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Prime example of why abortion is bullshit!
- Thread starter chesty
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I never claimed to be religous and yes, I wanted to go to Iraq and still do. But those people have made their choice and can defend themselves. Whether or not our invasin is the right thing or wrong. Those people/terrorists have made a conscious decision to kill others and we can fight back. An unborn child does not have that ability.
As for having a child. I have had five. And just because I didn't deliver the child or carry it in my body, does not make me any less qualified to speak out on the subject or have my views and opinions. And they are no less valid than a womans!
As for having a child. I have had five. And just because I didn't deliver the child or carry it in my body, does not make me any less qualified to speak out on the subject or have my views and opinions. And they are no less valid than a womans!
squatpuke said:These are all conditions/questions that must be considered prior to unprotected sex....personally, I feel you must want children enough to take on the responsibilty for ANY problems they might have....one cannot (should not) abort children for convenience....what if the couple wanted a boy but got a girl? What if they wanted twins but only (God-forbide) got a single...your argument works both ways in both extremes. Quality of life is not based on financial or physical standards....(if it was I would the MOST unhappy/miserable person on earth).
I agree with you personally but I cannot agree with a law that would force a woman to carry a child to term they did not want to, or if there were serious reasons as to why they could not care for the child adequately.
There might be no reason as to why they could not care for a normal child, and also it is the most probably outcome of pregnancy, but I do agree there are many 'unnecessary abortions' for purely physical reasons. That said, I passionately believe you cannot force a competent woman to do anything to her body she does not want to
Really? The psychological trauma this would do to a woman doesnt bear thinking about so I would think it is justifiedsquatpuke said:
chesty said:
Not always, Iraq was unable to mount any significant defence of its cities by bombing, as a result civillian casualties were high. Children in cities would not necessariuly be able to protect themselves, and they are being killed in their natural habitat without even being able to form an opinion as to why the war was happening
not going to get into abortion but that stupid bitch needs to die before she has a chance to bring more of her into the world
maybe she will be hit by a bus or struck by lightning, one can only hope
stupid ass legal system if there was any justice her minimum punishment should be for her to be fixed so she can't do this kinda fucked up shit again
maybe she will be hit by a bus or struck by lightning, one can only hope
stupid ass legal system if there was any justice her minimum punishment should be for her to be fixed so she can't do this kinda fucked up shit again
aghhhhhh why must the word abortion suck me in so much
to all you pro choicers out there who harp on this that or the other thing, as well as all the pro lifers, none of you really have a fucking clue what your talking about unless you have first hand experiance I don't care what you think
My gf's and myself acted based on health reasons and despite the fact that its one of the accepted reasons by both sides, its still basically fucked me up for life and you have no idea what that shit has done to her mentally. Every single time something bad happens to me I feel like I deserve it. I hate this subject, I hate it and it forces me to look at myself every single time and I try and stomach what I see. I honestly can't believe how fucking idiotic someone has to be to go ythrough with this shit based on reasons like physical appearance or what not. Yea I don't think its my right to tell a woman what she can or can't do, but I don't think she has any idea what it will do to her in the long run and I think these peopel really need to start taking this shit into account
to all you pro choicers out there who harp on this that or the other thing, as well as all the pro lifers, none of you really have a fucking clue what your talking about unless you have first hand experiance I don't care what you think
My gf's and myself acted based on health reasons and despite the fact that its one of the accepted reasons by both sides, its still basically fucked me up for life and you have no idea what that shit has done to her mentally. Every single time something bad happens to me I feel like I deserve it. I hate this subject, I hate it and it forces me to look at myself every single time and I try and stomach what I see. I honestly can't believe how fucking idiotic someone has to be to go ythrough with this shit based on reasons like physical appearance or what not. Yea I don't think its my right to tell a woman what she can or can't do, but I don't think she has any idea what it will do to her in the long run and I think these peopel really need to start taking this shit into account
I speak from experience having a girlfriend who ended up pregnant and without telling me she was she went and had an abortion, then told me about it later. My brothers now ex wife did that to him 2 that he knows of.
That to me is bullshit.
Again, your right I don't have a uterus. That doesn't make me any less qualified to speak on the matter. So get off the kick of anatomy that men don't have. Just because a woman has an uterus doesn't mean she is qualified to speak on a subject and a man isn't.
As for Iraq, their military was quite capable of mounting a defense had they chosen to. They had poor leadership. And in general are afraid to fight. But hey, they rattled their sabers at us just as much as we did to them. We warned them to follow international law, they chose not to.
I don't think that they are that incapable, they have gotten close to 2000 dead Americans and allies. So, not so bad for diaper wearers.
Let's see if this debate can be done on a more rational/scientific level. I highly doubt that it can be done here, but prove me wrong.
No name calling, no swearing, no insulting, degrading comments, etc. Think it possible?
That to me is bullshit.
Again, your right I don't have a uterus. That doesn't make me any less qualified to speak on the matter. So get off the kick of anatomy that men don't have. Just because a woman has an uterus doesn't mean she is qualified to speak on a subject and a man isn't.
As for Iraq, their military was quite capable of mounting a defense had they chosen to. They had poor leadership. And in general are afraid to fight. But hey, they rattled their sabers at us just as much as we did to them. We warned them to follow international law, they chose not to.
I don't think that they are that incapable, they have gotten close to 2000 dead Americans and allies. So, not so bad for diaper wearers.
Let's see if this debate can be done on a more rational/scientific level. I highly doubt that it can be done here, but prove me wrong.
No name calling, no swearing, no insulting, degrading comments, etc. Think it possible?
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chesty said:
The reason this is doubtful is due mainly to the fact that you dont hold yourself to your own rules.
No offense, Austin - I feel for you and your girl but for you to make the comment that a woman doesnt have a clue about what it means to have an abortion is incredibly insulting to many of us. Not all people react the same way to similar events.
Do you honestly believe that anyONE (male or female) thinks that it will be some sort of cake walk? Why do you think you are the only person that actually sits and thinks about the gravity of a situation and no one else is capable of intelligent thought?
Listen - life isn't easy and it isnt pretty. We all have our crosses to bear. I am truly sorry for the difficulty that life has handed you but how you perceive an event is not the same for me so though I feel your intentions are good, you must realize how insulting your comments are.
I am nearly 40 years old and have been through *this much* life. Do you honestly believe that were I faced with a decision like whether or not to have an abortion that I would need YOU (or anyone else) to tell me about the gravity of such a decision?
Come on.
Guess what? It would not affect me the same. I am older and have had several children. They are my primary concern. Any subsequent children would be given less consideration, especially were it a child that would not be wanted by me. Do I take measures to insure I will not be faced with such a decision? Yes, I do. However, that does not mean that it couldn't happen.
I have already had children that I have carried, birthed, nursed and raised primarily ripped from me so please dont tell me how damaging it would be for me to NOT HOLD a baby that will never be. I have already been damaged forever by the events of my life. An abortion would hardly make it worse. Especially if the pregnancy would be the result of a casual affair.
If it were with a man that I loved deeply (as in my exbf) it would be difficult, but guess what? I would get over it quick as I have children already that I brought here that need me as mentally and emotionally intact as much as possible. It is my responsibility to them that would keep me from being so affected... as it has been through the last near 5 years of hell.
Biology dictates that a child grows within the body of a woman. Like it or not (right or wrong) it is up to them alone to decide whether that child will be allowed to grow and actually come into this world.
If anyone has issue with that - they need to take it up with God.
A woman needs to be more prudent in whom she sleeps with as she can never truly walk away. A man can at any time, with this privilige rights are lost.
Biology dictates.
The only "good reason" I ever need for the desire to terminate a pregnancy is simple: I DONT WANT THAT BABY.... end of story.
Call me the devil. Say that I will rot in hell. It's all good. Unless you (and by this I mean anyone) are going to bear the burden of MY DECISION you can have an opinion - BUT YOU GET NO SAY.
the vast majority of people in general have no clue what they are getting themselves into. DOn't honestly tell me that women your age are the primary users of the abortion method. Its stupid teenage girls who got themselves in a jam and need a quick way out, like most young people they don't THINK!! I was stupid, we weighed the options but I regretted it like sin later and so did she. Unless your just an uncaring cold empty shell, don't tell me that you can have an abortion and not be affected by it afterwards. What I was getting at is all these people who harp about freedom of choice, or pro life, whichever have no idea what its like to actually go through it yet they all act like some kind of experts. Unless you have been through it, you have NO CLUE!! NONE!! Yes what I went through was only a fraction of what my girlfriend did, but I gaurantee I know more about the ramifications of an abortion then a woman that hasn't been through it. I live it everyday, and so does everyone else I know that has been through it. Don't lecture me on what you would do if its not been done
and Im sorry you had your kids ripped from you, but the differance is that one situation is a choice, you choose to terminate that baby, his blood and soul and all the could have beens are on YOUR HEAD and you have to live with that for the rest of your life. How is that the same as having your ex take away your children, he is at fault there, and at least they are alive and living rather then never even being given the chance
I'm pro choice in that I don't think its my right to tell people what to do with themselves, but Im also well aware of whats at stake and I really don';t think the majority of those that go in have any idea what it will do to them emotionally when they get a lil older and are able to better understand the gravity of it all.
and Im sorry you had your kids ripped from you, but the differance is that one situation is a choice, you choose to terminate that baby, his blood and soul and all the could have beens are on YOUR HEAD and you have to live with that for the rest of your life. How is that the same as having your ex take away your children, he is at fault there, and at least they are alive and living rather then never even being given the chance
I'm pro choice in that I don't think its my right to tell people what to do with themselves, but Im also well aware of whats at stake and I really don';t think the majority of those that go in have any idea what it will do to them emotionally when they get a lil older and are able to better understand the gravity of it all.
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Austin316 said:
Im 30 and have made the trip to the abortion clinic with women twice in my life. I was not a teenager and knew what I was getting into and under the circumstances it was the best choice for us. Its interesting to note both times I had to persuade them into going. Years later one of them even thanked me for talking her into it and recognized how her life would have *probably* been a lot worse than it is today. As for the other, Ive talked to her a few times but we never broached the subject, although I can guess that since she is now at a top university making good grades and has her life ahead of her I would like to think I played an integral hand in that also.
In alternate universes they didnt get abortions, and based on the situations and firsthand knowledge I have of their lives and of my own, I think I can say with great certainty it would have been a lot worse for all parties involved.
No regrets.
thats why I said majority and not all. It's also important to note Im not saying that at times its not the best option, its all situational but seriously for most people that go in there I don't think they know what they are getting into. Its important I think to go over everything in your head before it happens, and then make a decision, but so many people just do it casually, go in there and get it done the same day without any real support from family or the person who aided in making the baby to begin with. I don't buy the fact that someone can have an abortion and not be affected by it, yea it may have been the best choice, but I think it will always raise questions in the back of your head, I just try not to think about it and live my life, but when I do stop and think it hurts a lil bit.
but back to this case right here though, the fact is that bitch should have gotten the same punishment as her bf, they both were equally responsible
but back to this case right here though, the fact is that bitch should have gotten the same punishment as her bf, they both were equally responsible
chesty said:
But my comparison is that as a soldier you feel that war is just in some cases. However there are children out in Iraq who could not defend themselves against death just as there are in your words kids in a uterus that cannot defend themselves. I just find it incredulous that while a foetus is in utero it is seen as defenceless yet when there are gross losses of life happenening to delivered children round the world it isn't seen as the same
As for the hippocratic oath, the Dr has a sworn duty to his patient, the mother and has a duty of care to her to do no harm. This is the justification for the abortion act, whether in practise this means some abortions are done for convienience is up to the practicioner but there are clear medical stipulations in there as well.
But what would you do if someone did not want to have their child and you said they had too? Let them go for a back street abortion? or force them to carry to term? What if they refused, would you drip feed them? How would you deliver the baby if they refused to, would you C-section them against their will? All of this constitues battery...
Abortion is wrong. You can sugar coat it and put all sorts of anecdotes on it, but in the end it is ending a life that someone did not want for whatever reason.
Our society has become one of a disposable commodity. If I don't want it I get rid of it. Doesn't matter why I don't want it, I just don't.
If for example, abortion were to remain on the books, I would have the law rewritten to require all seeking one, male/female to watch a video showing in full graphic detail just exactly how the abortions are done. Whether first tri mester or partial birth. I would also require them to seek counseling so that they understand the ramifications and are fully aware of the alternatives. I would also require that the father be notified and given a say in the matter. Just because it is her body, does not mean the child is only hers. If the father is not known, then a reasonable effort must be used to locate the father.
If abortion law were to be overturned, then the woman should be required to carry to term. If she wants, give the child up for adoption with the father having first choice unless he waives his rights to the child.
If she seeks a back street abortion then she is tried for murder just like the male in the story initially starting this thread.
Our society has become one of a disposable commodity. If I don't want it I get rid of it. Doesn't matter why I don't want it, I just don't.
If for example, abortion were to remain on the books, I would have the law rewritten to require all seeking one, male/female to watch a video showing in full graphic detail just exactly how the abortions are done. Whether first tri mester or partial birth. I would also require them to seek counseling so that they understand the ramifications and are fully aware of the alternatives. I would also require that the father be notified and given a say in the matter. Just because it is her body, does not mean the child is only hers. If the father is not known, then a reasonable effort must be used to locate the father.
If abortion law were to be overturned, then the woman should be required to carry to term. If she wants, give the child up for adoption with the father having first choice unless he waives his rights to the child.
If she seeks a back street abortion then she is tried for murder just like the male in the story initially starting this thread.
tinytank
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chesty said:
yes true , but a woman that knows shes pregnant, moves away without telling you comes back 2 years later with a baby and wanting a back payment, for almost 2 years worth of child suport. and telling you that you have a son, is ok and then you end up in debt, cause this bitch never told you about it , happend to my cusin. what gives her the right not to tell the father , then come back for lots of cash, and then says if you dont you go to jail ?? a topic that pisses me right off !
chesty said:
people who seek abortions already recieve councel over their choices, as for showing them a video, would you show people a slaughterhouse before they eat meat, or a video of what it looks like to be in a vegitative state before they sign living wills over whether to recussitate them or not? you think of any choice and presenting them with images they will find distasteful is not fair
you say a woman would be required to carry to term, how would you do this? You would try her for miurder if she tried to doi it herself, well what if she becomes so traumqatised by the pregnancy that she refuses to eat, or triesd to kill herself? what if she doesnt suscribe to your beliefs and is now having what she can and can;t do with her body dictated to by the state? Are you willing to restrain her until she does give birth? What if she refuses to participate in the delivery, this strikes me as being so impossible to undertake without violating the patient on multiple levels
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Chesty - your arguements are backward and foolish.
Austin makes sense. I can understand what his motivations are and why he says the things that he says. And believe it or not Austin I know of MANY WOMEN about my age who have already had children and find themselves pregnant later in life and DO NOT WANT MORE. There are also many women who are NOT silly teenagers (though I wont disagree that most likely a high percentage of those who do have abortions do fit into that category) - the majority of women that I know who did have abortions (I know MANY) where mid twenties - some married - that simply did not want the child that they concieved. It would have seriously impacted their lives (both the life of the woman and the man) they felt, in a negative way. Not one of those women has the feelings of which you speak... NOT ONE.
Even I was surprized at this.
And my children were ripped from me due in part to direct lies told me by lawyers that I trusted and partially due to MY OWN CHOICE. My children will understand why I made the choices I made someday, but not until they are much older. Till then I will have to live with remorse no one will understand unless they were put in the situation. And due to the fucked up laws, sadly, I meet more and more women who did exactly what I did for the same reasons - because we thought it best for our children. And to some extent, because of it, I am just a mere shell of what I used to be.
Oddly enough Superdave presents an arguement that is contrary to what all the right to lifers state and in support of what prochoicers argue - THERE ARE SOME TIMES WHEN IT IS THE BEST CHOICE FOR THOSE PARTICULAR PEOPLE. And I am sure that for every pro-life story there is an equivalent amount (if not more) pro-choice story to support that person's point of view.
You go on and on about abortion as if it is something new.
NOT.
You ever hear of infanticide? Did you know that there are third world countries where abortions are actually part of a package deal with ultrasounds? Those people can not afford a particular gender of child, so if it is the wrong gender - ABORTION!
GUESS WHAT GENDER THAT WOULD BE?
Those women actually make the doctor show them the fetus after the abortion to PROVE that it was a female and NOT a male. So there goes your video idea. You are truly silly if you think some sort of video will keep someone who does not want to carry a child to term for WHATEVER REASON from having an abortion. If this line of thinking were accurate then all we need do to keep teenagers from having sex is to show them an actual video of what is TRULY LIKE to labor and deliver... and then make them watch reality TV about what it is TRULY LIKE once you get that baby home.
One would think that I would be up in arms about this preference in many parts of the world for masculine chidren.
I could care less.
What other people do does not affect me, much like the retarded case that you site as an example for why abortion is wrong to begin with. The case you sited does nothing of the sort. All it does is demonstrate how fucked up law is.
I can go on for days about how fucked up law is and how there is no justice. It would prove nothing.
Abortion/infanticide/infant abandonment has been around for as long as there was a man and a woman. Spare me the silly fundamentalist religious rhetoric. It is far too convenient to be able to pick and choose that way. Have you ever engaged in premarital sex? Then you dont get to use the fundamentalist arguement as you have already contradicted yourself.
At the end of all this dialogue I have only one final statement:
IF YOU FEEL ABORTION IS WRONG - DONT HAVE ONE.
Austin makes sense. I can understand what his motivations are and why he says the things that he says. And believe it or not Austin I know of MANY WOMEN about my age who have already had children and find themselves pregnant later in life and DO NOT WANT MORE. There are also many women who are NOT silly teenagers (though I wont disagree that most likely a high percentage of those who do have abortions do fit into that category) - the majority of women that I know who did have abortions (I know MANY) where mid twenties - some married - that simply did not want the child that they concieved. It would have seriously impacted their lives (both the life of the woman and the man) they felt, in a negative way. Not one of those women has the feelings of which you speak... NOT ONE.
Even I was surprized at this.
And my children were ripped from me due in part to direct lies told me by lawyers that I trusted and partially due to MY OWN CHOICE. My children will understand why I made the choices I made someday, but not until they are much older. Till then I will have to live with remorse no one will understand unless they were put in the situation. And due to the fucked up laws, sadly, I meet more and more women who did exactly what I did for the same reasons - because we thought it best for our children. And to some extent, because of it, I am just a mere shell of what I used to be.
Oddly enough Superdave presents an arguement that is contrary to what all the right to lifers state and in support of what prochoicers argue - THERE ARE SOME TIMES WHEN IT IS THE BEST CHOICE FOR THOSE PARTICULAR PEOPLE. And I am sure that for every pro-life story there is an equivalent amount (if not more) pro-choice story to support that person's point of view.
You go on and on about abortion as if it is something new.
NOT.
You ever hear of infanticide? Did you know that there are third world countries where abortions are actually part of a package deal with ultrasounds? Those people can not afford a particular gender of child, so if it is the wrong gender - ABORTION!
GUESS WHAT GENDER THAT WOULD BE?
Those women actually make the doctor show them the fetus after the abortion to PROVE that it was a female and NOT a male. So there goes your video idea. You are truly silly if you think some sort of video will keep someone who does not want to carry a child to term for WHATEVER REASON from having an abortion. If this line of thinking were accurate then all we need do to keep teenagers from having sex is to show them an actual video of what is TRULY LIKE to labor and deliver... and then make them watch reality TV about what it is TRULY LIKE once you get that baby home.
One would think that I would be up in arms about this preference in many parts of the world for masculine chidren.
I could care less.
What other people do does not affect me, much like the retarded case that you site as an example for why abortion is wrong to begin with. The case you sited does nothing of the sort. All it does is demonstrate how fucked up law is.
I can go on for days about how fucked up law is and how there is no justice. It would prove nothing.
Abortion/infanticide/infant abandonment has been around for as long as there was a man and a woman. Spare me the silly fundamentalist religious rhetoric. It is far too convenient to be able to pick and choose that way. Have you ever engaged in premarital sex? Then you dont get to use the fundamentalist arguement as you have already contradicted yourself.
At the end of all this dialogue I have only one final statement:
IF YOU FEEL ABORTION IS WRONG - DONT HAVE ONE.
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Bikini Mod
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superdave said:
Because most of the people that posted on this thread (the people with the harshest views being men) relayed accounts that would make your input seem almost fictitious. Whodathunk that MURDER could be an "acceptable choice" that didn't forever fuck all parties' lives up permanently.
Your account was not odd to me at all. Actually, what you posted has been what I have found to be indicative of nearly every person's experience that I knew personally that had an abortion.
I realize that my grammar is screwed up, but I think you can all surmize what I am trying to say.
I am not saying that abortion is good or that it is bad.
What I am saying is that it should always be a safe choice that is readily available to those that want to exercise that option regardless of their reasons.
Unless someone has personally taken resposibility for the unwanted child of another - your input is not relevant.
If you chose to keep a child that YOU MADE - good for you. That will not get you into heaven faster. Only makes you someone that opted for the PRIVILIGE of parenthood.
If you carried a child to term and chose to give them up for adoption, I have only respect for your selfless act. I dare say that I dont think I would have the strength of character to make that decision.
And finally -
If you feel abortion is immoral or wrong then just dont have one, but you have no business whatsoever trying to tell me what choice is right for me.
Eringobraugh
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never mind
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wutangnomo
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Beached Whale said:
Beached Whale said:
LMAO! What the hell is the BW post count in this thread at now? I knew it was too good to be true. Typical BW hypocritical bullshit as usual. Says one thing, does another.
quadkilla31
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What the hell does the war in Iraq and voting for George Bush have to do with abortion?bluepeter said:
Eringobraugh
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quadkilla31 said:
He turns every thread into an opportunity to put down the US. It grows tiresome, get used to it, I doubt itll ever change, picks up a board 95% US posters and tries to insult their country.
G
Gambino
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Eringobraugh said:
George Bush was blamed in that tazer thread lol
it harkens back to childhood playground days, when insults and taunts
were a cover for insecurity and jealousy
If you want to know something even odder is I am Vice Chairman of the college republicans at my university. Im there to make sure the kids dont do anything stupid like picket an abortion clinic and harrass the women going in and out, or use our money to print t-shirts titled "top ten reasons abortion is murder" on the back. I may be republican but I still have practical and common sense (I hope) due to my age relative to the people in college.Beached Whale said:Because most of the people that posted on this thread (the people with the harshest views being men) relayed accounts that would make your input seem almost fictitious. Whodathunk that MURDER could be an "acceptable choice" that didn't forever fuck all parties' lives up permanently.
Your account was not odd to me at all. Actually, what you posted has been what I have found to be indicative of nearly every person's experience that I knew personally that had an abortion.
I realize that my grammar is screwed up, but I think you can all surmize what I am trying to say.
I am not saying that abortion is good or that it is bad.
What I am saying is that it should always be a safe choice that is readily available to those that want to exercise that option regardless of their reasons.
Unless someone has personally taken resposibility for the unwanted child of another - your input is not relevant.
If you chose to keep a child that YOU MADE - good for you. That will not get you into heaven faster. Only makes you someone that opted for the PRIVILIGE of parenthood.
If you carried a child to term and chose to give them up for adoption, I have only respect for your selfless act. I dare say that I dont think I would have the strength of character to make that decision.
And finally -
If you feel abortion is immoral or wrong then just dont have one, but you have no business whatsoever trying to tell me what choice is right for me.
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wutangnomo said:LMAO! What the hell is the BW post count in this thread at now? I knew it was too good to be true. Typical BW hypocritical bullshit as usual. Says one thing, does another.
LOL
My but you are the witty one with your little creative editing.
I have yet to post bullshit on this thread. You seem to be doing a good job though - bully for you!
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superdave said:
There is a group of moronic righttolifers who picket in front of this one clinic that is along a major roadway where I live. They have their big graphic pictures and are commonly found on their knees praying. One of these days I will get out of my car and walk up to them and ask how many of these unwanted children they have sponsored from conception to grave.... just once. Truthfully though I am afraid because I know how psychotic some of them can be (some of the posters on this thread have more than proved that) and fear they may become physical. But if the opportunity ever arises where I feel safe enough to ask this... I WILL.
Funny thing... My kids make comments all the time (they are ages 8 1/2 to 13). "What are they doing mommy?" All I say is that they are busy minding other peoples' business as they seem to have not enough business of their own.
They are not necessarily bad people. My parents are very pro life/right wing/involved in church, etc. and they are very well intentioned although they dont go out and protest or picket clinics or anything. I also go out of my way to never mention my abortion views or hint at it in any way. Just a difference of opinion and I figure they can go their whole lives and dont need to know about that about me. But the folks who take action and picket clinics and such, they try to be well intentioned but actions are misguided.Beached Whale said:There is a group of moronic righttolifers who picket in front of this one clinic that is along a major roadway where I live. They have their big graphic pictures and are commonly found on their knees praying. One of these days I will get out of my car and walk up to them and ask how many of these unwanted children they have sponsored from conception to grave.... just once. Truthfully though I am afraid because I know how psychotic some of them can be (some of the posters on this thread have more than proved that) and fear they may become physical. But if the opportunity ever arises where I feel safe enough to ask this... I WILL.
Funny thing... My kids make comments all the time (they are ages 8 1/2 to 13). "What are they doing mommy?" All I say is that they are busy minding other peoples' business as they seem to have not enough business of their own.
Beached Whale said:Spoken like a man.
You can say what you like - YOU WILL NEVER KNOW WHAT IT IS LIKE TO BE FACED WITH SUCH A DECISION.
Thank you very much, but I dont NEED you to decide for me what will or will not make me cry.
Curious. I wonder how many of these men would change their minds on this if they had been born women instead of men. Impossible to know but..................
BTW, I personally don't agree with abortions for lazy, healthy young women. Have the child & decide then, keep or give up. But I also believe in the womans right to make that decision. None of us can stand here & know what reason is going through that woman's head.
she basically comes off as "I know all and you know nothing" with everything nowadays, same old song and dance. I'd like to see all these people that are in constant agreement with her, cuz just about everyone here sure isn't. Everything comes across as arrogant and condecending even though some of us guys here evidently have a much more personal tie to this very subject and unless she has had one (which I don't recall) she really has no idea what WE despite being MEN have gone through be it good or bad. I'm fucking sick and tired of the whole gender card being used, yea you were born a woman, so fucking what? We're all just people and we all go through our fair share of shit, fathers are just as entitled to their children as the mother, it takes two to make a baby, rather then bitching so much about how men have no right to an opinion with abortion, keep your legs shut and stop fucking these very men if its gonna be like that. Yea I'm not gonna tell these girls/women what to do, but doesn;t mean I have to like it or not have an opinion on it. I don't care for those protestors however, they sicken me I don't need to see those posters driving by, and kids certainly do not either
On another note, I read an artical in Men's Health (several years ago), about support & adoption. Apparently, if you fathered a child that was given up for adoption & the child fell under a social services umbrella, they could come back to the biological father. This sort of thing would certainly influence many young men's attitudes.
Remember, our 2 countries believe in the separation of church & state. That means theological arguments cannot be used to form laws.
Remember, our 2 countries believe in the separation of church & state. That means theological arguments cannot be used to form laws.
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hidngod said:
Personally, I believe that if men were the ones to carry the fetus abortion wouldn't even be an issue. Could you imagine a society where a woman would actually have the gaul to tell a man what is right for him?
Where did the word "lazy" come into play as a deciding factor as to which woman has a "legitimate" reason and which one does not?hidngod said:
Please explain.
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Austin316 said:
LOL Austin - that chip on your shoulder is very unnattractive anymore.
Show me ONE POST where I tell anyone "I know everything and you know nothing"?
As for you being sick and tired of the gender card -
As I told Chesty ad nauseum...
You need to take that up with God. Our biology dictates that THE WOMAN is the one to carry the fetus. With this comes great privilige but tremendous responsibility as a woman can NEVER walk away. A man can every single time.
See you dont see me bitching about how I will be the one stuck potentially carrying a child that I may not want and be faced with the decision as to what I should do. Sorry, you need to stop bitching about how it is ultimately the woman's decision and how ultimately you may have no say. Perhaps it is THE MEN that have this problem that should keep THEIR DICKS IN THEIR PANTS and they wont be faced with the issue of having some lazy evil bitch murdering their baby.
See how that works both ways?
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the funny thing is you don't even see how ridiculous you come off
other WOMEN think your full of shit, so does just about everyone else here, your agenda has gotten old, everything is the same old song and dance with you
speak for yourself sure but your obviously not an apropriate representitive of womenkind so back off of it, I damn sure don't see any support being thrown your way. But hey if you can caulossly have an abortion without any negative feelings or lack of guilt whatsoever I'm pretty sure you'll be the one taking that up with God when it comes down to it. I loved how you brought in the backwater coutnries of the world to strengthen your argument with infanticide, its almost like your endorsing the practice, yea we should all take lessons from civilizations that are still trapped in the stone age. Get a clue that has no merit in any argument for abortion whatsoever its completly differant and its done so people don't have to pay a dowry, don't see dowrys happening here
other WOMEN think your full of shit, so does just about everyone else here, your agenda has gotten old, everything is the same old song and dance with you
speak for yourself sure but your obviously not an apropriate representitive of womenkind so back off of it, I damn sure don't see any support being thrown your way. But hey if you can caulossly have an abortion without any negative feelings or lack of guilt whatsoever I'm pretty sure you'll be the one taking that up with God when it comes down to it. I loved how you brought in the backwater coutnries of the world to strengthen your argument with infanticide, its almost like your endorsing the practice, yea we should all take lessons from civilizations that are still trapped in the stone age. Get a clue that has no merit in any argument for abortion whatsoever its completly differant and its done so people don't have to pay a dowry, don't see dowrys happening here
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