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So, I got my testorone level test results back... and it is LOW!
- Thread starter djsf
- Start date
djsf
New member
To answer everyone's questions:
I had the most recent test done about two weeks after my low reading of 80, but *before* starting my last PCT. It's quite surprising that I fully recovered in two weeks. Makes me wonder if one of the tests was incorrect. I will have one more follow-up test in a month to confirm.
My HMO won't do bio-available test. Can one of you recommend a mail-order lab that would measure that (also SHBG)? I am going back in one month for a final test (through my HMO) but I'd like to supplement that with my own bio-available test and SHBG measurements.
Yes I would like to cycle again in the future, so it will be most important to fully understand how my body recoveres from a cycle so I have some gauge for what to expect after future cycles. I believe I should be able to full recover between cycles if my cycles are reasonable and moderate.
My prolactin came in below the low end of the range. Interesting, and I'm not sure why it would be so low. Maybe because I had been using dostinex a few weeks before. So it seems prolactin would not be the problem.
Interesting posts aboug SHBG. I tried to get my HMO to measure that, but it's not a test that they do. The theory that nolva+clomid can increase this (thus reducing free test) is an intersting one. I will monitor my sex drive to see if it slowly recovers as my SHBG returns to normal (assuming it may not be normal). And finally, wet's comment that it may take 3-4 months to recover from deca is useful to know, and agrees with my general impressions of deca. I'll watch the next couple months to see what happens.
Very informative and intersting posts, all... thanks again for your help and all the useful info! I will give more K to you all again after I have spread some around first.
I had the most recent test done about two weeks after my low reading of 80, but *before* starting my last PCT. It's quite surprising that I fully recovered in two weeks. Makes me wonder if one of the tests was incorrect. I will have one more follow-up test in a month to confirm.
My HMO won't do bio-available test. Can one of you recommend a mail-order lab that would measure that (also SHBG)? I am going back in one month for a final test (through my HMO) but I'd like to supplement that with my own bio-available test and SHBG measurements.
Yes I would like to cycle again in the future, so it will be most important to fully understand how my body recoveres from a cycle so I have some gauge for what to expect after future cycles. I believe I should be able to full recover between cycles if my cycles are reasonable and moderate.
My prolactin came in below the low end of the range. Interesting, and I'm not sure why it would be so low. Maybe because I had been using dostinex a few weeks before. So it seems prolactin would not be the problem.
Interesting posts aboug SHBG. I tried to get my HMO to measure that, but it's not a test that they do. The theory that nolva+clomid can increase this (thus reducing free test) is an intersting one. I will monitor my sex drive to see if it slowly recovers as my SHBG returns to normal (assuming it may not be normal). And finally, wet's comment that it may take 3-4 months to recover from deca is useful to know, and agrees with my general impressions of deca. I'll watch the next couple months to see what happens.
Very informative and intersting posts, all... thanks again for your help and all the useful info! I will give more K to you all again after I have spread some around first.
djsf
New member
I'm 40, but not quire ready for HRT just yet. My natty test came out at 520 right after recovery. I have been taking 6-oxo, and my natty test is through the roof, and I put on 7 lbs. I am not far from my max weight after my last cycle, and am gaining fast on natural test! 6-oxo is the shit, highly recommended. I have one more blood test coming, I'll post here once I find out what it is. I think it will be really good, and I do not need HRT yet. I'me saving that card to be played later when needed. It is not needed just yet.
njmuscleguy
New member
djsf said:
Hey dj, I'm in the same boat as you.... after my last deca & test enth cycle, which ended in December, I did a PCT of HCG & nolvadex for 6 weeks... 1 month later, I got my bloodwork and test levels were very low... so I'm about to start another PCT of HCG, Aromasin, and Nolvadex... I have clomid on hand but am reluctant to use it because of sides....
Be careful with 6-oxo... I've read in several places that estrogen levels can rebound like crazy after you finish taking it, leaving you in worse shape than before you started
I'd also recommend taking avena sativa... it's a natural way of lowering SHBG... couldn't hurt
djsf
New member
njmuscleguy,
Interesting what you say about 6-oxo, that sounds very believable. Thanks for the tip on that. I might try gradually tapering to come off it.
I figured out why I crashed. I was using large doses and I started my PCT too early. In fact, my PCT was finished before the longest esters had left my ststem! Thus I was doing PCT will still suppressed by the cycle. The optimum time to do PCT, I believe, is one week before the longest esters have decreased to a level below where normal test levels would be (i.e. 1 week before you are about to be suppressed). Many people don't realize how long stuff stays in your system. Doing the PCT too early (i.e. while still suppressed the whole time) will not be effective.
Post more details on your cycle, including the doses you used and the date(s) of your last shot(s), and the date you started your PCT, and I'll figure out what happened with the PCT for your cycle.
Interesting what you say about 6-oxo, that sounds very believable. Thanks for the tip on that. I might try gradually tapering to come off it.
I figured out why I crashed. I was using large doses and I started my PCT too early. In fact, my PCT was finished before the longest esters had left my ststem! Thus I was doing PCT will still suppressed by the cycle. The optimum time to do PCT, I believe, is one week before the longest esters have decreased to a level below where normal test levels would be (i.e. 1 week before you are about to be suppressed). Many people don't realize how long stuff stays in your system. Doing the PCT too early (i.e. while still suppressed the whole time) will not be effective.
Post more details on your cycle, including the doses you used and the date(s) of your last shot(s), and the date you started your PCT, and I'll figure out what happened with the PCT for your cycle.
djsf
New member
njmuscleguy's cycle was something like:
Wks 1-10 test enth 750 mg/week
Wks 1-8 deca 600 mg/ week
Wk 11 (off)
Wks 12-14 HCG
Wk 12 liquidex
Wks 12-17 nolva
I went to this site and plugged your AAS parameters in: http://bulkmuscle.com/pct/index.php
Your cycle is modelled like this:
Drug: Testosterone Enanthate
(Initial) Dose: 375mg
Half-life: 7 days
Dose Frequency: Every 3.5 days
Cycle Length: 70 days
Start Day: 1
Tapered: No
Drug: Nandrolone Decanoate
(Initial) Dose: 300mg
Half-life: 9.5 days
Dose Frequency: Every 3.5 days
Cycle Length: 56 days
Start Day: 1
Tapered: No
This is a chart of your androgens blood levels during and after the cycle, day by day. Notice how it took a couple of weeks for the long-acting esters to build up in your system. Maximum levels were reached around day 42, six weeks into your cycle! The purple line is deca, and you can see how it trails off early (because you stopped deca two weeks early), but trails off slower than test because it is longer acting than enant. The red line is enant. Where the line turns blue is the point where the steroids in your system have declined to a lever lower than your normal test levels would have been. But your test levels are suppressed from the cycle, so past the blue area is where you are andrigen-deficient. This is where you need to be doing PCT. In fact, I would do HCG before the blue line starts, and start the rest of your PCT about one week before the blue line (running an AI or anti-E with the HCG).
On the chart, the blue line starts at day 91, which is a full 23 days after your last shot of test, about 3.5 weeks after your last shot of test and about 5.5 weeks after your last shot of deca. That is the point in type where your steroids are no longer really affecting you.
I would concoude you ran your PCT 1-2 weeks too early. Because of the high doses you used, the majority of your PCT was done while high levels of androgens were still in your system. It is best to time PCT so most of it overlaps the time when androgens have already left your system. So in your case, I would do a second PCT if your T levels are still low.
By the way, this is exactly what happened to me. Long, heavy cycles of deca require a long wait, in the range of 3-6 weeks after the last shot depending on dose, before starting PCT. Otherwise the PCT wiull be too early and innefective.
Wks 1-10 test enth 750 mg/week
Wks 1-8 deca 600 mg/ week
Wk 11 (off)
Wks 12-14 HCG
Wk 12 liquidex
Wks 12-17 nolva
I went to this site and plugged your AAS parameters in: http://bulkmuscle.com/pct/index.php
Your cycle is modelled like this:
Drug: Testosterone Enanthate
(Initial) Dose: 375mg
Half-life: 7 days
Dose Frequency: Every 3.5 days
Cycle Length: 70 days
Start Day: 1
Tapered: No
Drug: Nandrolone Decanoate
(Initial) Dose: 300mg
Half-life: 9.5 days
Dose Frequency: Every 3.5 days
Cycle Length: 56 days
Start Day: 1
Tapered: No
This is a chart of your androgens blood levels during and after the cycle, day by day. Notice how it took a couple of weeks for the long-acting esters to build up in your system. Maximum levels were reached around day 42, six weeks into your cycle! The purple line is deca, and you can see how it trails off early (because you stopped deca two weeks early), but trails off slower than test because it is longer acting than enant. The red line is enant. Where the line turns blue is the point where the steroids in your system have declined to a lever lower than your normal test levels would have been. But your test levels are suppressed from the cycle, so past the blue area is where you are andrigen-deficient. This is where you need to be doing PCT. In fact, I would do HCG before the blue line starts, and start the rest of your PCT about one week before the blue line (running an AI or anti-E with the HCG).
On the chart, the blue line starts at day 91, which is a full 23 days after your last shot of test, about 3.5 weeks after your last shot of test and about 5.5 weeks after your last shot of deca. That is the point in type where your steroids are no longer really affecting you.
I would concoude you ran your PCT 1-2 weeks too early. Because of the high doses you used, the majority of your PCT was done while high levels of androgens were still in your system. It is best to time PCT so most of it overlaps the time when androgens have already left your system. So in your case, I would do a second PCT if your T levels are still low.
By the way, this is exactly what happened to me. Long, heavy cycles of deca require a long wait, in the range of 3-6 weeks after the last shot depending on dose, before starting PCT. Otherwise the PCT wiull be too early and innefective.
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