Requesting Cycle Critique...

[EyadinKnight]

Requesting Cycle Critique... Test/Dbol/Clen/Anivar

Hey hey everybody! First time poster, long time reader. There are a lot of people one this site who's posts helped me though my first cycle... a very basic introductory cycle of 250 mg test enanthate per week, and 50 mg of Winstrol per day. That was a year ago. Gained a solid 9 lbs. and dropped my body fat a little. Nothing major, but I wasn't expecting major from my first cycle. I was expecting safe and steady. I am currently 6'1 at 193 lbs., and 27 years old. My body fat is mid to low teens... usually between 12 and 15 when I check it.

Now... on to my second cycle...

(This is what I have planned)

Week 1:
Test Enanthate - .5cc on Mon and Thu (1cc/wk)
Dianabol - 20mg per day

Week 2:
Test Enanthate - 1cc on Mon and Thu (2cc/wk)
Dianabol - 30mg per day

Week 3:
Test Enanthate - 1.5cc on Mon and Thu (3cc/wk)
Dianabol - 30mg per day

Week 4:
Test Enanthate - 2cc on Mon and Thu (4cc/wk)
Dianabol - 20mg per day

Week 5:
Test Enanthate - 2cc on Mon and Thu (4cc/wk)
Clenbuterol - 30mg per day
Anavar - 50mg per day

Week 6:
Test Enanthate - 2cc on Mon and Thu (4cc/wk)
Clenbuterol - 50mg per day
Anavar - 50mg per day

Week 7:
Test Enanthate - 2cc on Mon and Thu (4cc/wk)
Clenbuterol - 70mg per day
Anavar - 50mg per day

Week 8:
Test Enanthate - 2cc on Mon and Thu (4cc/wk)
Anavar - 50mg per day

Week 9:
Test Enanthate - 2cc on Mon and Thu (4cc/wk)
Anavar - 50mg per day

Week 10:
Test Enanthate - 2cc on Mon and Thu (4cc/wk)
Clenbuterol - 30mg per day
Anavar - 50mg per day

Week 11:
Test Enanthate - 2cc on Mon and Thu (4cc/wk)
Clenbuterol - 50mg per day
Anavar - 50mg per day

Week 12:
Test Enanthate - 2cc on Mon and Thu (4cc/wk)
Clenbuterol - 70mg per day
Anavar - 50mg per day

Week 13:
Test Enanthate - 2cc on Mon and Thu (4cc/wk)
Anavar - 50 mg per day

Week 14:
Test Enanthate - 1.5cc on Mon and Thu (3cc/wk)
Anavar - 50 mg per day

Week 15:
Test Enanthate - 1cc on Mon and Thu (2cc/wk)
Anavar - 50 mg per day

Week 16:
Test Enanthate - .5cc on Mon and Thu (1cc/wk)
Anavar - 50 mg per day

Weeks 17 - 20:
Nolvadex PCT - (not sure yet on exact dosages)
HCG PCT - (is it really even necessary?)

On Hand Throughout Entire Cycle:
Arimadex - AI (aka estrogen blocker)
Nolvadex - backup AI (but plan to use for PCT)
Milk Thistle - 200mg per day




Ok... Whew! That's my plan... 16 week cycle, consisting of Test Enanthate all the way through, with 4 weeks of Dbol at the beginning (to try and gain 10-15 lbs of muscle), followed by 12 weeks of Anavar (to help retain Dbol gains, aid Clen in cutting, and prevent muscle loss during cutting), and 3 wks on/2 wks off/3 wks on of Clen for additional fat loss. I hope to gain an additional 10-15 lbs of muscle during wks 4-16 and cut my body fat percentage to below 10%.

Any thoughts are appreciated. Especially on how I should take the AI and PCT... Thanks.

 

[Psych0ut]

All right I guess I ll jump in first here. Can I ask why you are ramping your dose with test e? You want to keep your test base stable throughout the cycle so I would suggest not ramping.

Next I would suggest dropping the Clen entirely. It is pretty stressful for the heart and considering that test and other aas are known for increasing bp and cholesterol you are really just amplifying these negative effects.

Also in my opinion it seems a bit counter intuitive to take test and d-Bol and try to cut in the same cycle. You aren't a huge dude so why not try to slap on some solid mass and worry about the body fat by controlling diet while on and off cycle. Clen my lean you out but without the diet to back it up and keep the fat off what is the point?

I'd also run hcg throughout the cycle

 

[EyadinKnight]

Super appreciate the response. I was gradually increasing testosterone because I've read that it was better for your overall endocrinal health to do so. If this is a myth, I would love to be corrected. Or even if it is not a myth, but true, am I increasing dosage too slowly? Maybe increase by 2cc per week for first two weeks instead? But yeah... I totally understand importance of keeping test levels stable in the body though. Thus the twice per week injections of test-e when I could just do one.

As to you second point... I've never heard of being a bad idea to run test with clenched. Is this really true? Not saying it isn't, just saying I've read a lot of other cycles that ran the clen / test / bar combo and none of them seemed to react adversely. I' 'll definitely be doing some reading on it, though.

Lastly... Dbol is known to be a wonderful kick start to almost any cycle, whether it be on of bulking, or one of cutting. I don't want to put on too much. Just enough to really make steps towards that beach body for summertime, us know? Of course diet is all important, not saying mine is perfect, but I am confident in it. I am 193 lbs right now, let's say 195 lbs. If I could put on about 20 lbs of muscle and lose about 15 lbs of fat, then that would put me at 200 lbs. With only a net gain of 5 lbs, but with much less fat, lol. I think the dbol will help me achieve this goal.

Please, though. If there are others that also disagree, please let me know! And let me know why...

 

[burnthiscorpse]

Dont taper your test. There is no reason to.

Never use clenbuterol EVER. It will destroy your heart muscle tissue.

...and lastly if your a long time reader then you should know that nolvadex does NOTHING for PCT. Its a shit drug even for its intended purpose. So unless your a female with breast cancer nolvadex will do nothing for you.

 

[Psych0ut]

I understand your point with the recomp view of only a 5 pound net gain. As a fellow 6'1" male I am aware that 195ish is not a full frame with 8% bf let alone 12-15% bf. I am about 255-260 with 12-14% bf and I feel like I am still far from filled out. Your current stats show a significant gap in your training and diet that cannot be filled by hormones. Calories and need for adaption build muscle not hormones. I am not saying don't cycle because that is your choice. I ask you though why put your body through a potentially damaging cycle when you could get bigger, better, and more keepable gains from spending 100 dollars on nutritional books and 1 year eating? Just food for thought. Apologies for the rant

 

[EyadinKnight]

burnthiscorpse: Thanks for taking the time to give some advice. However, from my studies, Clenbuterol has served as a safe and reliable supplement for the use of fat burning by healthy individuals who do not use the supplement in excess of 100mg per day, at which point it begins to damagehealthyhea tissues, or for longer than 14 weeks, at which point dosages as low as 40mgs begin to damage said tissues. If you have information to the contrary, please cite your sources so I may learn.

And secondly, Nolvadex has is the most popular and successfully used PCT on the planet. But... If you have reason to believe otherwise, please explain why and cite your sources so that I may learn. And just for future reference... as a long time reader, I know how it looks for to be reading someone's post who decides to criticize someone else's idea but doesn't offer a better one. If you don' t like the Nolvadex, what should I be taking?

All in love, bro.


psychout: Thanks again bro for taking the time out of your day to help a noob out. I just gotta say that I don't wanna weigh any more than 200 lbs when it's all said and done. I have friends of mine that compete at amature level bodybuilding tournaments that weigh in less than I do. Albeit, they are a couple of inches shorter than me. I am just looking for the fitness model look, not the bodybuilder look. That's why I'm taking the cutting agents. I'm tired of having the four pack instead of the six pack, lol. I understand perfectly the need for an excellent dieting and workout regimene. But I think I got that ok. like I said earlier, not perfect, but pretty good. I didn't get to where I am today, which is more muscular than all of my friend and half the people at the gym without knowing the importance of a solid diet and workout. I think you need to reassess what a 193 lbs guy with say... 13% body fat looks like. I'm no competitive bodybuilder, but not all of us want to be, ya know?


Seriously guys... in all love. I know that with my current diet, exercise program, genetic inheritance, physiological frame, etc, etc, etc, lol, but more importantly, with my current height, weight, bf%, and goals taking a cycle of Clen and anavar with some Dbol to kick it off is a good idea. what I want to know is how... lol Give me advice on how to avoid some mf'ing gynecomastia, lol... or give me some advice on how to dose these different items in a more optimal fashion. I've already adjusted my initial test intake bc of what has been recommended. Keep it coming! Just don't ask me to change my cycle with telling me scientifically why I should, or adjusting it to fit my goals, not someone else's. My fault for not clarifying what my goals exactly were, lol.

 

[burnthiscorpse]

burnthiscorpse: Thanks for taking the time to give some advice. However, from my studies, Clenbuterol has served as a safe and reliable supplement for the use of fat burning by healthy individuals who do not use the supplement in excess of 100mg per day, at which point it begins to damagehealthyhea tissues, or for longer than 14 weeks, at which point dosages as low as 40mgs begin to damage said tissues. If you have information to the contrary, please cite your sources so I may learn.

And secondly, Nolvadex has is the most popular and successfully used PCT on the planet. But... If you have reason to believe otherwise, please explain why and cite your sources so that I may learn. And just for future reference... as a long time reader, I know how it looks for to be reading someone's post who decides to criticize someone else's idea but doesn't offer a better one. If you don' t like the Nolvadex, what should I be taking?

All in love, bro.


psychout: Thanks again bro for taking the time out of your day to help a noob out. I just gotta say that I don't wanna weigh any more than 200 lbs when it's all said and done. I have friends of mine that compete at amature level bodybuilding tournaments that weigh in less than I do. Albeit, they are a couple of inches shorter than me. I am just looking for the fitness model look, not the bodybuilder look. That's why I'm taking the cutting agents. I'm tired of having the four pack instead of the six pack, lol. I understand perfectly the need for an excellent dieting and workout regimene. But I think I got that ok. like I said earlier, not perfect, but pretty good. I didn't get to where I am today, which is more muscular than all of my friend and half the people at the gym without knowing the importance of a solid diet and workout. I think you need to reassess what a 193 lbs guy with say... 13% body fat looks like. I'm no competitive bodybuilder, but not all of us want to be, ya know?


Seriously guys... in all love. I know that with my current diet, exercise program, genetic inheritance, physiological frame, etc, etc, etc, lol, but more importantly, with my current height, weight, bf%, and goals taking a cycle of Clen and anavar with some Dbol to kick it off is a good idea. what I want to know is how... lol Give me advice on how to avoid some mf'ing gynecomastia, lol... or give me some advice on how to dose these different items in a more optimal fashion. I've already adjusted my initial test intake bc of what has been recommended. Keep it coming! Just don't ask me to change my cycle with telling me scientifically why I should, or adjusting it to fit my goals, not someone else's. My fault for not clarifying what my goals exactly were, lol.

Theres only about a thousand thread here on why nolvadex is shit. Why dont you go do some reading. All nolvadex does is block estrogen receptors. Great fucking PCT. You want to do what YOU think is the best idea over people on this site who have been evolving pct over the last few years through much trial and error then knock yourself out. Not to mention there are better and safer drugs that work much better. So do WTF ever you want.

As for your reading of studies on Clen... WTF ever bro. Enjoy your clen. Not only is it harmful to your heart its for lazy fuckers who cant diet correctly and do proper cardio. There are too many alternatives to clen for anyone to take that garbage.

Every fucking day its clomid, nolva and clen with almost every new guy that posts here. I'm tired of typing a half page dissertation on why they are shit and what a real PCT is. Use the goddamn search engine.

 

[mryar]

If anything you want to front load for the first 2 or 3 injects. After that it doesn't really matter. You get a slight peak after each inject but its % is small as your levels are so elevated. Although as I get to my 4th day (I do every 4) I use slightly less aromasin as I know there's lower serum test levels. Though not by much. You should check out one of the dose calculators on the net, they show your your levels after each inject.

 

[EyadinKnight]

burnthiscorpse: Wow... I choose not to respond to hate with hate. Just letting you know... I injured my leg in the military and now I can't do any cardio that require my legs. I still shadow box, though, but no running, or jumping jack's, or eliptical's for me. I gotta get my calorie burning artificially... or I guess I just chose to. Either way, if you got a better fat burner, tell me. I would love to know.

I still don't know why you say Nolvadex sucks. I did the search like you suggested and found a few articles that say it isn't good for natural test stimulation, but I did find a couple that provided the science behind why Nolvadex is a good choice. I am not bashing you, bro, I am just asking you to help me out and explain WHY you don't like Nolvadex? Where is the science behind your conviction? And more importantly, what would you replace it with?

 

[MattJS]

Clen... I know a fat guy who took clen for a couple of months to get ripped, he became a fat guy who felt like shit for a couple of months then continued being a fat guy afterwards.... To the OP, Needto has a big write up on Nolvadex among the stickies, you should have a look in there...