Stats, Schmats. What REALLY Matters.

[PFM]

yea ive always wondered why ppl always ask for stats? the net is like a telephone, you can be anything you want on the other end. but at the same time, i guess it gives you a chance to see if they even know what we're talking about.

 

[Heath82]

good post nelson. i doubt you will get many people to post pics cuz of the nature of aas being illegal. yes, im sure most people lie about their stats, and the say their diet is dialed in when in reality its shit and they want to cheat by using aas. i agree pics and a listed diet would be most benificial when trying to get advice.

and miplank, that shit is hillarious. up there with the gut that put a needle in his asshole! prob the same guy

 

[the_alcatraz]

OMG, that is almost one of the funniest things I have seen on a BBing forum.

+1

That is retarded!

 

[sweed]

Good post.. I have my pic in my avi almost always. Sorry I don't look like Heman or Skeletor
Everyone have a phone, or camera, or cam on their computer ( like me!) and should be able to get pics uploaded fast. this is the... 00's you know!
I am cutting a lot before I start so I will look like I have somewhat of a body to start up a cycle, lol

 

[aquatic_glories]

Just be careful of what you wish for guys.

Want to start need advice

ROTFLMFAO !!!!
and 5ft 12 inches LOL.

In this case, I am 1 ft 64 inches.

 

[Nelson Montana]

Problem with us on here using twice as much gear as the guys in the 1960s and early 1970s and not looking like them is simply a matter of genetics first and foremost. Most people on here can't match Larry Scott's development he achieved in 1965 with 10-20mgs of dianabol day.

Most people on here can't rival Steve Reeves' physique he had in the late 1940s, genetics.

What did recreational bodybuilders of the 60s and 70s look like, not elite level professional athletes of this period in time, not a fair comparison.

Compare your basketball, hockey, and baseball skills to the likes of Michael Jordan, Wayne Gretzky,Ty Cobb. Do you stand a chance?

Wrong thinking bro. All the gear in the world won't give you Reeve's frame so your argument doesn't hold water. Gear does not compensate for bad genetics. Gear does what it does for everyone -- it simply gives you a little more than you can get without it.

So yeah, Scott looked great and the little bit helped. But by YOU taking 10 times as much, it ain't gonna get you closer to looking like Scott.

It's thinking like that which is the reason I see guys who boast of 30 pound gains, when the weight they gained looks like it could have come from eating an extra box of cupcakes every day.

 

[swole]

I absolutely love this line of thinking and couldn't agree more.

I like to think bodybuilding is a 3-part pie.

1 part training, 1 part diet, 1 part hormonal.

All parts need to be equal and balanced. If one is larger than the other the whole is not complete or harmonized.

The training slice takes years to perfect and understand. It's individual. Which is why some people get more development from a Smith machine while others swear by dumbbells. You need to listen to your own body. And leave your ego at the door. A basic understanding of what works for YOU should be present before turning to gear.

Same with diet. Some people respond better to certain types of carbs, protein and fats. Some people don't like to create insulin spikes post workout. Some people find whole wheat pasta is the shit. Some people think pasta makes them fat.

Hormones. Understanding what compound does what and how it makes you feel. Acknowledging that you don't need 500mg of test for your first cycle. Or second. Or third. Knowing that tren should be a last resort to an extremely advanced (LOOKING) bodybuilder. Being able to ditch a compound if it makes you feel like shit. Building clean muscle while staying lean. Isn't the point of bodybuilding to look great all the time? Why do you want to bloat up like a moon face on cycle just to deflate and think you just lost quality muscle when it was just water retention? Why not use dry compounds with low doses that react synergistically? Arnold didn't need tren or clen. You do? If you compete, the talent pool is different. But if you want a dense, defined physique then you need to realize all the new age shit is not necessary.

 

[the_alcatraz]

I absolutely love this line of thinking and couldn't agree more.

I like to think bodybuilding is a 3-part pie.

1 part training, 1 part diet, 1 part hormonal.

All parts need to be equal and balanced. If one is larger than the other the whole is not complete or harmonized.

The training slice takes years to perfect and understand. It's individual. Which is why some people get more development from a Smith machine while others swear by dumbbells. You need to listen to your own body. And leave your ego at the door. A basic understanding of what works for YOU should be present before turning to gear.

Same with diet. Some people respond better to certain types of carbs, protein and fats. Some people don't like to create insulin spikes post workout. Some people find whole wheat pasta is the shit. Some people think pasta makes them fat.

Hormones. Understanding what compound does what and how it makes you feel. Acknowledging that you don't need 500mg of test for your first cycle. Or second. Or third. Knowing that tren should be a last resort to an extremely advanced (LOOKING) bodybuilder. Being able to ditch a compound if it makes you feel like shit. Building clean muscle while staying lean. Isn't the point of bodybuilding to look great all the time? Why do you want to bloat up like a moon face on cycle just to deflate and think you just lost quality muscle when it was just water retention? Why not use dry compounds with low doses that react synergistically? Arnold didn't need tren or clen. You do? If you compete, the talent pool is different. But if you want a dense, defined physique then you need to realize all the new age shit is not necessary.

Actually I'd like to add that bodybuilding is a four part pie:

1- Training
2- Diet & supplementation
3- Rest
4- Hormones & chemicals

 

[Wrongun]

As always Nelson a great thought provoking post.

AAS were, back in the era you discuss, mainly only available and used for the elite. When i say elite i mean semi to pro athletes who needed to push their bodies over and above their genetic peaks or to remain at the very top. The knowledge base was there and has been tested many times but what is interesting about the theories that have been deduced from that era is that they are medically proved to be incorrect BUT they worked so who is to say they were wrong e.g. Arnold on Dbol only for god knows how long when now that is shot down daily!

AAS are far more readily available and so is the information which means there is a whole new market of people that really believe they are muscle in an amp or tab and compensate lack of knowledge, training, diet and rest with massive dosages of test etc.

The worst is and was the most common use of HGH. It was some 12 months ago as common as vitamin tablets when training where IMHO that really is to push you above your genetic peak which 99% are nowhere near IMHO

There is a real argument for back to basics as for all the benefits the internet has brought with the sharing of information it has also meant the use of AAS has changed in terms of common user and dosages required

Wrongun!

 

[lilj888]

I know it's standard to get more info from someone before critiquing, but really, how much does it matter?

Sure, if someone is a beginner it makes a difference. If someone is underage it matters. If someone weighs 140 pounds, it matters. But all in all, someone can have good stats, except for the one thing that's most important -- WHAT THEY LOOK LIKE.

In other words, 5'10" 220 , lifting for 5 years and have done 6 cycles may sound like someone who's somewhat experienced, but let me tell you, I've seen a lot of guys with those "stats" who like like utter crap.

I know it's a new world and the gear comes before the training. This has been addressed ad-nauseum. But when it gets to the point (and it's there) when guys on a gram a week not only don't look better than guys who are natural, but guys who barely work out...well, something's wrong.

With all we know about gear and all tha;'s been learned in the last 10 years, people use it WORSE than when hardly anything was known about it -- from all the ridiculous "rules" I hear to the insane dosages that still exist.

But worst of all is HOW and WHY they are used. Steroids are no longer the last step. They're usually the first. And I don't give a rats ass if someone wants to chug a bottle of A-bombs and follow it with a pint of Jim Beam. But let's not gauge those results with what should REALLY be expected. It's been said before but I'll say it again. You can make gains on 25 mgs of dbol a day. If you can't grow on 750 mgs of ANYTHING, you suck.

Feel like you need a gram a week? That's more than anybody who stepped on the Olympia stage prior to 1975 or so. Where they not big enough for ya?

A cycle without test is a waste? Gee, I guess Arnold was wasting his time.

Think because you're a hardgainer you need more gear? Guess what...it won't matter. You'll still be a hardgainer. Try eating more and lifting more.

It's actually gotten to the point where if I were to randomly take a non pro natural bodybuilder and a non pro juicer there's a good chance the NATURAL guy will look better, based solely on the fact that he trains to build muscle while the juicer depends on the gear. And then when it doesn't work he wants to know if some other combination of drugs is the answer for his sorry ass training, diet and supplementation regime.

Maybe everyone should post pics before asking advice about gear. In that case i can guarantee, 98% of them will be told they shouldn't even bother.

Sorry for the rant brothers, but I love bodybuilding and I have a high reverence for steroids and hope to be instrumental in getting them legalized. This pattern of behavior that I see growing and growing is making that hope harder for me. Steroids are officially a recreational drug. And that may very well be what kills the cause for all of us.

i cant agree more with this post. First of all as of lately i have been noticing ppl come on here saying they been on roids for 10 years or ya i just finished a cycle and i train for 4 years. i click there profile and i see a fat blob, skinny dude, or someone that just doesnt look like they ever touched the juice. I have friends that have taken juice and i can honestly say out of my numerous friends that taken it only 2 or 3 used it properly and have gotten good results. The others just sit around on there asses and expect to get big. then when they gain 5lbs they think they are the biggest things in the world when its basically nothng noticable or when they gain nothing they wonder why. I also get things from my friends like oh ur only big because u juice and ur just a cheat. that right there pisses me off more then anything. first off i work my ass off hard as fuck to get results, while these shitheads goto the gym once or twice a week and expect to get big. ppl dont realize its not all about juice, yes it will get u big only if u know how to use them correctly.

Today i was talkin to my friend that got some juice recently and is going to start it, i was watching a video where it said "ya i juice but its not about just juicing its alot of hardwork and dedication to gain size", and my friend goes "ya right" i looked at him and i said he is right it is hardwork and my friend is like "sure it is" and gave me a look like don't lie to me, i just wanted to beat his ass right there because he thought i was lieing, hes got alot comin to him if he thinks he can just jump on the juice and expect to see great results.

and btw i agree with the 25mg of dbol only is all you need i gained 23lbs on a 6week cycle of dbol only 25mg/day and i kept 17lbs maybe i have better then average genetics but 25mg is enough to do the body good.

and the pictures is a good idea because these ppl say there 6'1 230lbs. 230lbs of what FAT??

and ill admit im not even that big im decent and i bet im bigger then more then half the ppl on here that claim they are so big.