Pin Presses

[iggy]

Could someone please clarify what exactly Pin Presses are? and doe's anyone know of any links to videos or instructions on how to properly do pin presses? I've heard about them, but have never tried them and i want to make sure i know what i'm doing when i try them.

thanks

 

[big4life]

You might want to try board presses. They are much more effective at working through your sticking points. When you use pins you almost always unload your muscles when the bar touches the pins. The board press will require someone to hold the board, but it will help your bench much more than pins.



http://www.criticalbench.com/board-press.htm

 

[BiggT]

As I understand them, they are presses done in a power rack from the pins (you would generally set them at a sticking point). You don't want to take a handoff or take the bar, just press it from the pins/safeties. Typically, people do lockouts this way, but you can really start them anywhere, whereever the sticking point is.

 

[BiggT]

The difference between board presses are that board presses more closely mimick the bench because you take the bar from the uprights (or take a handoff)....pin presses you start with the bar in the bottom position.....and you you can deweight the bar or do them touch and go.

Iggy, are you having issues with a sticking point?

 

[iggy]

Well, i for some stupid reason i thought pin presses was when you bench up the weight, go down and hold for 3 seconds, then go back up. i was doing that 5x5 every bench day for the past two weeks. I worked with a technique coach and did close grip board press for about 2-3 months while also working on cleaning and squatting form. And i mean the guy wouldn't let us put on any big weight.... we were only allowed to use up to 185 on cleans and box squats, and no more than 225 for close grip board press. all of my lifts have excellent technique now, but right when i was about to get back on a single factor or double factor 5x5. Two months ago i broke a blood vessel in the back of my head and couldn't lift for 6 weeks. Suprisingly, the first day i starting lifting again (i eat a lot when i was injured to insure i wouldnt lose mass) i benched 185x11 in a row. unfortunately my legs weakened tremendously and my clean went down like crazy. I only cleaned 185x5 in a row, while two of my friends got 185x52 times in row, and 185x50 times in row which made me feel like i lost a lot of strength and time... since i was the same place both of my friends were around 6 weeks ago. I haven't been on a plan because camp has conflicted with my eating and lifting. i'm debating whether to do a single factor 5x5 again, or a double factor 5x5. I plan on starting a journal and diet on monday. The options for workout times are at 6am or at 6pm and i prefer the mournings. I've been benching 195x5 easily, and box squatting 275x5 below parralel. ((hard)(i have to push myself to do it))I do about 3 or 4 sets of ten front squats every leg day and i clean 185 fairly easy. over 6 months ago my lifts were 235x1 bench, 295x1 squat, and 225x1 clean. i haven't maxed out since then and i feel my gains haven't been that significant because of my injuries. Last week i went to the grocery store and spent $220 dollars on food for myself. I bought 4 gallons of skim milk, tuna, london broil, chicken, turkey, kidney beans, eggs eggs eggs, cottage cheese, and plenty of whey protein and glutamine since my soy protein isolate ran out. I feel as though i went from an inspiration as i was a few months ago, to a shadow now that is stuck not making any gains. Right now my team has over five guys benching 315x1, but we are a weak cleaning and squatting team. i mainly power clean all day and i like to teach the young kids to do it too. I'm a senior now and this is my last chance for a run at state champions and all-state for myself. i played jv last year as a junior and goofed around and didn't get along with the coach. I started lifting every day at the end of season until i got stuck with the technique coach (which i made no gains for 3 months but learned perfect technique.) until i got injured. The kickoff for my season is august 25th of this year. I just want to tell you that i'm one of the most dedicated guys to whatever i do unlike most kids. This is my last chance. Any tips or suggestions would be appreciated.

thank you.

- iggy

 

[fortunatesun]

First, the thing you were doing with your bench are oddly enough called pause presses.

What you're saying in your last post, if I'm reading it corrrectly, Iggy, is that you want to reaquire strength in your legs to get your cleans back up to competative level. I think there are a couple ways you can do this:

Plyometrics are exercises where you move submaximal weights explosively to improve your speed and power. An example of interest to you would be the Jump Squat and it's video.
Other ideas, such as box jumps, can be found here These should help get back those reflex abilities lost during your layoff.

Since your coach doesn't like heavy lifting exercises (he may have a point- your competition isn't based on raw power moving the weight but on athletic skills coupled with power. Maxing out your weights can make you too tired to perform the athletic portion of the lift correctly unless you've built up a sufficient amount of work capacity- spent a lot of useful time in the gym) there's something else you can do from a strength standpoint- bodyweight exercises. Something that could work for you would be Pistols .

These ideas may help speed your leg recovery, but you need to also work hard on improving your core strength, which has also suffered during inactivity. Your core supports your entire body and is the center for all of your activity. You must also stick with your program of building repetitions in the clean. This is your primary athletic activity. Don't become discouraged and junk this in favor of a quick fix program. The gains will come quicker the second time around and you need to keep steadily increasing your abilities here to make the entire program work.

I'm sure BiggT, who is more authoritative than myself, also has an answer. In terms re-building your leg strength I think the above will be helpful.

 

[H_T_]

^^^^ i ain't reading that massive post. i never liked partials in the rack. i felt like my `bows were gonna rupture and i hated the bar banging down and rattling the plates for 20 seconds. boards are way better. jmo.

 

[Protobuilder]

I worked with a technique coach and did close grip board press for about 2-3 months while also working on cleaning and squatting form. And i mean the guy wouldn't let us put on any big weight.... we were only allowed to use up to 185 on cleans and box squats, and no more than 225 for close grip board press. all of my lifts have excellent technique now,

First off, that's awesome that you're cleaning and squatting. Learning great technique is important and I'm sure you're bummed that you're weights have dropped right now (due to light technique work & a 6 week layoff) but I think you'll bounce back pretty quicky. You're young and were strong before so it'll come right back once you start hitting heavier weights, building up a little each week. And, you'll have sharp technique, which will help you in the long run, no question. You also have to take into account that after a 6 week layoff, your conditioning/work capacity has taken a hit. 185x23 on the clean is an endurance exhibition and I'm not surprised that you can't do it right now. But it won't be long before you can. You're ahead of the game already, IMO. I'd suggest you think of the longer-term picture. Yes, right now, you're not at your all-time best, but you can get back there relatively quickly and w/ your technique mastered, you'll exceed your old records easily, IMO. Also, I know you want it to happen RIGHT NOW but face it, it's going to take some time. And what's done is done. You can't rewind and do things differently. So from this point on, let's think of a positive plan of attack and focus on what you CAN do, rather than what you wish you'd of done.

^^^^ i ain't reading that massive post.

Iron-E.

 

[BiggT]

Iggy---

This won't be hard at all.....as far as SF or DF programming, don't sweat it.....just use a 'single factor' approach until your gains slow down, and if you're coming back to heavy training, you can milk these gains for a while.

Here is my take on partials, pin presses, board presses, etc etc.....They sound like a blast, the guys who train "WSB" do them, it's all over the net, 'high-level' strength coaches use them, but if you think about it, unless you're competing in a PL contest in a bench shirt, why do you need to take more weight than you bench down to a sticking point and back up?? You don't, you're not training for the biggest bench you can do, you're training to prepare your body for a football season. That doesn't mean don't life heavy, it means don't forget WHY you're lifting.

The bench press is a good tool, and you do need static strength, but college S and C coaches drool over kids who like to squat and clean. Their take is that explosion is more important because anybody who is an athlete can get in the weight room and improve their bench through training. The general public and NFL owners love the bench press because it is all they know, but college s and c coaches and scouts are more concerned with squats and cleans and explosion, they'll often ask if a kid can dunk a basketball before they ask what can you bench. NOT that you shouldn't be a strong bencher, just giving you backup that it isn't the be all and end all of football prowess. The consensus is that a kid who can power clean 300, dunk a basketball, and squat 1.5 times bodyweight can always gain weight and they can always develop static strength...if that kid also benches 400, all the better it will only help him.....BUT, if a kid benches 400, can't squat bodyweight, cleans 200, and has a vertical jump of 19 inches, there isn't much athletic potential there. You know what I'm saying??

I strongly disagree with the 'technique coaching'....once you know how to lift and you're not doing something stupid and dangerous, it is time to get good at the lifts. Technique is a MUST, but so is adding weight to the bar, weight cannot come at the expense of technique obviously, but weight cannot be held back to acheive "John Basedow form" as that will also result in John Basedow (ya know, the Fitness Made Simple guy) size and strength. Light/technique sessions and greasing the groove and all are needed, but you need to add weight to the bar, or you'll be a weak puss with textbook technique.

What lifts are you tested on? I suggest setting up a single factor plan where you train them progressively at least twice a week. I'd be more than happy to make some suggestions for you if you'd like, just let me know. You'll be back where you need to be in no time, and it'll be fun because your gains will come fast right now.

 

[iggy]

The only thing i'm afraid will be hard is eating seven meals a day with a gallon of skim milk. The technique coach had us doing box jumps back when we were working out at competitive edge. (a huge gym compared to our weight room that's owned by a famous weight lifter) I'm a short guy at 5'7 and my vertical is only 20" at 206lbs. Suprisingly i thought box jumps were very fun and even jumped on to some very high boxes. Unfortunately we did not renew our memberships to that gym, (because of the location and time to get there) so now i have no boxes to jump on and off and therefore, can't do box jumps.
I'm working to improve my Power Clean, Box Squat, Deadlift, and Bench Press lifts.
my deadlift is weak at around 315x1 but i can get 275x3 and had it up, but didn't lock out 365x1. My coach complained to me that if i can deadlift 315x1 i should be able to power clean 225x1. I'm not sure how i should start my single factor workout now. but i will give it a shot. Also, how much do you think i should work on my calves, abs, tris, delts, and bi's during me single factor 8 week program.
thanks

- iggy

 

[BiggT]

Just do them as assistance work....the most important things you mentioned is abs. Try doing steep decline situps 2 or 3 times a week. triceps are important in that they don't hold back your pressing, close-grip bench presses as backoff sets to the benching or dips are fine.....don't sweat biceps, 3 or 4 sets of 8 on a barbell, dumbell, hammer, or reverse curls once per week should be all they need.

 

[iggy]

Here's my first stab at mondays workout. Do you think i should add anything or do any other exercises too?

Iggy’s 5x5 Journal
Monday Day 1 – 06/19/06
Bench Squat Cleans Rows
-135x5 -135x5 -115x5 -95x5
-155x5 -165x5 -135x5 -115x5
-170x5 -195x5 -155x5 -115x5
-185x5 -225x5 -175x5 -115x5
-205x5 -255x5 -195x5 -115x5

Crunches Cardio End
30x3 10 20’sx2

 

[BiggT]

Here's my first stab at mondays workout. Do you think i should add anything or do any other exercises too?

Iggy’s 5x5 Journal
Monday Day 1 – 06/19/06
Bench Squat Cleans Rows
-135x5 -135x5 -115x5 -95x5
-155x5 -165x5 -135x5 -115x5
-170x5 -195x5 -155x5 -115x5
-185x5 -225x5 -175x5 -115x5
-205x5 -255x5 -195x5 -115x5

Crunches Cardio End
30x3 10 20’sx2

Looks fine to me, although I would personally clean first as they require the most skill and you really should be fresh for them.

 

[BiggT]

For the extra work....after you bench on Fri, do 3 sets of 8 close-grip or do 3 sets of dips. Then do 3 sets of barbell curls OR hammer curls (but not both). Do the 2 sets of situps every training day. Delts get plenty of work from pressing, and stop thinking in terms of 'delts' 'chest', 'triceps' etc , think 'upper body pressing' instead.

 

[iggy]

Alright. So i should swap power clean and bench press in the order they are in now? I'm working out at 6am monday. Should i eat a huge breakfast at 5am, or eat something little? or eat at 4am? Should i incorporate some close grip bench on monday after i bench?

 

[BiggT]

I'd keep the close-grip on Fri, thats fine and all you really need. If it were me, I'd clean, then squat, then bench, then row.

What works for me with early morning training is to eat something easily digestable, some oatmeal and a protein shake, or a shake and some toast with peanut butter, and then a bigger meal post workout.

 

[iggy]

sounds good. i'll post my meals for monday sometime soon. thanks for all your help everyone

 

[iggy]

one more question biggt. what is the best way to warmup for bench, squat, rows, and cleans while on the single factor 5x5?

 

[iggy]

should i wait 2 minutes between each set? or longer?

 

[BiggT]

I would probably do the decline situps first, and then just do your typical warm-up sets when you begin each life.....with cleans, I do various crap/drills/front squats with the bar and 135 just to get ready.