substituting DL for Squat on a 5x5

[JohnRobHolmes]

been a while since ive posted here, but ive been lurking.

anywho, I have started my lifting again after (another) dislocated shoulder and strained lower back. I figured that if I dont start training consistantly, I will become one weak and injury prone-20 something-casualty-waiting to happen

I was on the verge of the second phase of the 5x5 when (after reading a few journals) I decided to just stick to single factor until I REALLY peak out. Now, the question..

Would it hurt anything to switch the DL with the squat? instead of DLing once per week, do it three; and vice versa for squat. I feel that my explosiveness could use a boost, as I have been feeling kinda slow and blah at work. Or, would it just be best to keep things the same for a few months and see how things progress?

comments are greatly appriciated, and it's good to read up on other's progress around here!

 

[JL_204]

I wouldn't DL 3x per week. It is way too taxing. Just go the way the program was designed, especially the first time you run it.

 

[ghettostudmuffin]

I agree. That's kinda pushin it on the low back.

Although if you were to do like deads one day, power cleans the next and stiff-legged deads another it might be doable, but the program as it is is still preferable.

 

[blut wump]

Definitely stick with it as given for a few months until you have your conditioning back. Going straight into DLing 3x per week will just frazzle your lower back and likely lead to more injury.

Good to see you on again and good luck with it.

 

[Jim Ouini]

Also, Madcow used to say the squat drives everything so reducing it would probably compromise the program.

Oh and welcome back

 

[Guinness5.0]

If you want explosiveness then sub inpower cleans for rows. Those will lead to more explosiveness than dl's anyway.

They're kinda easy to do wrong though. I just got this book and I LOVE it- there's a full chapter (~30 pages w/ pictures) on power cleans):
www.startingstrength.com

 

[JohnRobHolmes]

thanks guys. thats kinda what i figured. i will look into the power cleans. i like that idea. im almost rowing body weight now anyway, just 15 pounds away and no struggles yet.

 

[hangclean]

If you want explosiveness then sub inpower cleans for rows. Those will lead to more explosiveness than dl's anyway.

They're kinda easy to do wrong though. I just got this book and I LOVE it- there's a full chapter (~30 pages w/ pictures) on power cleans):
www.startingstrength.com

Thats exacty what I would do. Also I wouldnt recommend doing deadlifts more than once a week with a 5x5 program. I wouldnt even do them that often. I would alternate good mornings one week and deadlifts the next. Then again I only do 5x5 3 months out of the year if that. I burn out on that program very easily.

 

[thelion2005]

been a while since ive posted here, but ive been lurking.

anywho, I have started my lifting again after (another) dislocated shoulder and strained lower back. I figured that if I dont start training consistantly, I will become one weak and injury prone-20 something-casualty-waiting to happen

I was on the verge of the second phase of the 5x5 when (after reading a few journals) I decided to just stick to single factor until I REALLY peak out. Now, the question..

Would it hurt anything to switch the DL with the squat? instead of DLing once per week, do it three; and vice versa for squat. I feel that my explosiveness could use a boost, as I have been feeling kinda slow and blah at work. Or, would it just be best to keep things the same for a few months and see how things progress?

comments are greatly appriciated, and it's good to read up on other's progress around here!

I keyed in on your injuries. Dead lifts with lower back problems? I would be be afraid of them.

 

[blut wump]

Deadlifts, squats, bent rows, power cleans have been the best rehab treatment for my lower back that I've ever encountered. My lower back is the best it has been in years. My chiropractor shakes his head in disbelief and tells me to keep doing whatever it is that I'm doing.

Listen very carefully to your back on every rep and stop if it tells you to but if you fail to work and exercise your posterior chain, it will only get worse. thelion2005 is right: be afraid of the exercise. Embrace that fear and ensure that you don't take them lightly. Do take them, though.

 

[JohnRobHolmes]

thats some really sound advice. I should definatly be wary, and listen to my back on every rep. I think in the past I would have tried to finish the set, but the back wont allow it.

 

[MsBeverlyHills]

3 times a wk??? intead of squats, i would cycle dls w/good mornings.

 

[JohnRobHolmes]

if im doing power clean instead of row, whats gonna hit my middle traps the most out of DL, power clean, and pullup? I feel that i would still need to target the middle traps with something, but I am probably off base. It seems that no matter what my routine, I am always scared that my back is getting an uneven workout.

 

[blut wump]

Don't over-analyse this. The 5x5 with a bit of arm-work thrown in covers everything very nicely. The big compound movements utilize much of the rest of your body, even if only isometrically, and gives an excellent all-around workout.

The more you start to change the 5x5, other than the basic recommended substitutions, the less well it's likely to work for you. Power-cleans are a fine sub for rows if you prefer the Oly movements. There's nothing wrong with rows, though. Don't worry yourself with shaping and refining your muscle-mass until after you've grown it. That applies to budding body-builders as much as power athletes. Get some basic mass onto yourself before getting paranoid about minor weaknesses.