think they are Irish
ya best start getting your facts right before you spout off lad

its good to see such unity

The orange order dates back to when all off Ireland was British and the order today is both north and south. When they say Irish in the north they mean in a british context, in the south they do mean Irish just like the english lodges are english. The orange order is today full off old men just like your Granddad and like I said a few posts back the generations born after the troubles will never be Irish. St Patrick pre-dates all the shit we have going on and is one off the few things that can and does crosses the divide, its a not an issue.

Mandinka2
"You will never beat the IRA unless you paint them into the corner I describe above"

Please read what I said I'll qoute it for you..
"There is only one last thing we want and that is to see the back off IRA, if nationalist in the north want peace "THEY" had better get rid off the IRA. Because as long as they give them a mandate they will never know true peace."

We could have beat the IRA and very nearly did, if only westmister had not opened them a door and a way out. Now it will be the nationalist that will have to get rid off the IRA because its them that will suffer under them not us.

 

[theoak01]

that still doesnt excuse the fact he claims they are all irish,your logic is way off

by what you stated before the trouble you were all irish,but due to it your not? makes no fucking sense to me

 

[Hojo]

that still doesnt excuse the fact he claims they are all irish,your logic is way off

by what you stated before the trouble you were all irish,but due to it your not? makes no fucking sense to me

Do you understand the concept of Nationalism?

 

[theoak01]

quite well actually

 

[Mandinka2]

We could have beat the IRA and very nearly did, if only westmister had not opened them a door and a way out. Now it will be the nationalist that will have to get rid off the IRA because its them that will suffer under them not us.

When did this happen and what planet are you talknig about ? The IRA/Sinn Fein has only gotten more powerful and richer exactly because of your ineptitude. How and why will nationalists suffer under them and especially how is it not you ? They will infiltrate the PSNI just as Unionist terror groups did the RUC (and oh yeh let's not forget the UDR - government sponsored terrorists if ever there was some , and the B-specials - the list goes on!) and then you'll really get a taste of what it's like to not only be oppressed but to be oppressed by forces supported by the crown!

 

[theoak01]

up,just because I love to stir the shite

 

[Hojo]

When did this happen and what planet are you talknig about ? The IRA/Sinn Fein has only gotten more powerful and richer exactly because of your ineptitude. How and why will nationalists suffer under them and especially how is it not you ? They will infiltrate the PSNI just as Unionist terror groups did the RUC (and oh yeh let's not forget the UDR - government sponsored terrorists if ever there was some , and the B-specials - the list goes on!) and then you'll really get a taste of what it's like to not only be oppressed but to be oppressed by forces supported by the crown!

The IRA was out terrorised by the loyalists and most nationalist had had enough. They didn't see how the IRA and its war was getting them any where. The IRA was being wiped out by the loyalists with help off special branch and all the rest(ie... Don't kill him he is in nothing but that bastard is). As for the RUC they where not infiltrated by the loyalist some passed on info about republicians because off republicains murdering them, but the RUC and the loyalist hated each other no love lost there(ie.. like the writing on the wall" Join the RUC and come home to a real fire"). If anything the Nationalist have a lot to thank the RUC for because it was they them stoud between the loyalist and them.


"oh yeh let's not forget the UDR - government sponsored terrorists if ever there was some"

The IRA hated them all right that is for sure, their terrorism was way over the top.

"The risks of being a UDR soldier increased with the murder of members both on duty and off becoming more frequent. The terrorists targetting methods became more direct - in this example a terrorist came to the door of Sergeant Maynard Crawford's home and on knocking was answered by his 9 year old son. At this time the terrorist asked 'Is your Daddy a policeman?'. The boy without realising the consequences replied 'No, he's in the UDR'. The family at this time didn't realise that in a few short months they were to be left without a father / husband".

http://www.ulsterdefenceregiment.fsnet.co.uk/early.html

The IRA tried to oppress us it never worked.

I have a link for you to TheOak01.

http://www.ulsternation.org.uk/farewell to the UDR.htm

 

[theoak01]

Im not on my pc,so I will read this when I get home.

but I do have a interesting fact for you ,The english took the ulster part of ireland because they wanted to make the Irish civil and they thought we were nothing but barbarians,and this was way before any IRA was concived. so explain how the brits own it?

 

[Mandinka2]

The IRA was out terrorised by the loyalists and most nationalist had had enough. They didn't see how the IRA and its war was getting them any where. The IRA was being wiped out by the loyalists with help off special branch and all the rest(ie... Don't kill him he is in nothing but that bastard is). As for the RUC they where not infiltrated by the loyalist some passed on info about republicians because off republicains murdering them, but the RUC and the loyalist hated each other no love lost there(ie.. like the writing on the wall" Join the RUC and come home to a real fire"). If anything the Nationalist have a lot to thank the RUC for because it was they them stoud between the loyalist and them.

Out terrorised??? For a very long time in the North the IRA did not target civilians whereas those muppets in the UDR , UVF and let's not forget the Shankhill butchers did. None of these groups had/have anything like the discipline or the hierarchy that the IRA has. That is why the INLA were both more violent than the IRA but also more ineffective since their members were very hard to control - Dominic McGlinchey for example was clearly out of his mind. Those loyalist groups had exactly the opposite effect that you speak of - they encouraged more recruitment - raping and knifing pregnant Catholic mothers is a very very good recruiting tool for the IRA you'll find - maybe you could list off a few names of IRA targets taken out - there were very very few - precisely becasue the IRA organisation was so large and well structured. The speed at which Bily Wright was got to for example demonstrates the ease of relative ease of picking off loyalist targets - look where Johnny Adair is now for example! These guys are dumbasses BECAUSE they draw attention to themselves. How were the loyalists armed ? Were they using Kalashnikovs? NO! They used standard issue Brit army weapons....collusion plain and simple. Without the support/protection of the crown forces (Michael Stone for example) these guys wouldnt last pissing time against the IRA.

"oh yeh let's not forget the UDR - government sponsored terrorists if ever there was some"

The IRA hated them all right that is for sure, their terrorism was way over the top.

"The risks of being a UDR soldier increased with the murder of members both on duty and off becoming more frequent. The terrorists targetting methods became more direct - in this example a terrorist came to the door of Sergeant Maynard Crawford's home and on knocking was answered by his 9 year old son. At this time the terrorist asked 'Is your Daddy a policeman?'. The boy without realising the consequences replied 'No, he's in the UDR'. The family at this time didn't realise that in a few short months they were to be left without a father / husband".

He was not a civilian - he was a member of a now - outlawed organisation well known for targetting and torturing Catholics. I do not weep for him sir. That is not what I refer to as "terrorism".

http://www.ulsterdefenceregiment.fsnet.co.uk/early.html

The IRA tried to oppress us it never worked.

I have a link for you to TheOak01.

http://www.ulsternation.org.uk/farewell to the UDR.htm

That first link is joke man - sunsets and soldiers ?
Ulster citzens army ???? Give me a fucking break - that's exactly what the UDR were, and the IRA did not force people out of it , why would they? Perfect moles would have been much more useful , complete with access to weapons caches............moron.

 

[Hojo]

Out terrorised??? For a very long time in the North the IRA did not target civilians whereas those muppets in the UDR , UVF and let's not forget the Shankhill butchers did. None of these groups had/have anything like the discipline or the hierarchy that the IRA has. That is why the INLA were both more violent than the IRA but also more ineffective since their members were very hard to control - Dominic McGlinchey for example was clearly out of his mind. Those loyalist groups had exactly the opposite effect that you speak of - they encouraged more recruitment - raping and knifing pregnant Catholic mothers is a very very good recruiting tool for the IRA you'll find - maybe you could list off a few names of IRA targets taken out - there were very very few - precisely becasue the IRA organisation was so large and well structured. The speed at which Bily Wright was got to for example demonstrates the ease of relative ease of picking off loyalist targets - look where Johnny Adair is now for example! These guys are dumbasses BECAUSE they draw attention to themselves. How were the loyalists armed ? Were they using Kalashnikovs? NO! They used standard issue Brit army weapons....collusion plain and simple. Without the support/protection of the crown forces (Michael Stone for example) these guys wouldnt last pissing time against the IRA.


He was not a civilian - he was a member of a now - outlawed organisation well known for targetting and torturing Catholics. I do not weep for him sir. That is not what I refer to as "terrorism".


That first link is joke man - sunsets and soldiers ?
Ulster citzens army ???? Give me a fucking break - that's exactly what the UDR were, and the IRA did not force people out of it , why would they? Perfect moles would have been much more useful , complete with access to weapons caches............moron.

I see where your coming from now. Please correct me if I'm wrong. You are mixing the UDR up with the UDA/UFF. Johnny Adair was UDA/UFF and was never a member off the UDR. The UDA/UFF did target and torture Catholics as a terrorists grouping, the UDR stoped and searched Catholics as part off the British army supporting the Police. How can anyone talk about Johnny Adair and not say something about the UDA/UFF is a sure sign that they don't know what their talking about.

Billy Wright was got because off collusion, he got in the way off Tony Blairs plans.

"and knifing pregnant Catholic mothers is a very very good recruiting tool for the IRA you'll find""For a very long time in the North the IRA did not target civilians" Any links?

So is blowing them apart as they do their shoping.

http://www.iraatrocities.fsnet.co.uk/shankill bombing ten year anniversary.htm

"maybe you could list off a few names of IRA targets taken out - there were very very few - precisely becasue the IRA organisation was so large and well structured".

LOL did no one tell you they were all innocent murdered by the murderous state sponsored loyalist. Or more to the truth the IRA played down their membership because they were lossing to many members. By confirming their membership they would have given feed back to the loyalist that they where getting the right men.


"He was not a civilian - he was a member of a now - outlawed organisation well known for targetting and torturing Catholics. I do not weep for him sir. That is not what I refer to as "terrorism"."

No he was a British soldier, I think you should read up about the UDR and the UDA/UFF to totaly different organisations.

 

[Mandinka2]

I see where your coming from now. Please correct me if I'm wrong. You are mixing the UDR up with the UDA/UFF. Johnny Adair was UDA/UFF and was never a member off the UDR. The UDA/UFF did target and torture Catholics as a terrorists grouping, the UDR stoped and searched Catholics as part off the British army supporting the Police. How can anyone talk about Johnny Adair and not say something about the UDA/UFF is a sure sign that they don't know what their talking about.

Billy Wright was got because off collusion, he got in the way off Tony Blairs plans.

"and knifing pregnant Catholic mothers is a very very good recruiting tool for the IRA you'll find""For a very long time in the North the IRA did not target civilians" Any links?

So is blowing them apart as they do their shoping.

http://www.iraatrocities.fsnet.co.uk/shankill bombing ten year anniversary.htm

"maybe you could list off a few names of IRA targets taken out - there were very very few - precisely becasue the IRA organisation was so large and well structured".

LOL did no one tell you they were all innocent murdered by the murderous state sponsored loyalist. Or more to the truth the IRA played down their membership because they were lossing to many members. By confirming their membership they would have given feed back to the loyalist that they where getting the right men.


"He was not a civilian - he was a member of a now - outlawed organisation well known for targetting and torturing Catholics. I do not weep for him sir. That is not what I refer to as "terrorism"."

No he was a British soldier, I think you should read up about the UDR and the UDA/UFF to totaly different organisations.

There is no confusion on my part - the UDR and the UVF were often comprised of the same membership - you have failed to mention where the supply of weapons for the various loyalist terrorist groups have come from - no surprise.
Here is just a small sample of their love for each other:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/october/15/newsid_2534000/2534941.stm
The members of the UDR were recruited from exclusively Protestant/loyalist areas and were permitted to take their weapons home with them (often fully automatic weapons ), a decision which was later rescinded because the scale of involvement of the UDR in torturing and killing of Catholic civilians was becoming obscene. Who took that decision ? - The British army did - even they were revolted at the level of involvement of their own recruits in loyalist "terrorism". It was disbanded for the same reason.

Billy Wright was killed because he was regarded as surplus to UDA requirements , he was a sitting duck for a long time , hence the INLA took him out.

I have been stopped together with a family member by the RUC (we were just day tripping to Belfast in the 80s), they searched the car but were quite nice lads about it and polite , but was left under no suspicions that had we been searched by the UDR things might easily have gotten ugly.

In any case South Armagh and parts of Tyrone , Fermanagh and Derry are breeding grounds for IRA. None of the sitting army council are from the South , Sinn Fein are probably the best funded party on either side of the Irish sea , you will continue to play into their hands.

 

[Hojo]

There is no confusion on my part - the UDR and the UVF were often comprised of the same membership - you have failed to mention where the supply of weapons for the various loyalist terrorist groups have come from - no surprise.
Here is just a small sample of their love for each other:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/october/15/newsid_2534000/2534941.stm
The members of the UDR were recruited from exclusively Protestant/loyalist areas and were permitted to take their weapons home with them (often fully automatic weapons ), a decision which was later rescinded because the scale of involvement of the UDR in torturing and killing of Catholic civilians was becoming obscene. Who took that decision ? - The British army did - even they were revolted at the level of involvement of their own recruits in loyalist "terrorism". It was disbanded for the same reason.

Billy Wright was killed because he was regarded as surplus to UDA requirements , he was a sitting duck for a long time , hence the INLA took him out.

I have been stopped together with a family member by the RUC (we were just day tripping to Belfast in the 80s), they searched the car but were quite nice lads about it and polite , but was left under no suspicions that had we been searched by the UDR things might easily have gotten ugly.

In any case South Armagh and parts of Tyrone , Fermanagh and Derry are breeding grounds for IRA. None of the sitting army council are from the South , Sinn Fein are probably the best funded party on either side of the Irish sea , you will continue to play into their hands.

So where is the link to the "raping and knifing pregnant Catholic mothers"?

Want happened to the band group at the hands off a few bad eggs does not mean that the UDR was a terror grouping. There will alway be crossover and collusion between british forces and british civilians. The UDR was not scraped it was cut in size from 7 battalion to 3 and join with the Royal Irish Rangers which where cut in size from 2 battalion to 1 to from the Royal Irish Regiment(RIR) 4 battalions, this was in 1991 about the time that John major was giving the IRA a way out off a no win situation. The RIR have served/fought in Basnia and Heregovina, Kosavo,Sierra leona and Iraq sence their formation and as much as you and the IRA hate them they are a very valued part off the british army.


"Billy Wright was killed because he was regarded as surplus to UDA requirements , he was a sitting duck for a long time , hence the INLA took him out".
He was the leader off the LVF and was causing problems for Tony Blair by destabling the corruped peace process. Tony Blair had him killed to shout him up. The Corrie report should make good reading its all about collusion that is if tony blair let Corrie release it.

"I have been stopped together with a family member by the RUC (we were just day tripping to Belfast in the 80s), they searched the car but were quite nice lads about it and polite , but was left under no suspicions that had we been searched by the UDR things might easily have gotten ugly"

If you had given them a load off lip they would have took 4 hours to strip your car down and then pissed off leaving you to put it all back tegetter. I don't know about it being ugly but I'm sure it would have been funny.