P Seven

[macrophage69alpha]

Along the lines of ordering more, I'm still a little confused over the difference between Orange and Peppermint?? How much lower dosed is Orange? How is it 'time-released' compared to Peppermint? The AF website doesn't mention any progesterone in the Orange formulation, but you mentioned it has some...how much??

And I second Millie's sentiments about the service-it took less than a week for it to get to me and I'm half way around the world!

orange is a much more even and time released formula. you can probably use once, perhaps twice a day dosing.

dosing is the same, the orange actually a bit stronger. though the dosage of actives is the same.

the peppermint is more of an "immeadiate relief" as it has a extremely short lag.

the women orange (which is still beta.. even though doubtful it will change much) will be available early next week

btw- wondering about your personal opinion on the potential addition of a mild aromatase inhibitor?

 

[Daisy_Girl]

btw- wondering about your personal opinion on the potential addition of a mild aromatase inhibitor?

Does that mean that it will be less likely to retain water? (please forgive my ignorance) If so, I likethe idea (even though I'm not MS ).

Is anyone noticing any water retention? I'm feeling kinda retained - although it IS the week before my period. Who knows what it is due to.

 

[MS]

Yeah, I'm getting the fluid retention, but just as likely to be from progesterone as from E aromatization. I also have a sinking suspiscion that the fluid retention may just be the price I have to pay to have more mobile joints. Any thoughts Macro/W6 etc...?

Personally I don't think addition of a peripheral aromatase inhibitor will make much difference to us females, but might be useful for the men. I suspect our female ovarian output of E will so overwhelmingly swamp any minor contribution from circulating aromatase that we wouldn't notice it. It might make a minor difference in terms of peripheral production of Test in women though?? I wouldn't want to pay extra for it in a women's version, but others might think it useful. I thought the 7-oxo DHEA would cover that base (in theory).

 

[macrophage69alpha]

I thought the 7-oxo DHEA would cover that base (in theory).

synthesis not peripheral aromatase.. its a substrate limitation (in theory)

it would not affect the price and the dose would be low.. though that would probably necessitate a menapausal formula (though that has been anticipated)

 

[MS]

"synthesis not peripheral aromatase.. its a substrate limitation (in theory)"


???huh??

I'm unclear if you mean the aromatase inhibitor you're THINKING about adding will decrease aromatase substrate (which I could only envision if it was specific for one of the enzymes on the path from pregnenolone to androstenedione or testosterone), or decrease aromatase transcription/translation, or increase aromatase clearance (ie inhibitors or upregulators of hepatic enzymes such as one of the CYP450s)??? In any event, I suspect it won't have measurable effect on ovarian aromatase activity or substrate, only peripheral?? In which case it also wouldn't have a very large impact on non-menopausal women's circulating E. Or maybe I entirely misunderstood the whole answer! I guess, by definition, a 'mild' inhibitor will likely be of little benefit to women, but maybe men.

 

[macrophage69alpha]

7-oxo effect is rate limiting on E production as it competes for enzymes that produce the E substrate (which is slightly offset by additional preg.. which is why the decrease in E is minimal under the current protocol)

the above is a generalization as actual analysis of competition and enzyme levels as well as step(s) at which there may be competition (7-oxo reduction pathways).. is unavailable..

though still looking at and for some theoretical models.

 

[takniteasy]

Well, since I cannot figure out what is causing the excessive oily skin, breakouts and now oily hair, I am d/c the P7. I have been using P7 (peppermint) for about 4 weeks, have decreased the dosage and still have the excessive oily skin. Have also noticed some H2O retention. Otherwise no other effects other than what I previously posted. I may start again in a week just to see what happens.

 

[macrophage69alpha]

takiniteasy,
peppermint -regular or womens?

benefits noticed during that time as well?


curious as with the womens formula several subjects have indicated noticeable fat loss

 

[takniteasy]

Macro, I used the original peppermint formula. Only after I had ordered and received the peppermint formula did the Women's formula become available. One benefit that I noticed immediately after d/c is I did not sleep as well and did get up once during the night to go potty. I geuss I took for granted that benefit but this oily skin and H2O retention has become annoying to the point that I had to stop the P7. Now the only things I take are Glucorell, ECA and apply Yohimburn 2xday. I dont think I used P7 long enough to notice any metabolism benefits, however it did seem to curb the sweet cravings. Will keep you updated.

 

[Daisy_Girl]

My skin started to get REAL oily, but I just started using a stronger face wash (Neutrogena acne face wash) and problems no more!

I sleep so heavy and RARELY get up to potty.