Stalling on Intermediate 5x5

[Mr.Y]

I am on Madcow's program and just finished 8th week. I will stall on Monday... barely got the 3 today. The rows and squats are going up flawlessly. I'd need to progress till 13-14th week to bench 220 as 1 rm. Right now I could at 200 or a bit less. Small weights and I should have no problems. I want to do this program again after I finish this. My weight is 180 but I am taking creatine (holding a bit water). I took it first time in my life few weeks ago though I didn't notice much usefulness. Only the first 2 weeks gained weight, about 6 lbs. I am sleeping 9-10 hours and I eat big time, for example gained 2 lbs last week... even a bit too much.

4 weeks progress sucks actually at my stats. What should I do to be able to put more weight on the bar? Maybe continue with 4 on Mon and 2 reps on Fri ? Or take a huge load of creatine? When I stall and keep the same weight I am sure I will get some weeks more progress but not till 13-14. I made a bet that I will bench 220 sooner than my friend because I was so sure about the effectiveness of this program.... now it seems it is a bit hyped up.

 

[solarclimax]

Why you so sure you will stall on monday ? and what is it you think you are going to stall on ?
I have done runs of 5x5 a few times and i have had a hard time getting the 3 reps on say bench press on the friday, thinking i will stall the following monday and then i have ended up just getting all 5 reps on the monday, just eat well and get good rest. If you do stall on monday then just try the 3 reps again the following friday and then 5 the monday after that. And don't worry about the creatine just eat good food.
And don't worry about the damn bench press, worry about your squat, if your squat goes up then your bench will follow, just focus on putting weight on the bar eating and resting. Remember it's a marathon not a sprint.

 

[Mr.Y]

bigger squat = bigger bench - trite and horse piss.

My squat is ~1,5x times bigger than bench. It is going up why should I worry. I will if it doesn't. Row and squat feel light, bench was almost to failure - that is why I know I stall. And I have read about this program, that when you barely get the reps you shouldn't add weight. There has to be 1-2 reps left. I wanted a boost or smth or just drop the reps so I'll have 1 rep left even if I could barely get the 5. Once the bar is getting heavy I will start to bounce it off because going to failure is deadly to the progress and this program.

 

[solarclimax]

bigger squat = bigger bench - trite and horse piss.

My squat is ~1,5x times bigger than bench. It is going up why should I worry. I will if it doesn't. Row and squat feel light, bench was almost to failure - that is why I know I stall. And I have read about this program, that when you barely get the reps you shouldn't add weight. There has to be 1-2 reps left. I wanted a boost or smth or just drop the reps so I'll have 1 rep left even if I could barely get the 5. Once the bar is getting heavy I will start to bounce it off because going to failure is deadly to the progress and this program.

Well you know best.

 

[s8nlilhlpr2]

Bench is generally the first thing to stall on the 5x5, because prior to following it, most people bench a lot. Your squats still have plenty of gas left, what about your deadlifts?

Do not cheat and "bounce" the bar, switch to the smith, or cut the reps. If you can't get all your reps on monday (give it a serious try though, don't assume you will fail walking in), then reset your bench. Drop it back 20lbs and ramp back up again. Perhaps you simply started your bench too high, and your squats too low.

 

[fallingeggs]

Drop it back 20lbs and ramp back up again. Perhaps you simply started your bench too high, and your squats too low.

I will second this idea.

 

[Mr.Y]

I tested my 5 rm and had this on the 4th week like it is said in the program. Deadlifts are going up though not 2,5%, that was too heavy. And I don't want to reset yet because it is just the 4th progress week.

I even might get 5 reps on Monday, but very very hard. So it is better to do 4 and not to go all out. I'll decide that when I have done 4 reps. Can't I continue this way and do 2 & 4 reps on last sets? Maybe I'll get few more weeks progress ?

 

[fallingeggs]

I can think of a few options that you might want to think of.

1) Mircoload. Find some way to only add a total of 1.25 pounds on the bar. This will allow you to add weight, but at a slower pace then 5 pounds each time. There are whole plate sets you can buy for $70. Or you could make your own using some chain and clips or you could even weight the clips at your gym and just put an extra two or three clips on each side of the bar.

2) Try the 2/4 rep scheme and see how that goes. Yes, it does go against the program its self, but not against the theory.

3) keep with what you should be doing, miss Monday's set and retry Friday/Monday again next week and see how that goes.

4) Maybe (although doubtful) you need a more complex (and thus slower) bench workout for you to progress.

 

[solarclimax]

Some good advice here.

 

[s8nlilhlpr2]

I tested my 5 rm and had this on the 4th week like it is said in the program. Deadlifts are going up though not 2,5%, that was too heavy. And I don't want to reset yet because it is just the 4th progress week.

I even might get 5 reps on Monday, but very very hard. So it is better to do 4 and not to go all out. I'll decide that when I have done 4 reps. Can't I continue this way and do 2 & 4 reps on last sets? Maybe I'll get few more weeks progress ?

If you are stalling in the 4th week, you started the weights too high, simple as that. The first 4 weeks should be moderatly difficult, if not easy. The point is to build momentum for the first weeks, then carry it over.

If its just a stall for one week, then you keep the weights the same for the next week and try and get all the reps. If you STILL don't get all the reps, the weight is too high, start over lower and try again.

 

[Kabeetz]

I don't think there's anything wrong with a little bounce of the bar off the chest... Rippetoe encourages it. A little bit. Nothing excessive.

 

[fallingeggs]

I don't think there's anything wrong with a little bounce of the bar off the chest... Rippetoe encourages it. A little bit. Nothing excessive.

I was actually a little confused when i saw this so i looked it up in Starting Strength and it makes the point that it is a 'touch-and-go' not a bounce. The 'touch-and-go' is described as getting a rebound from the stretch reflex of the muscles (mostly pecs and lats i believe) and this is done by keeping tight. Any use of the ribcage resilience to heave the bar up is discouraged and considered cheating.

It is a fine point, but one i thought should be made.

 

[Mr.Y]

I wasn't confident at all, so I changed the jumps from 12,5% to 15%. The 4th set got about 5 lbs lighter and felt easier. I think that is why I got the 5 reps today. Because 15% is maximum, I can't use this method any more. I hope this got me back on track and I will add 2,5% to my set on Friday (I'm not adding 5 lbs, exactly 2,5%).

I tried to implement this "touch-and-go", but I couldn't, at least not well. On the 4th set it was superb. When I got to the last set, I was afraid or smth... anyway I tried to really just touch, but it wound up without on some reps. There was an inch or half to go lower, but I pressed it up. I didn't have the momentum, so it wasn't much easier actually.

Btw. you who you didn't comprehend that as the 4th progressing week I meant 8th week... on the first 4 weeks you go lower and up to your max. Today started already 9th week.

PS! Thanks. I now know what to do when I stall again... 2 jokers left.

 

[s8nlilhlpr2]

Btw. you who you didn't comprehend that as the 4th progressing week I meant 8th week... on the first 4 weeks you go lower and up to your max. Today started already 9th week.

PS! Thanks. I now know what to do when I stall again... 2 jokers left.

sorry man must've misread that. Good to know your still progressing, sometimes you just have to play with the weights working up to the last set, make it a little easier on yourself.

 

[HaZaRDouZ]

Mr. Y,
check out westside-barbell.com i think is the website. it utilizes speed exercises. i use to do the 5x5 routine, but after a while i got burnt out on it so i switched to this speed routine. my bench,squat,and deadlift have never been stronger, and i have put on about 5 pounds of muscle in a month. this is 5lbs of muscle after working outside doing hard labor.