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Plunkey

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PICK3 said:
tell me all about China

does it suck?

did you eat "funny" stuff?

do they have a Cutter's?
Click to expand...

The growth there is insane. We were about one hour outside of Shanghai and counted 21 massive construction cranes being used within less than four kilometers of highway.

Their transportation infrastructure is great. They've got more concrete in their freeways than we do. They've got 18 wheeler trucks, but they've also got 22 wheeler trucks that are massive.

Their international hotels and airports are great. Beijing was truly impressive, but let's write that one off to the Olympics. But the others (i.e. Shanghai) are impressive as well.

Once you get to the countryside, things fall off quickly. Most of the factories are in or near second and third tier cities, but the workers come from hours away (i.e. 9+ hour train rides) and reside in on-site dormitories. It's not unusual for a worker to go home only once per year, for the Chinese new year celebration.

They work six days a week -- professional and factory workers. They generally work eight hour days. Working conditions aren't nearly as bad as you'd think. They don't have the safety stops and/or protective gear (especially safety glasses), but the equipment they use is often German, Swiss, Japanese or American. It's a little more dangerous than a US plant, but it's a slight trade-off of safety in exchange for a massive reduction in regulatory burden.

The food in the countryside gets rough. And I'm a billygoat when I travel -- I'll eat anything. You have to get used to meat used for flavoring instead of a main course. But that meat will be 50%+ fat. About the time I got used to the fat, I hit the countryside in We Fang and got a wrap (sort of) filled with meat that was at least 50% strips of pure gristle and cartilage. That was a bit too much for me.

Also with food, the farther you get from the countryside, the more fennel/anise they use. Once you are very rural, the fennel in the rice wine and food will practically knock you down. I hate licorice with a passion and was forced (by manners) to drink tons of licorice-flavored rice wine for two nights in a row.

They do like to show their recent prosperity via large meals. It's all low-cost food, but it's not unusual to have 25-40 plates on the table. And everyone picks at the food on a lazy susan with chopsticks. I didn't get a single meal in individual portions in any of my six days there.
 
I'm sure they have strip clubs, but there has been a crackdown on Western-style clubs with naked chicks running around. I think the way to get sechsuals is via private men's clubs. We stayed out of those and thankfully we didn't have any hosts who insisted on entertaining that way. Typically in the evenings, we just wanted to get to the hotels and crash.

The one-child thing is real. If you have a second (or more) child, you'll get fined by the government. If you have a government job or a job that is connected to the government (and many are), you'll lose that as well. Wealthy people fly to Hong Kong to have their children. Apparently from there you can buy them an ID and bring them back to China, but the details of how that's done was lost in translation. And boys are clearly king -- they are the retirement plan for parents. The girls always leave the family to join the man. So truth be told, it's not your son who will be taking care of you in your old age -- it will probably be your son's wife.
 
And if you get outside a major city, here's your crapper:

2rhqr8z.jpg


You gotta aim carefully!
 
mrplunkey said:
The growth there is insane. We were about one hour outside of Shanghai and counted 21 massive construction cranes being used within less than four kilometers of highway.

Their transportation infrastructure is great. They've got more concrete in their freeways than we do. They've got 18 wheeler trucks, but they've also got 22 wheeler trucks that are massive.

Their international hotels and airports are great. Beijing was truly impressive, but let's write that one off to the Olympics. But the others (i.e. Shanghai) are impressive as well.

Once you get to the countryside, things fall off quickly. Most of the factories are in or near second and third tier cities, but the workers come from hours away (i.e. 9+ hour train rides) and reside in on-site dormitories. It's not unusual for a worker to go home only once per year, for the Chinese new year celebration.

They work six days a week -- professional and factory workers. They generally work eight hour days. Working conditions aren't nearly as bad as you'd think. They don't have the safety stops and/or protective gear (especially safety glasses), but the equipment they use is often German, Swiss, Japanese or American. It's a little more dangerous than a US plant, but it's a slight trade-off of safety in exchange for a massive reduction in regulatory burden.

The food in the countryside gets rough. And I'm a billygoat when I travel -- I'll eat anything. You have to get used to meat used for flavoring instead of a main course. But that meat will be 50%+ fat. About the time I got used to the fat, I hit the countryside in We Fang and got a wrap (sort of) filled with meat that was at least 50% strips of pure gristle and cartilage. That was a bit too much for me.

Also with food, the farther you get from the countryside, the more fennel/anise they use. Once you are very rural, the fennel in the rice wine and food will practically knock you down. I hate licorice with a passion and was forced (by manners) to drink tons of licorice-flavored rice wine for two nights in a row.

They do like to show their recent prosperity via large meals. It's all low-cost food, but it's not unusual to have 25-40 plates on the table. And everyone picks at the food on a lazy susan with chopsticks. I didn't get a single meal in individual portions in any of my six days there.
Click to expand...

Did you get to mingle with the "peeps", or were you always accompanied by execs?

Did they marvel at your size? (big by U.S. standards, prob huge by theirs.)

Did you get a feel for what the average person in China thinks about the U.S. and Americans in general?
 
Here's my entire bathroom in a countryside hotel. The shower head is just mounted right onto the bathroom wall. There's no tub walls or shower curtain.

24b3mnc.jpg
 
PICK3 said:
Did you get to mingle with the "peeps", or were you always accompanied by execs?

Did they marvel at your size? (big by U.S. standards, prob huge by theirs.)

Did you get a feel for what the average person in China thinks about the U.S. and Americans in general?
Click to expand...

I spent time with our guide. She gave us great insight into China. Here's what funny: She's probably in her low 30's and we knew much more about the Tienanmen square controversy back in the late 1980's than she did.

I was with a few execs, but the trip was so rural that they weren't what you'd expect from asian businessmen. They were very blue-collar (but nice).

I was a giant over there. I'd be at least a full head taller than almost anyone. They wouldn't hesitate to comment on it (politely). I'd guess I weigh a good 50%-100% more than many (if not most) of them.

They have a really strange view of Americans. They have an almost irrational reverence for our brands and our popular culture. A US-based company can make a product in China, put their name on it, then sell it back to Chinese customers at a premium. We saw it first hand. A company made instruments for themselves (WeGo) and Medtronic in two virtually identical buildings that were side-by-side. The Medtronic instrument sold for a 100%+ premium price to the WeGo product.

But there is a dark side to how they view us as well. The see us as fat, lazy, indulgent and litigious. They don't understand patents at all. Half of the executives I spoke with used the word "Trademark" instead of "Patent" -- and we had to explain the difference. Also, they had no idea how long patents ran. One owner swore up and down that a patent only lasts 10 years in the US.
 
In the "big cities" did night life carrying on throughout the night, or did everything shut down early?

Is TV 100% state controlled govmint propaganda, or do they have the equivalents of sitcoms (and Jerry)?
 
The other thing that jumped out at me was how quickly they want to develop their own middle class. Europe isn't perceived as a great customer like the US. But they know the US will crash soon. They place a huge emphasis on a "Moderately Prosperous Society" by 2020. But it translates into a double meaning. They use the word "Moderately Prosperous" for modesty purposes and to set expectations. But they also use that word to describe a broad swath of people that both produce and consume in their society -- a middle class. They see depending on the US as a market as a high risk strategy and want to get away from that dependency as soon as possible. They would respectfully tease us about "staying home and printing money". The same phrase was used on three seperate occasions, which makes me think it's a common Chinese phrase.
 
PICK3 said:
In the "big cities" did night life carrying on throughout the night, or did everything shut down early?

Is TV 100% state controlled govmint propaganda, or do they have the equivalents of sitcoms (and Jerry)?
Click to expand...

In the major cities, there's 24/7 nightlife. But huge parts of city shut down (entire buildings and/or blocks will be dark).

In the second and third tier cities, it's unbelievable. You'll go for 2-5 km blowing past buildings that are entirely black. Maybe one in five buildings (at most) will even have a single light on. They have to be cutting power in the evenings, because there's no way you'd have that many buildings entirely black otherwise.

And in the north, they sure don't like heat. People will wear full-blown ski-style jackets indoors. It's not unusual for a building to be at 56-62 degrees Fahrenheit.
 
mrplunkey said:
But they know the US will crash soon.
Click to expand...



Their growth is eventually going to lead to their demise too.


just sayin'

People's Republic of China - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

  • In the past decade, China's cities expanded at an average rate of 10% annually. The country's urbanization rate increased from 17.4% to 46.8% between 1978 and 2009, a scale unprecedented in human history.
  • Estimates of excess deaths in China from environmental pollution (apart from smoking) are placed at 760,000 people per annum from air and water pollution (including indoor air pollution).
  • In 2007, China has overtaken the United States as the world's biggest producer of carbon dioxide.
  • Some 90% of China's cities suffer from some degree of water pollution, and nearly 500 million people lack access to safe drinking water.
 
must have been an hellacious flight to China and connecting to TN

I'd have to take a bottle xannies and a bottle of Ambiens


just sayin'
 
Cable television is 100% government controlled. They recently added a 24 hour news channel (state run). Their newscasts emphasize positive news about growth using highly specific figures (they are very numerically oriented). There are also a lot of stories about the government protecting people from outside evils. During my visit, there were stories on a scandal were pigs were given clenbuterol to make them leaner (and sell for a premium). The paper explained that people eating the tainted meat would become dizzy and have heart palpitations. They cover the Russians very favorably. For example, I saw several newscasts on the Russian space program. They also covered the Japanese reactor problem very dramatically, describing it as Japan's worst disaster since WWII.

They also have game shows and shows for children, that look a lot like our variety shows from the 70's and 80's. It reminded me of "The Price is Right" or "Let's Make a Deal". And a lot of their shows are just plain goofy. I'm certainly no television connoisseur (I love Jerry), but some of this stuff was just infantile.

You can get satellite TV as well, but it's expensive. Our guide didn't have it, so she didn't know much about it. She was convinced that it was partially blocked or controlled as well, but I just don't see how they'd do that with a satellite.

Their Internet service is definitely filtered. I couldn't get on Facebook anywhere in the country. Apparently they had a small facebook-organized uprising around a year ago (according to our guide) and they blocked the service for the country. But I could get on places like EF and Fox News with no problem. But there are at least some Shanghai-based IP's are banned (that's an EF thing, not a government thing).
 
PICK3 said:
Their growth is eventually going to lead to their demise too.


just sayin'

People's Republic of China - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

  • In the past decade, China's cities expanded at an average rate of 10% annually. The country's urbanization rate increased from 17.4% to 46.8% between 1978 and 2009, a scale unprecedented in human history.
  • Estimates of excess deaths in China from environmental pollution (apart from smoking) are placed at 760,000 people per annum from air and water pollution (including indoor air pollution).
  • In 2007, China has overtaken the United States as the world's biggest producer of carbon dioxide.
  • Some 90% of China's cities suffer from some degree of water pollution, and nearly 500 million people lack access to safe drinking water.
Click to expand...

The urbanization is ridiculous. And yes, there's a lot of smog/pollution in the air. The funny thing is, a lot of Chinese (including our guide) believe it is "fog" -- not "smog". Well-educated people will present it as a fact. But is sure looked like pollution to me.

During one of our stops, they took us to an "organic" farm that produced all of their own food for lunch. They were every bit as passionate about their "all-natural" food as any US-based organic foods advocate would be. The lunch was great. Afterward they take you on a tour of the grounds, which were laid-out like an old Chinese village. There's a growing concern that the new generation has no ideas about the old traditions, so they build these organic farms on the edges of cities. They don't just grow food. They also had weaving, blacksmithing and wine-making.

And no, most of the water isn't safe to drink. And you're not going to find ice anywhere except an international hotel. Every hotel room (even the rattiest ones) have a hot water pot for boiling water. The nicer ones had complimentary bottles of water as well. The restaurants don't serve much water either. I asked for a water at one place and it completely confused them. They were offering rice wine and green tea, but I also asked for water. After a lot of confusion, I got a rice wine glass filled with boiling hot water. Not only could I not drink it, but I couldn't even touch the glass since the heat passed right through to the surface. I have no idea what they were thinking.
 
PICK3 said:
must have been an hellacious flight to China and connecting to TN

I'd have to take a bottle xannies and a bottle of Ambiens


just sayin'
Click to expand...

Knoxville -> Detroit -> Shanghei

then several domestic Chinese flights

then

Beijing -> Chicago -> Knoxville

The worst legs were Knoxville -> Detroit and Chicago -> Knoxville.

Xiamen Airlines has larger planes and better service than any US domestic carrier. And you have to re-adjust to skinny, nice flight attendants too. One airline was pretty rough (Tianjin), but the flight attendants were still skinny and nice.
 
superdave said:
the-onion-china-satire-special.jpg
Click to expand...

A discussion of state-run media kicked-off a lively discussion during our visit.

Which would you rather have: Political freedom or economic freedom?

Their standard of living is lower than ours, but the progress they've made over the last 10 years is amazing. I spent a fair amount of time there in the mid 1990's and the advances they have made are incredible. If they leap like that over the next 10 years, they'll be right on top of us.
 
PICK3 said:
KFC’s success in opening and operating fast food restaurants in China is such that one analyst declared it to be “the most successful foreign company in China.” Now, here’s one of the broader effects of that achievement — a huge surge in chicken consumption among the Chinese.

How the Colonel Convinced the Chinese to Eat More Chicken — Lots of It | BNET
Click to expand...

Whoah! I forgot to point that out.

There were a ton of KFC's there. We started to go by one just to see what they served. They weren't the stand-alone stores either. These were integrated into the first floors of fairly large office buildings.

You don't see McDonald's there though. But the Beijing airport has a Kenny Roger's chicken joint in it. That was just frigging weird.
 
PICK3 said:
China: The new fast food nation? - Jul. 13, 2010

Yum opens one new KFC in mainland China almost every day. It already has nearly 3,000 of the fried chicken restaurants operating in 650 Chinese cities. That's in addition to 560 Pizza Hut locations.
Click to expand...

If we could get some real fast food i there (McDonalds, Wendy's Hardees), we may be able to make them as sick as we're getting. And they smoke too -- tons of it.
 
PICK3 said:
Japaneses and Korean young wimmezs are hawter than young Chinese wimmenzs

just sayin'
Click to expand...

True. I'm not an asian-fetish guy in general, but the girls over there weren't particularly hot. They were generally short and thin. Very few larger breasts and lots of flat butts were observed.
 
canadianhitman said:
Did the Chinese wimmenz flock to the rich white foreign businessman?
Click to expand...

Not at all. They were incredibly polite, but didn't make any overtures.

There is at least a front of non-promiscuity being promoted in society. I'm sure they're banging like rabbits, but they do maintain a surface appearance. For example, they would have pretty girls on billboards, but I didn't see one billboard for a strip club or escort service. On top of that, I didn't even see really racy billboards (past a pretty girl in a short dress or a bathing suit).
 
PICK3 said:
long as they know when it's time to fix a ngr a sammich and bring him some rice wine



just sayin'
Click to expand...

They would, but their sammich would be like a soft wrap with tiny strips of meat that was at least 50% gristle and cartilage strips.
 
mrplunkey said:
I spent time with our guide. She gave us great insight into China. Here's what funny: She's probably in her low 30's
Click to expand...

Scam artists targeting tourists are also common in popular tourist sites. A common scam involves younger Chinese “English students,” often women, who offer to show you around and then invite you to join them for tea at a nearby restaurant. When the bill comes, they leave, and the restaurant owners, usually very large men, force you to pay an exorbitant bill before you are allowed to leave the premises.

China
 
PICK3 said:
bump for more pics of China

this time to include the peeps
Click to expand...

I'll have some more soon. I have to wait for the "official" pics. Right now all I've posted are some camera phone pics and one that was emailed to me in advance.
 
PICK3 said:
Are you trying to paint the pictures from memory :confused:
Click to expand...

I believe the guy who took them has to send me a flashdrive.

I sure hope you're not gonna do something unseemly with my pictures, like use them for your sechsual misadventures.

Just sayin'
 
mrplunkey said:
Whoah! I forgot to point that out.

There were a ton of KFC's there. We started to go by one just to see what they served. They weren't the stand-alone stores either. These were integrated into the first floors of fairly large office buildings.

You don't see McDonald's there though. But the Beijing airport has a Kenny Roger's chicken joint in it. That was just frigging weird.
Click to expand...

I had a marathon negotiation meeting in China one time and KFC was what they served for dinner - about 9 pm. It was outstanding.
 
^^^ this explains why pick3 calls going home with an Asian guy "taking the night off"...
 
plunks, I feel like you should have expected this, that eventually some nagging and demands will start happening after the honeymoon phase.
IDK, maybe you should've contemplated your options more before you consummated the relationship with pick by stepping into Cutters. But i see you were too consumed with new love to even consider an annulment. Anywho, i wish you two the best!
 
*ebony* said:
plunks, I feel like you should have expected this, that eventually some nagging and demands will start happening after the honeymoon phase.
IDK, maybe you should've contemplated your options more before you consummated the relationship with pick by stepping into Cutters. But i see you were too consumed with new love to even consider an annulment. Anywho, i wish you two the best!
Click to expand...

Lies!!!

I'm str9.6 whereas pick3 has tossed more salads than Paula Deen.

Just sayin'
 
I've got them! I'll start uploading them shortly. I just got home (7:13 PM) and left the house around 6:30am this morning. I'm on pace to work one of those mean and selfish 55 hour work weeks.
 
Here's a picture of an mid/upper-range Chinese plant looks like:

11rqgzs.jpg


Here's a more middle-of-the-road one:

r1mpf5.jpg
 
Here's the lobby of the restaurant where you pick-out your lunch entrees (note the live fish in the background).

2qcnv61.jpg
 
superdave said:
Lots of 5-axis processing going on in those plants rob
Click to expand...

They had over 50 true 5-axis mills. A small one runs about $125,000 + tooling and software. The ones they had run more like $250,000 + tooling and software.
 
Here's a high-end plant. They had 168 pieces of equipment, mostly swiss-style lathes and 5-axis milling machines.

2yy88b5.jpg
 
This is their version of Vegas (lots of neon). Sorry it's so dark.

30i9fm8.jpg
 
2hd8rw7.jpg


What's with the look of absolute horror on the faces of those two guys?
 
Mr. dB said:
2hd8rw7.jpg


What's with the look of absolute horror on the faces of those two guys?
Click to expand...

I'm not sure. Maybe the camera surprised them.

They make a nice, beer-like rice wine (no anise/licorice taste). But as we were leaving, they had us sample the undiluted stuff, that was more like 40% pure alcohol. They were soooooo proud of their concoction (it wasn't bad, either).
 
mrplunkey said:
I'm not sure. Maybe the camera surprised them.

They make a nice, beer-like rice wine (no anise/licorice taste). But as we were leaving, they had us sample the undiluted stuff, that was more like 40% pure alcohol. They were soooooo proud of their concoction (it wasn't bad, either).
Click to expand...

In contrast to the abject horror on the faces of the two guys on the right, the guy on the left looks like he has found peace and achieved oneness with the universe.
 
At the organic farm, they also had guys doing rice paintings. Some of them were really cool.

Then I caught one of them doing this picture, and they lost all credibility.

t9a5wk.jpg
 
Here are some of the dorms the employees live in.

They work six days per week, eight hours per day (not counting breaks and lunch). Some of them live up to 25 hours away by train from home and most only return home once per year for the Chinese New Year.

97p98j.jpg


http://i55.tinypic.com/97p98j.jpg
 
Here's a hand-polishing room. It's very unskilled labor, but it would make a perfect starter job for someone in the US. It's a shame that we've destroyed jobs like these. For someone simple who wanted a simple job or someone just entering the job market, this would be a great way to get a toe hold.

k4ctfs.jpg


http://i54.tinypic.com/k4ctfs.jpg
 
This is a model of one of their existing factory campuses.

The buildings to the sides are plants. They are huge. One of them makes Medtronic spinal instruments exclusively. The building in the middle/middle is for raw materials and the building in the middle column in the back are the dormitories where the workers live.

28ry2c.jpg


http://i51.tinypic.com/28ry2c.jpg
 
mrplunkey said:
Here's a hand-polishing room. It's very unskilled labor, but it would make a perfect starter job for someone in the US.

http://i54.tinypic.com/k4ctfs.jpg
Click to expand...

Young Americans don't have the work ethic or the discipline to toil like that, nor wood they make the sacrifices those factory workers do. Working to fulfill a sense of responsibility is knot ingrained in our modern heritage, a sense of entitlement is.

It's sad that we've lost any jobs because even mundane factory jobs beats chronic unemployment.

Butt, 6 days a week finishes parts at a sander or grinder ain't where's it at ... take it from me, I'm an experienced polisher

"Low skilled polisher" knot equal to "killer internship"




just sayin'
 
PICK3 said:
Young Americans don't have the work ethic or the discipline to toil like that, nor wood they make the sacrifices those factory workers do. Working to fulfill a sense of responsibility is knot ingrained in our modern heritage, a sense of entitlement is.

It's sad that we've lost any jobs because even mundane factory jobs beats chronic unemployment.

Butt, 6 days a week finishes parts at a sander or grinder ain't where's it at ... take it from me, I'm an experienced polisher

"Low skilled polisher" knot equal to "killer internship"




just sayin'
Click to expand...

I completely agree.

And even if I didn't, I'd still be forced to defer to you when it comes to polishing things.
 
Godzilla talking and gesturing with his hands to us!!!!!!!!!1111111111111
 
superdave said:
Godzilla talking and gesturing with his hands to us!!!!!!!!!1111111111111
Click to expand...

That reminded me. Every time I went to hit the head, if they saw the real "Mr. Plunkey" they'd start screaming "GODZILLA!!!!!" and run out of the bathroom.

Just sayin'
 
mrplunkey said:
That reminded me. Every time I went to hit the head, if they saw the real "Mr. Plunkey" they'd start screaming "GODZILLA!!!!!" and run out of the bathroom.

Just sayin'
Click to expand...

You should have pissed in the Fukishima reactor since all of their rods are failing.
 
mrplunkey said:
That reminded me. Every time I went to hit the head, if they saw the real "Mr. Plunkey" they'd start screaming "GODZILLA!!!!!" and run out of the bathroom.

Just sayin'
Click to expand...

You hold that tiny piece of gristle in high regards.


just sayin'
 
  • Mainland China has 13 nuclear power reactors in operation, more than 25 under construction, and more about to start construction soon.
  • Additional reactors are planned, including some of the world's most advanced, to give more than a ten-fold increase in nuclear capacity to at least 80 GWe by 2020, 200 GWe by 2030, and 400 GWe by 2050.
  • China is rapidly becoming self-sufficient in reactor design and construction, as well as other aspects of the fuel cycle.

China Nuclear Power | Chinese Nuclear Energy
 
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