Preventative Joint Supplementation

[MikeMartial]

This could probably go in the sup forum, but I'd rather get a perspective from a martial artist rather than a bodybuilder.

What style of martial arts do you practice?
Do you supplement with anything to protect your joints?
Do you currently have joint issues?

Myself, I practice TKD and MT.
I take 6 capsules of concentrated salmon oil per day (2400mgEPA/1200mgDHA)
I take approx 3000mg Vitamin C
I do not currently have any joint issues.

The reason I bring this up is because 1) It's very common for martial artists to develop inflammation in the elbows, shoulders, hips and knees. Also, 2) My knees have been a bit "creaky" lately, and I have have been wondering about more preventative measures.

 

[oxymed]

bjj and i take glucoamine and chondroitin........dont have any joint issues

 

[Reakt]

What style of martial arts do you practice?

At the moment only BJJ but usually MT and Wrestling also, but i've been unable to train MT and wrestling for a few months due to injuries.

Do you supplement with anything to protect your joints?

Yes, i take a powdered mix of MSM, Glucosamine and Chrondroitin + some minerals and vitamins. Also flaxseed oil and fish oil

Do you currently have joint issues?

Yes,
1. Im rehabbing prolapsed left shoulder which is why i cant train any standup atm.
2. Even years before this prolapsed shoulder my right rotator cuff would ache after alot of training.
3. My knees always grind and sometimes ache especially in cold weather.
4. Im recovering from prolapsed disc another reason i cant train standup atm.

Thats it for the moment, occasionally i get some hip pain also, i feel the powder that i take does help my joint pain alot because when i stop taking it i feel like an old man, even though i feel like one now.

 

[young_gunz]

TKD
no supplements for joints, but need to start taking something, had ACL MCL and meniscus surgery so need to take some supplements my feet are killing me from all the kicking its hard to train with wieghts and run with the problems any advice?????

 

[fortunatesun]

• No MA training
• I also use fish oil and C
• There's a few things you could do during weight training that will act as a preventative for your knees

Walkouts are great for increasing the amount of connective tissue in your legs, which will in turn protect your joints. Load up a bar with an amount 30%-40% more than your 1 rep max for squats. Walk it out of the rack and walk it back in. You want to hold the weight on your back for 20 seconds. This is the Overload Principle. The same can be accomplished with rack pulls and/or presses (partials of the rack) for upper body issues.

The second thing is plyometric training, which I assume you guys are already good at. By taking submaximal weights (40%-65%) and moving them 2-3 times faster than normal, your joints, ligaments, and also your bones become denser. Examples for lower body would be box squats and the use of bands.

 

[MikeMartial]

Walkouts are great for increasing the amount of connective tissue in your legs, which will in turn protect your joints.

Awesome idea on the walkouts---hadn't heard of that one, but I undertsand the principle of overloading.

The second thing is plyometric training, which I assume you guys are already good at. By taking submaximal weights (40%-65%) and moving them 2-3 times faster than normal, your joints, ligaments, and also your bones become denser. Examples for lower body would be box squats and the use of bands.

I had always assumed plyos were done with explosive movement, geared towards building explosive power (obviously). I know one needs a certain level of conditioning in the connective tissue prior to starting plyos, but I'm not 100% convinced they can be used as a preventative/therapeutic means.

 

[fortunatesun]

I had always assumed plyos were done with explosive movement, geared towards building explosive power (obviously). I know one needs a certain level of conditioning in the connective tissue prior to starting plyos, but I'm not 100% convinced they can be used as a preventative/therapeutic means.

The idea is that you're not stressing your muscle in the 'normal' weight training sense. Rather, you're starting from a relaxed condition, e.g., sitting on a box, and then exploding as you said. This causes a shock which forces your muscle to contract and then rapidly expand. This expansion is what causes stress of your connective tissue and so forth. Your joints, ligaments, and bones receive the force of this shock wave and adapt by increasing density. In rehab facilities not covered by my HMO plan, they have machines that allow you to pre-set and adjust speed of movement to very precise degrees.
Anyway, that's the theory. Of course today's wisdom is tomorrow's garbage. You could be the one on the right track.

 

[KD1]

USP Labs Cissus RX, best joint/tendon supp Ive ever used.

 

[young_gunz]

• No MA training
• I also use fish oil and C
• There's a few things you could do during weight training that will act as a preventative for your knees

Walkouts are great for increasing the amount of connective tissue in your legs, which will in turn protect your joints. Load up a bar with an amount 30%-40% more than your 1 rep max for squats. Walk it out of the rack and walk it back in. You want to hold the weight on your back for 20 seconds. This is the Overload Principle. The same can be accomplished with rack pulls and/or presses (partials of the rack) for upper body issues.

The second thing is plyometric training, which I assume you guys are already good at. By taking submaximal weights (40%-65%) and moving them 2-3 times faster than normal, your joints, ligaments, and also your bones become denser. Examples for lower body would be box squats and the use of bands.

Thanks bro ill try that, i used to take (gluclosemin)??spell, +msn, and it felt a little better but nothing with noticable results,hell it could of been all in my head

 

[fortunatesun]

I think glucosamine is more effective when you are on the far side of 40 because your body normally manufactures a sufficient amount about then. I"m sure, though, that some may find it useful earlier.

 

[draxxius]

Mike Martial,

I have heard from various sources from the food industry that fish oils are quite fickle liquids. Apparently, the ones in capsules are usually old and generally useless. The best way, they say, is to just eat the fatty fishes.


Another suprising note, compared to 1901's fish population, today, there is just 1% of that population left.....isn't that crazy?

 

[draxxius]

They say that eating fish 2 - 3 times a week is enough for the heart, but I am not sure about the joint/connective tissue. From what I've read, I would make the glucosamine/msm/chondroitin mixture top priority, then fish oils.

As far as our bodies making it up until 40, I believe if you are young, and suffer damage/stress to the connective tissues, extra supplies will only help. I remember speaking to a nutritionist at gnc. She was older, and had a white coat, she must have been knowledgable enough. She said her son, who was 17 or so, had a shoulder injury, and the glucosamine made it heal a lot faster than normal.

I like the walkout/overloading idea. I do farmer's deadlift with 300 lbs total, and shrug that, along with holding it for 20 secs. for about 3 sets. As I am holding this weight, I do a slight lunge position, and it really strengthens the legs, connectively tissue speaking.

 

[MikeMartial]

I remember speaking to a nutritionist at gnc. She was older, and had a white coat, she must have been knowledgable enough.

I hope that sentence was drenched in sarcasim.... Because DAY-UM it made me laugh!!!

But on a serious note, thanks for the reply, and the advice on Gluc/Chon!

 

[Maverick]

This could probably go in the sup forum, but I'd rather get a perspective from a martial artist rather than a bodybuilder.

What style of martial arts do you practice?
Do you supplement with anything to protect your joints?
Do you currently have joint issues?

Myself, I practice TKD and MT.
I take 6 capsules of concentrated salmon oil per day (2400mgEPA/1200mgDHA)
I take approx 3000mg Vitamin C
I do not currently have any joint issues.

The reason I bring this up is because 1) It's very common for martial artists to develop inflammation in the elbows, shoulders, hips and knees. Also, 2) My knees have been a bit "creaky" lately, and I have have been wondering about more preventative measures.

your a pussy, without the hair......... TKD guys get PWNED by BJJ guys

 

[MikeMartial]

your a pussy, without the hair......... TKD guys get PWNED by BJJ guys

the 14 y/o kid said PWNED!!!

(Plus, he doesn't know what MT stands for )

 

[Djimbe]

Mike ;

Saw a study recently about the WAY a MA moves in relation to the Joint Damage . It turns out that The "Chamber and SNAP" school of Motion ala the Okinawan/Japano/Korean schools of pugilism has been connected with causing some Joint Issues , as has the Breakfalling style ala Judo and its Offshoots , as opposed to Wrestling and Shuaijiao's falling style . Styles such as Muay Thai , most Chinese Systems , and Savate wich SWING their kicks have far lower incidents of Practitioners in need of Hip and Knee replacements in their Later years .

 

[MikeMartial]

It turns out that The "Chamber and SNAP" school of Motion ala the Okinawan/Japano/Korean schools of pugilism has been connected with causing some Joint Issues .

I have no doubt that style of training lends itself to damaged joints; as a teen, my karate sensei would NOT let us "snap" any of our kicks---he had trained this way for years, and both his knees were shot. His style was a hybrid combo of kickboxing with traditional karate. Later on, almost every traditional style of karate I took taught the "snap" versus "thrust". The TKD I took also utilizes the "snap".

Styles such as Muay Thai , most Chinese Systems , and Savate wich SWING their kicks have far lower incidents of Practitioners in need of Hip and Knee replacements in their Later years .

As far as MT is concerned, the biggest difference I notice versus traditional karate or TKD is training with heavy bags and/or pads. In both my karate and TKD classes, we rarely every used a heavy bag or shield---most of the training was done in a "controlled" setting (eg, throwing a roundhouse kick and stopping within inches from your partners temple). While this may teach control, it (IMO) also plays havoc on your joints.

In my MT class, we always utilize either focus mitts, thai pads, or body armor. While it may not teach total control for beginners, it sure as hell feels better on the joints. Having that energy transfered to a bag/pad versus being absorbed by a knee/hip/elbow/shoulder makes a world of a difference.

 

[Bozwell]

been doing bjj and mt Ive always been ito power lifting and I find that cod liver oil 2g ed , 3-4 glucosamine500mg/chrondonrtin400mg/msm100mg tabs ed ,and lots of water ,water lubes you up good
also been looking at a product callled bio sil, a natural silicon product to streanthen joints

 

[Stillhere7]

HA- Hyaluronic Acid



It ends there.

 

[MikeMartial]

HA- Hyaluronic Acid

It ends there.

Interesting; I haven't heard of this supplement. I'll have to look into it!

 

[1crow]

I remember speaking to a nutritionist at gnc. She was older, and had a white coat, she must have been knowledgable enough.

??????????

 

[draxxius]

garlic oil will definetely help, I just recently discovered that. After sledgehammering too much to tear down my old deck, I had this awful pain in my right arm, around the bicep, lower forearm(closer to bicep) and sometimes shoulder. Garlic oil helped the pain and helped it heal in under a week. I was also taking borage oil and fish oil.

I have found out that to really get noticeable benefits from fish oil, it needs to be prescription strength, such as Omacor. I do not know what insurance you may have, but it may give you a discount. I know my insurance does not always discount every item. $60 for a 60 count bottle. $1 a gel. very expensive, but people are raving like mad on the testimonials, saying it is a near panax (cure all).

Borage oil rocks too.