Possible Oral only cycle...

[Steve The Bluesman]

I know, I know...you have to stick to get big - but since a lot of folks here do oral only cycles, I thought I would try and put a few things together.

Mind you I have been researcing for a while now but I realize I still have much to learn.

So here is my oral cycle, and I will try to justify my reasoning for each.

I would like to have the knowledgable critique it, see what is wrong, what is right, and what could be changed. Dosages could be changed of course, what is listed is low dosages.

Here we go:

Days 1-20 Dbol 20-30/ED
Days 11-20 Proviron 25/ED

Dbol is a great starter - mass and strength. I am adding proviron to cut down on the bloat, make sure the pecker is working well, and to reduce chances of gyno early in the cycle. I realize 3 weeks isn't much time for gyno or sides in general to become an issue, but given proviron's other benefits, I like it for a 10 day run.

Day 21-44 Turanabol, 20-40/ED

The more I research this stuff, the more I like it. It seems a combination of dbol and avavar - with very little sides. I guess it has only recently been circulating since BD starting manufacturing it - I beleive the more info is spread about T-bol, the more popular it will become. I will assume at this point that any bloat from the Dbol usage will be gone - and the gains from the Dbol can be built upon with the T-bol. I also understand that most T-bol gains max out at 4 weeks, so three weeks here seems about right.

Day 45-54 Winny, 20-30/ED

10 days of winny to harden up the muscles and end the 54 day cycle. Again, from what I have read, you do not want to run orals for more than 6-8 weeks. This one would be about 7.5 weeks. Not running the AAS concurrently will also allow you to isolate any bad sides from any one of the products...

Day 55-68, Nolva 20-40/ED

Simple PCT - Tbol & winny do not shut you down as hard as other AAS, and 2 weeks should do the job.

Naturally liver protectant run throuout - lots of water, and no booze. I know the 17aa problem here - that is why I would keep the mg's low, but enough to be effective.

Please note - I am not saying this will work, I am throwing it out there based on my limited knowledge to see what the experts think.

So lets hear it...


Bluesman

 

[smaretick]

I know, I know...you have to stick to get big - but since a lot of folks here do oral only cycles, I thought I would try and put a few things together.

Mind you I have been researcing for a while now but I realize I still have much to learn.

So here is my oral cycle, and I will try to justify my reasoning for each.

I would like to have the knowledgable critique it, see what is wrong, what is right, and what could be changed. Dosages could be changed of course, what is listed is low dosages.

Here we go:

Days 1-20 Dbol 20-30/ED
Days 11-20 Proviron 25/ED

Dbol is a great starter - mass and strength. I am adding proviron to cut down on the bloat, make sure the pecker is working well, and to reduce chances of gyno early in the cycle. I realize 3 weeks isn't much time for gyno or sides in general to become an issue, but given proviron's other benefits, I like it for a 10 day run.

Day 21-44 Turanabol, 20-40/ED

The more I research this stuff, the more I like it. It seems a combination of dbol and avavar - with very little sides. I guess it has only recently been circulating since BD starting manufacturing it - I beleive the more info is spread about T-bol, the more popular it will become. I will assume at this point that any bloat from the Dbol usage will be gone - and the gains from the Dbol can be built upon with the T-bol. I also understand that most T-bol gains max out at 4 weeks, so three weeks here seems about right.

Day 45-54 Winny, 20-30/ED

10 days of winny to harden up the muscles and end the 54 day cycle. Again, from what I have read, you do not want to run orals for more than 6-8 weeks. This one would be about 7.5 weeks. Not running the AAS concurrently will also allow you to isolate any bad sides from any one of the products...

Day 55-68, Nolva 20-40/ED

Simple PCT - Tbol & winny do not shut you down as hard as other AAS, and 2 weeks should do the job.

Naturally liver protectant run throuout - lots of water, and no booze. I know the 17aa problem here - that is why I would keep the mg's low, but enough to be effective.

Please note - I am not saying this will work, I am throwing it out there based on my limited knowledge to see what the experts think.

So lets hear it...


Bluesman

I am on day 14 of a oral (dbol - 30mg ED) cycle. I am taking 10mg ED Tamoxifen (Nolva) & it seems to be keeping the bloat to a minimum. I am taking Milk Thistle for liver health. I know we all react differently but the tamoxifen seems to be working for me.

 

[pudding]

I know, I know...you have to stick to get big - but since a lot of folks here do oral only cycles, I thought I would try and put a few things together.

Mind you I have been researcing for a while now but I realize I still have much to learn.

So here is my oral cycle, and I will try to justify my reasoning for each.

I would like to have the knowledgable critique it, see what is wrong, what is right, and what could be changed. Dosages could be changed of course, what is listed is low dosages.

Here we go:

Days 1-20 Dbol 20-30/ED
Days 11-20 Proviron 25/ED

Dbol is a great starter - mass and strength. I am adding proviron to cut down on the bloat, make sure the pecker is working well, and to reduce chances of gyno early in the cycle. I realize 3 weeks isn't much time for gyno or sides in general to become an issue, but given proviron's other benefits, I like it for a 10 day run.

Day 21-44 Turanabol, 20-40/ED

The more I research this stuff, the more I like it. It seems a combination of dbol and avavar - with very little sides. I guess it has only recently been circulating since BD starting manufacturing it - I beleive the more info is spread about T-bol, the more popular it will become. I will assume at this point that any bloat from the Dbol usage will be gone - and the gains from the Dbol can be built upon with the T-bol. I also understand that most T-bol gains max out at 4 weeks, so three weeks here seems about right.

Day 45-54 Winny, 20-30/ED

10 days of winny to harden up the muscles and end the 54 day cycle. Again, from what I have read, you do not want to run orals for more than 6-8 weeks. This one would be about 7.5 weeks. Not running the AAS concurrently will also allow you to isolate any bad sides from any one of the products...

Day 55-68, Nolva 20-40/ED

Simple PCT - Tbol & winny do not shut you down as hard as other AAS, and 2 weeks should do the job.

Naturally liver protectant run throuout - lots of water, and no booze. I know the 17aa problem here - that is why I would keep the mg's low, but enough to be effective.

Please note - I am not saying this will work, I am throwing it out there based on my limited knowledge to see what the experts think.

So lets hear it...


Bluesman

Thanks I appreciate this info

 

[Steve The Bluesman]

I want to make one other point about this cycle - the whole deal should run only about a couple of hundred bucks - YMMV, of course...


Bluesman

 

[vio]

I was actually thinking of a quite similar cycle, however, winstrol isn't good on my tendons, so I'll trade it for anavar 40mg ed, thank you very much.

 

[Steve The Bluesman]

Did I hit the holy grail of Oral cycles? How come no one is coming out slamming me?




Bluesman

 

[roidpuple]

winny can shut you down.. but you look alright.. good luck..

 

[wootoom]

not slammin at all. looks good. i was talkin to Radar and he said Proviron can be hard on the hairline so dbol and proviron? ouch. as long as you dont care about your hair. looks good otherwise bro. i would sub the winny with anavar if monies not an issue. good luck bro

 

[The Terminator]

Oral only cycles are a GREAT WAY to blow up like a balloon, and then deflate JUST AS FAST

Your gains will probably be lost FASTER than they were acquired...

 

[Herbiv0re]

Oral only cycles are a GREAT WAY to blow up like a balloon, and then deflate JUST AS FAST

Your gains will probably be lost FASTER than they were acquired...

Please....
It only depends on the compounds you are taking, not the way you are taking them.

 

[The Terminator]

Please....
It only depends on the compounds you are taking, not the way you are taking them.

WHEN did I ever mention anything about THE WAY you take them having ANY sort of impact on the results achieved?


With oral only "cycles" you only have a very LIMITED amount of options to choose from (NONE of which are that good imo )

 

[Raffaz]

I would personally never run any orals over 6 weeks. I would get hold of some tylers liver detox aswell. If you havent already done so.

Mick

 

[Herbiv0re]

WHEN did I ever mention anything about THE WAY you take them having ANY sort of impact on the results achieved?


With oral only "cycles" you only have a very LIMITED amount of options to choose from (NONE of which are that good imo )

You did indeed not mention that.

 

[pudding]

I would personally never run any orals over 6 weeks. I would get hold of some tylers liver detox aswell. If you havent already done so.

Mick

I have milk thistle, but where do you find tylers liver detox and do you take during your whole cycle

 

[BOOEY]

I have milk thistle, but where do you find tylers liver detox

You'll find it right next to your syringes, loaded with Test

 

[Apexx]

Steve, Pudding, you're both pussies

J/K guys. I understand that neither of you want to inject yourself. And I'm not one of those people who thinks that oral only cycles are a complete waste of time either. However, your gains off 500mg/wk of test will most likely be greater and you will keep more post cycle.......with less toxicity to your body. Plus, it's easier than an oral cycle. It takes about 2 minutes, once a week to inject rather than remembering three times a day, every day to take pills than can upset your stomach and give you a headache.

Another benefit.............test is cheaper.

Tuffen up bitches!!

 

[pudding]

Steve, Pudding, you're both pussies[/QUOTE
You should let people know how you really feel, why hold back. I like steve's idea, but you already knew that

 

[Apexx]

Steve, Pudding, you're both pussies[/QUOTE
You should let people know how you really feel, why hold back. I like steve's idea, but you already knew that

sorry bro, I hit the submit tab before I was done. I didn't mean to sound like a dick.

 

[pudding]

sorry bro, I hit the submit tab before I was done. I didn't mean to sound like a dick.

no offense taken. I am very capable of laughing at myself. no shit

 

[pudding]

You guys may not realize there are other health issues that may prevent someone fron doing injections without proper supervision. Taking a needle dose not make you tough. I realize the advantages of it, but if you can't do it and are looking for a way around it, then help should be available on the board.

 

[roidpuple]

You guys may not realize there are other health issues that may prevent someone fron doing injections without proper supervision. Taking a needle dose not make you tough. I realize the advantages of it, but if you can't do it and are looking for a way around it, then help should be available on the board.

health issues like what ??? .... what kind of issure fear of needles??
no really why??

 

[pudding]

health issues like what ??? .... what kind of issure fear of needles??
no really why??

I should not reply to this , but I can't help myself. Fear of needles is not my case although I'm sure it is for some. I have said this myself in the past to avoid mentioning my personal situation on the board. If you want to think its bullshit be my guest. There have been many posts from people wanting to get some answers for oral only in the past. Why can't people recieve the help they are asking for without having to be worried about being flmed?

 

[boyer]

scared of alittle 25 gauge needle.

 

[pudding]

scared of alittle 25 gauge needle.

you need to grow up

 

[Raffaz]

I have milk thistle, but where do you find tylers liver detox and do you take during your whole cycle

You can get tylers from the AF store, on this site.

Mick

 

[pudding]

You can get tylers from the AF store, on this site.

Mick

Thanks, karma to you

 

[boyer]

Yeah, Your probably right, nonetheless your still scared of needles. It really doesn't hurt that bad.

 

[wootoom]

Steve, Pudding, you're both pussies

J/K guys. I understand that neither of you want to inject yourself. And I'm not one of those people who thinks that oral only cycles are a complete waste of time either. However, your gains off 500mg/wk of test will most likely be greater and you will keep more post cycle.......with less toxicity to your body. Plus, it's easier than an oral cycle. It takes about 2 minutes, once a week to inject rather than remembering three times a day, every day to take pills than can upset your stomach and give you a headache.

Another benefit.............test is cheaper.

Tuffen up bitches!!

hey bro. i have had good results from var only cycle and i am pretty sure there are others that have good results. i plan on doing a dbol only cycle. i guess well see how bad orals only are. i think if everything is in check there is no possible way you wouldnt see good results from this cycle. not trying to be rude towards ya bro. ya they might be abit harder on the body but i only plan on being on for 6 weeks, if that. i guess it depends on what your goals are

 

[roidpuple]

I should not reply to this , but I can't help myself. Fear of needles is not my case although I'm sure it is for some. I have said this myself in the past to avoid mentioning my personal situation on the board. If you want to think its bullshit be my guest. There have been many posts from people wanting to get some answers for oral only in the past. Why can't people recieve the help they are asking for without having to be worried about being flmed?

yes you should because i can learn from it... right now i dont understand..
if you explained it .. then maybe i would... and i could learn from it that is why we are here... your privacy.?? well i have a fake name and i dont poste my pics.. so seems pretty private to me.. I dont know you.. are you just afraid of being imbarrassed?? because i cont get it...

 

[pudding]

yes you should because i can learn from it... right now i dont understand..
if you explained it .. then maybe i would... and i could learn from it that is why we are here... your privacy.?? well i have a fake name and i dont poste my pics.. so seems pretty private to me.. I dont know you.. are you just afraid of being imbarrassed?? because i cont get it...

Let's say for example someone had a deformation of hands. Do I have keep explaining this to you. They may be able to lift, but not have the dexterity for other things.

 

[boyer]

Let's say for example someone had a deformation of hands. Do I have keep explaining this to you. They may be able to lift, but not have the dexterity for other things.

I would like to apologize to you.

 

[pudding]

I would like to apologize to you.

Thanks, Its a lot easier to say "I don't like needles"

 

[roidpuple]

so I guess you hate talking about it... it bothers you ?? i am not trying to make you feel bad........ but i am sure you have learned to do many other thing.. where there is a will there is a way.... I would think you would just say it.. you can't blame people for trying to tell you the best way....
I just know a lot of people would be happier with the results from the inject but dont really like the idea... and after they finally do it they are happy..... Hell i use to have a friend from my home town that ate with his feet.. i lifted with buddy had under developed fingers on one hand... but he just put the bar on his hand and used his thumb..... i would spot him doing 8 reps or so with 225 on bench and think man i hope the bar dont fall off his hand... .. but it was no problem for him... I put the same weight on and with my big hands am afraid I will drop it.. ha ha.. that boy was somthin else.. he would shoot with his bad hand... to alternate cheeks... when he used his ( little hand ) he stabbed it and leanedd agaist a wall... to push the seringe in.. but if you hate talking about it i will leave you with that........ because i really want to know the whole story with your hands.... but good luck man..

 

[pudding]

so I guess you hate talking about it... it bothers you ?? i am not trying to make you feel bad........ but i am sure you have learned to do many other thing.. where there is a will there is a way.... I would think you would just say it.. you can't blame people for trying to tell you the best way....
I just know a lot of people would be happier with the results from the inject but dont really like the idea... and after they finally do it they are happy..... Hell i use to have a friend from my home town that ate with his feet.. i lifted with buddy had under developed fingers on one hand... but he just put the bar on his hand and used his thumb..... i would spot him doing 8 reps or so with 225 on bench and think man i hope the bar dont fall off his hand... .. but it was no problem for him... I put the same weight on and with my big hands am afraid I will drop it.. ha ha.. that boy was somthin else.. he would shoot with his bad hand... to alternate cheeks... when he used his ( little hand ) he stabbed it and leanedd agaist a wall... to push the seringe in.. but if you hate talking about it i will leave you with that........ because i really want to know the whole story with your hands.... but good luck man..

I suppose I could some how manage it somehow, but it would be quite a feat. I concernered about hurting myself because I have very little control. I also workout exclusively at home. I have a nice seperate gym in my house with all the extra things I need to work out. Point being I don't have anyone to help me. I appreciate your concern. It sounds like you know a little bit about what I'm dealing with because of your friend. He sounds daring and creative.

 

[Malakor]

Pheeeeeeew! Sounds like a real long cycle to me! Think I would be inclined to keep up with current thinking and go for a 3 weeks on and 3 weeks off alternation. As you're taking orals, they should pretty much kick in from the first day of your workout and by the end of the third week any gains will be dropping sharply anyhow so you might just as well stop. I did Thai anabols & proviron (just for insurance purposes) on my first cycle - 15mg with me porridge every day for a month. Gained about 4kg and kept it all with no crash in libido either - in fact it was slightly better after that, not bad for an apprentice old bastard. I guess the key must be not having all that juice circulating in your bloodstream 24hrs a day as you would from an injectable. Afraid I can't comment on the Turanabol as I've never tried it, but Winny tabs make me feel like an 80yo geezer when I got out of bed in the mornings!

 

[Steve The Bluesman]

Steve, Pudding, you're both pussies

J/K guys. I understand that neither of you want to inject yourself. And I'm not one of those people who thinks that oral only cycles are a complete waste of time either. However, your gains off 500mg/wk of test will most likely be greater and you will keep more post cycle.......with less toxicity to your body. Plus, it's easier than an oral cycle. It takes about 2 minutes, once a week to inject rather than remembering three times a day, every day to take pills than can upset your stomach and give you a headache.

Another benefit.............test is cheaper.

Tuffen up bitches!!

Actually I was thinking of Test after I get through with this oral experimentation - my local guy is oral only (He's a moron, thinks that if he gets bagged, pills wont be as bad as injectibles).

But I now have a couple of sources, and IF my body reacts wells to AAS, then I will may run Test E in Sept after the baseball season is over.

I know where pudding is coming from with the "oral only" slamming on this board, but if you search enough, there are plenty of folks who have had good sucess with dbol only. In fact I recall a long thread back in Sept by Jenetic (sp?) about the benefits of a dbol cylce.

In any case I will post my results as I go with it next month...


Thanks to everyone for the input -



Bluesman

 

[Raffaz]

Actually I was thinking of Test after I get through with this oral experimentation - my local guy is oral only (He's a moron, thinks that if he gets bagged, pills wont be as bad as injectibles).

But I now have a couple of sources, and IF my body reacts wells to AAS, then I will may run Test E in Sept after the baseball season is over.

I know where pudding is coming from with the "oral only" slamming on this board, but if you search enough, there are plenty of folks who have had good sucess with dbol only. In fact I recall a long thread back in Sept by Jenetic (sp?) about the benefits of a dbol cylce.

In any case I will post my results as I go with it next month...


Thanks to everyone for the input -



Bluesman

Good luck mate

Mick

 

[Apexx]

hey bro. i have had good results from var only cycle and i am pretty sure there are others that have good results. i plan on doing a dbol only cycle. i guess well see how bad orals only are. i think if everything is in check there is no possible way you wouldnt see good results from this cycle. not trying to be rude towards ya bro. ya they might be abit harder on the body but i only plan on being on for 6 weeks, if that. i guess it depends on what your goals are

Read my post again bro. As I posted, I'm not one of those people who thinks that an oral only cycle is a complete waste of time. I firmly believe that if done properly, even a dbol only cycle can yield some nice (keepable) gains.

I was simply stating that there are much better ways to go about doing a cycle.

 

[Bigdogmikey]

if ur gonna do an oral only cycle why now use 50-60mg of anvar, with turnabol?

 

[Steve The Bluesman]

if ur gonna do an oral only cycle why now use 50-60mg of anvar, with turnabol?

patience, man, patience...

Actually after researching Turanibol, I conculded that it would be similar to a dbol/anavar combo. If it sucks, then next time I will break the bank and get some var.


Bluesman

 

[wootoom]

Read my post again bro. As I posted, I'm not one of those people who thinks that an oral only cycle is a complete waste of time. I firmly believe that if done properly, even a dbol only cycle can yield some nice (keepable) gains.

I was simply stating that there are much better ways to go about doing a cycle.

sorry bro. lol. i thought it said they were a COMPLETE waste of time. my bad bro

 

[pudding]

Hey Div, Like to hear your comments on this thread

 

[DIVISION]

Hey Div, Like to hear your comments on this thread

I don't like extended oral only cycles. There's no potential for substantial gains because an oral's half-life is short when compared to an injectible ester. I might take Winstrol or Halotestin for maintenance, but that's the extent of it for a "cycle".

Oral only cycles are offically OUT!!!!!



DIV

 

[pudding]

I don't like extended oral only cycles. There's no potential for substantial gains because an oral's half-life is short when compared to an injectible ester. I might take Winstrol or Halotestin for maintenance, but that's the extent of it for a "cycle".

Oral only cycles are offically OUT!!!!!



DIV

Does everyone else agree with div. Oral cycles officially out and waste of time. Does anyone disagree?

 

[Triple J]

in the bloodstream a 17aa oral's half-life is actually much longer than that of the non-17aa steroid released from an oil depot. don't confuse the gradual release of the steroid from the ester and dissolution of the oil depot with the half-life of the hormone in the blood-stream. as i recall the half-life of testosterone in the bloodstream is measured in minutes as opposed to any 17aa which will be measured in hours.

granted the oil-based injectables provides a "timed-release" mechanism which has its advantages, and can provide a steady drip. but the extended half-life of a 17aa generally makes them more powerful on a mg vs. mg basis. best example, to try to compare apples to apples, 350mg dbol vs. 350mg eq per week

 

[DIVISION]

granted the oil-based injectables provides a "timed-release" mechanism which has its advantages, and can provide a steady drip. but the extended half-life of a 17aa generally makes them more powerful on a mg vs. mg basis. best example, to try to compare apples to apples, 350mg dbol vs. 350mg eq per week

This is what I was referring to in my argument.

The time released componenet of the oil-based test preparations have a distinct advantage over the 17AA orals. Yes, the 17AA's have a time release property because the liver can't break then down during first pass, though that also makes them harsh while the Test blends are not. That said, I don't think you can compare them at all.

The argument was regarding an oral only cycle, which I still don't think is worthwhile when there are time-released test blends on the market that can be utilized with the 17AA orals.



DIV

 

[roidpuple]

Does everyone else agree with div. Oral cycles officially out and waste of time. Does anyone disagree?

I would not say waste of time..... but if you have your choice inject.. is the way togo.... waste of time .... well you will still see growth...
Hell I did an oral of tren..(finna pellets) my 1st time..
and i grew.... not 17aa.... but they some how worked...

 

[DIVISION]

I would not say waste of time..... but if you have your choice inject.. is the way togo.... waste of time .... well you will still see growth...
Hell I did an oral of tren..(finna pellets) my 1st time..
and i grew.... not 17aa.... but they some how worked...

That's where the hangup is......what constitues a waste of time to me might not be a waste of time to you and vice versa. Yes, you will see growth on an oral only cycle, but not sustantial enough for me to drop everything and proclaim that oral only is the way to go when you've got time-released products that are better suited for long cycles......



DIV

 

[pudding]

There's no doubt the poke is the way to go, but I appreciate the input. Good stuff

 

[BionicBC]

Actually I was thinking of Test after I get through with this oral experimentation - my local guy is oral only (He's a moron, thinks that if he gets bagged, pills wont be as bad as injectibles).

But I now have a couple of sources, and IF my body reacts wells to AAS, then I will may run Test E in Sept after the baseball season is over.

I know where pudding is coming from with the "oral only" slamming on this board, but if you search enough, there are plenty of folks who have had good sucess with dbol only. In fact I recall a long thread back in Sept by Jenetic (sp?) about the benefits of a dbol cylce.

In any case I will post my results as I go with it next month...


Thanks to everyone for the input -



Bluesman

PS-IMO Winny for 10 days only is a waste, but not NEAR as much as a waste as anavar for 10 days. Anavar for 10 days will do absolutely nothing for you bro except waste your cash. Anavar needs to be run for 8-12 weeks, 12 preferrably, to see max results. Although a 17-aa, you COULD probably do something like this if you MUST do an all oral cycle:
Dbol-Weeks 1-3
Tbol-Weeks 4-6
Anavar-Weeks 1-10, or Winny weeks 7-10

I still say just go with needles. If you choose this oral route, Id say do SOMETHING to raise your test levels some, or say goodbye to your sex drive. Whether it be 4-ad, or a test trtansdermal, SOMETHING for the lil man downstairs.
Bionic

 

[roidpuple]

That's where the hangup is......what constitues a waste of time to me might not be a waste of time to you and vice versa. Yes, you will see growth on an oral only cycle, but not sustantial enough for me to drop everything and proclaim that oral only is the way to go when you've got time-released products that are better suited for long cycles......



DIV

I agree..!!!..

 

[Triple J]

an injectable + an oral would likely be the more productive cycle, keeping dosages modest. your body needs testosterone as other have said

but obviously to isolate how your body responds to a substance, no better way than to run it by itself. advantages of short-acting compounds: out of your system fast

the injectables we are referring to, linger for weeks - so they can complicate matters somewhat if there in an onset of sides or going into PCT, things for newbs to keep in mind

i can see the logic in an oral only cycle for some people. i like the simplicity of it for a short cycle of under 8 weeks or so. keeping the gains IMHO just depends if one is under genetic potential or not to start, and then running a smart PCT

 

[DIVISION]

i can see the logic in an oral only cycle for some people. i like the simplicity of it for a short cycle of under 8 weeks or so.

I agree with this, BabyJ.

If simplicity is key, then I can see like an 8 week Winny cycle being beneficial.....but not as beneficial as a Sustanon/Winny 12 week run.

Feel me?



DIV

 

[berlin-ef]

I know, I know...you have to stick to get big - but since a lot of folks here do oral only cycles, I thought I would try and put a few things together.

Mind you I have been researcing for a while now but I realize I still have much to learn.

So here is my oral cycle, and I will try to justify my reasoning for each.

I would like to have the knowledgable critique it, see what is wrong, what is right, and what could be changed. Dosages could be changed of course, what is listed is low dosages.

Here we go:

Days 1-20 Dbol 20-30/ED
Days 11-20 Proviron 25/ED
Day 21-44 Turanabol, 20-40/ED
Day 45-54 Winny, 20-30/ED
Day 55-68, Nolva 20-40/ED

Bluesman

My .02. . .

(1) NO BLOODWORK, NO CYCLE

(2) I don't like the cycle. . . it's too long for orals (6 weeks tops) and I don't think that the choices are all that good either. Dbol at 30 or 35 is good, but I'd run the Anti-e the entire time. The turinabol is fine, but you won't see many gains in mass, the same goes for the winny. Winny only really kicks in your GH levels at 40mg per day and higher, so if you want to cut, you need to up the dosage.

All of these drugs hypertrophy existing muscle, rather than creating new muscle like test does so that's why a lot is lost post cycle. Also, by limiting PCT to 2 weeks, you're going to lose all of it anyway. Most studies show that PCT needs to be considerably longer so I wouldn't chance losing my gains over some cheap nolva/clomid. I go 60 days no matter what just because I don't like losing gains, no matter how small they may be. By the way, if your baseline test levels are low, you won't keep shit either.

As far as splitting doses goes, I never saw the problem with that. If you're eating 6-8 meals anyway, just spread it out over all of them (including at night). During the last week, spread them out over the the workday. This will help with your natural recovery cycle. Personally, I'd just run dbol the entire time. Believe it or not, dbol will cut you once all that water finally goes away. If you're worried about water, stack it with anavar (50) or primo oral (80-100). At these dosages, var and primo will help create new muscle mass that you should be able to keep your gains OR just take some Lasix. For me, bloat isn't an issue with dbol, but the acne and ESPECIALLY the high blood pressue just sucks ass - especially at dosages over 40mg. That being said, I like primo/dbol because I get some AR-mediated gains and 135mg of product with 35mg of liver toxicity. Var can help with joints as well so you may want to throw some in if you use winny.

Like with anything, if your diet sucks (i.e. under 4000kcal and under 2.0g protein per pound LBM), you won't gain crap and you won't keep crap either. Most people who can't do anything with orals fail because their choices, their diet, and their PCT are sub-optimal. Not so surprisingly, oral only cycles are usually a first cycle when users don't know dick anyway, so losses are almost always 100%. On the other hand, if you're looking to gain a solid 10lbs and you've taken the time to perfect this craft, you should be fine. If you want to gain 20-30, you need to go with injectibles over 10-12 weeks. But, start with orals and eventually you'll take the plunge. . . I guarantee it. First, you'll used HCG for recovery, then you'll try some GH because you're curious, and then you'll be injecting everything in your house. After all, you don't want to mess with your liver, do you? ;o)

By the way, I like paper products because I can carry them in my briefcase and nobody knows diddly shit - no syringes, no bottles, not even a strange pentagon-shaped pink pill stuck in your couch ;o) Also, once you start using anavar or primo orals, break out your Christmas bonus because you're gonna need it. . .

(3) NO BLOODWORK, NO CYCLE

Okay, that's it.

 

[pudding]

PS-IMO Winny for 10 days only is a waste, but not NEAR as much as a waste as anavar for 10 days. Anavar for 10 days will do absolutely nothing for you bro except waste your cash. Anavar needs to be run for 8-12 weeks, 12 preferrably, to see max results. Although a 17-aa, you COULD probably do something like this if you MUST do an all oral cycle:
Dbol-Weeks 1-3
Tbol-Weeks 4-6
Anavar-Weeks 1-10, or Winny weeks 7-10

I still say just go with needles. If you choose this oral route, Id say do SOMETHING to raise your test levels some, or say goodbye to your sex drive. Whether it be 4-ad, or a test trtansdermal, SOMETHING for the lil man downstairs.
Bionic

If you had to do an oral cycle for gaining and maximum retention of gains and money was not an issue, what do you think is the best. Like to hear from experienced guys.

 

[DIVISION]

NO BLOODWORK, NO CYCLE

Berlin, I've been preachin' that shit for the longest but it has not real effect......kids don't want to go through the trouble and expense of getting consistent bloodwork done.




DIV

 

[Steve The Bluesman]

That's where the hangup is......what constitues a waste of time to me might not be a waste of time to you and vice versa. Yes, you will see growth on an oral only cycle, but not sustantial enough for me to drop everything and proclaim that oral only is the way to go when you've got time-released products that are better suited for long cycles......



DIV

I am the OP, and I agree that sticking test is the prefered, safest, and most effective way to go, but Div you have been around a lot longer than I have, and you know a lot of folks are doing a lot of oral only cycles, whether due to fear of pins or having access only to orals...I simply wanted to throw a possible oral cycle out there that may be more effective than the standard Dbol only bloat cycle.

But, a lot of these guys are not in the same boat as you are, and as you said what you think is ineffective, may be just the quick 5-10 pound of LBM that the beginning gear user is looking for...

FWIW, I am going to run a Dbol/Proviron/Winny cycle in March as a real world experiment. If it sucks, then I order my Test E, with no regrets.

Later,


Bluesman

 

[pudding]

I know, I know...you have to stick to get big - but since a lot of folks here do oral only cycles, I thought I would try and put a few things together.

Mind you I have been researcing for a while now but I realize I still have much to learn.

So here is my oral cycle, and I will try to justify my reasoning for each.

I would like to have the knowledgable critique it, see what is wrong, what is right, and what could be changed. Dosages could be changed of course, what is listed is low dosages.

Here we go:

Days 1-20 Dbol 20-30/ED
Days 11-20 Proviron 25/ED

Dbol is a great starter - mass and strength. I am adding proviron to cut down on the bloat, make sure the pecker is working well, and to reduce chances of gyno early in the cycle. I realize 3 weeks isn't much time for gyno or sides in general to become an issue, but given proviron's other benefits, I like it for a 10 day run.

Day 21-44 Turanabol, 20-40/ED

The more I research this stuff, the more I like it. It seems a combination of dbol and avavar - with very little sides. I guess it has only recently been circulating since BD starting manufacturing it - I beleive the more info is spread about T-bol, the more popular it will become. I will assume at this point that any bloat from the Dbol usage will be gone - and the gains from the Dbol can be built upon with the T-bol. I also understand that most T-bol gains max out at 4 weeks, so three weeks here seems about right.

Day 45-54 Winny, 20-30/ED

10 days of winny to harden up the muscles and end the 54 day cycle. Again, from what I have read, you do not want to run orals for more than 6-8 weeks. This one would be about 7.5 weeks. Not running the AAS concurrently will also allow you to isolate any bad sides from any one of the products...

Day 55-68, Nolva 20-40/ED

Simple PCT - Tbol & winny do not shut you down as hard as other AAS, and 2 weeks should do the job.

Naturally liver protectant run throuout - lots of water, and no booze. I know the 17aa problem here - that is why I would keep the mg's low, but enough to be effective.

Please note - I am not saying this will work, I am throwing it out there based on my limited knowledge to see what the experts think.

So lets hear it...


Bluesman

Bluesman, I'm considering trying the above, but substitute anavar for tbol. Watcha think.

 

[Steve The Bluesman]

Bluesman, I'm considering trying the above, but substitute anavar for tbol. Watcha think.

First let me say that I am no expert - but I think Anavar is safer, less effective for mass, and more expensive that T-bol. It all depends on what your goals are. If you want more size, go w/Tbol, if you want more hardness, go with var, but if you do, I would probably skip the winny at the end of the cycle to save your hair and your joints from the stress.

Personally I have never used var, but I am not a big fan of it from what I have learned. Too weak (it was designed to be used for children) and it costs a fortune...Cost effectiveness alone would shy me away from it - but if money is no option, go for it...and let evey one know the results!

Good luck,


Bluesman

 

[pudding]

First let me say that I am no expert - but I think Anavar is safer, less effective for mass, and more expensive that T-bol. It all depends on what your goals are. If you want more size, go w/Tbol, if you want more hardness, go with var, but if you do, I would probably skip the winny at the end of the cycle to save your hair and your joints from the stress.

Personally I have never used var, but I am not a big fan of it from what I have learned. Too weak (it was designed to be used for children) and it costs a fortune...Cost effectiveness alone would shy me away from it - but if money is no option, go for it...and let evey one know the results!

Good luck,


Bluesman

Thanks, I'm not to worried about hair. Thick as rug at 46. We will see about my old creeky joints. I am going with tbol as opposed to anavar after alot of reading its better for what my goals are.