My reason against abortion

[chesty]

How easy it would be for the parents to say doc, just kill it, it has a disease and won't live anyway so just kill it for us and will try again.

But no, the parents realized that this is a human life and a human life that is so defenseless is worth saving. Just think of the possibilities a single life can bring. It staggers the mind.

But abortionists would have you believe that what you are looking at is not a life. Oh they will rationlize that this is the second trimester and it is not a fetus any longer, etc. But you know what? That was always a human in that womb!

I dare a single person to read that story and look at that picture and tell me that abortion is the answer at any stage of pregnancey.

I hope not one person can look at this picture and not cry. If you can honestly say that it does not move you then you are not human.

http://www.michaelclancy.com/

 

[theoak01]

that is horrible,people disgust me

I am also against abortion in almost all circumstances but if a women is raped and becomes pregnant I believe it is not right for her to have to give birth to the child.

Chesty what are your thoughts on the condition I stated?

 

[SSAlexSS]

How easy it would be for the parents to say doc, just kill it, it has a disease and won't live anyway so just kill it for us and will try again.

But no, the parents realized that this is a human life and a human life that is so defenseless is worth saving. Just think of the possibilities a single life can bring. It staggers the mind.

But abortionists would have you believe that what you are looking at is not a life. Oh they will rationlize that this is the second trimester and it is not a fetus any longer, etc. But you know what? That was always a human in that womb!

I dare a single person to read that story and look at that picture and tell me that abortion is the answer at any stage of pregnancey.

I hope not one person can look at this picture and not cry. If you can honestly say that it does not move you then you are not human.

http://www.michaelclancy.com/

I hope you are ANTI-WAR then....

 

[chesty]

I would suggest that she look into adoption first. And that some kind of legal test be used such as the conviction of the rapist. Unfortunately that cannot always be the case since that could take years.

I do sympathize with a rape victim and maybe she could take a drug like ru84 or what ever it is immediately following the rape to ensure that conception has little to no chance to take place.

I do not have a complete or good answer for that one though.

 

[chesty]

Nope! and being anti war has nothing to do with anti abortion. People who try to take away my freedoms, kill my friends, invade my country, threaten/kill my allies will be dealt with swiftly and severely.

In fact, fighting for the country as a Marine is precisely why I am against abortion. Everyone has the right to life in this country. And those that would deprive us of that will they themselves be deprived of it.

 

[ariolanine]

Well I guess I'm human cuz I started to tear up a little looking at that.

 

[chesty]

Good for you.

 

[SSAlexSS]

Nope! and being anti war has nothing to do with anti abortion. People who try to take away my freedoms, kill my friends, invade my country, threaten/kill my allies will be dealt with swiftly and severely.

In fact, fighting for the country as a Marine is precisely why I am against abortion. Everyone has the right to life in this country. And those that would deprive us of that will they themselves be deprived of it.

You are against abortion because it "kills".

Yet you have nothing against killing people overseas? (Not all of them guilty)


what gives?????????????????????????

 

[chesty]

No, I am not against abortion because it kills! I am agianst abortion because it is an unjustified taking of a life that has no means to defend itself against the the person taking it. Morallly it is wrong as well.

War while terrible is sometimes necessary to protect our freedooms so that people like you can rationalize the killing of a defenseless child.

 

[Norman Bates]

How easy it would be for the parents to say doc, just kill it, it has a disease and won't live anyway so just kill it for us and will try again.

Don´t you think the doctor will check the embryo for such diseases?
Do you think an abortion is an easy choice for a woman?

 

[the nature boy]

this thread reminds me of what my old high school football coach used to say, "Opinions are like assholes, everybody has one."

 

[SSAlexSS]

No, I am not against abortion because it kills! I am agianst abortion because it is an unjustified taking of a life that has no means to defend itself against the the person taking it. Morallly it is wrong as well.

War while terrible is sometimes necessary to protect our freedooms so that people like you can rationalize the killing of a defenseless child.

How about those civilians that have no weapons and no ways of defending against daisy cutters, m80 etc....

 

[velvett]

I've seen that photo and while I was moved the first few times but as with much of what we see and feel you become desensitized.

While they are some extraordinary parents out there, however, are also some not so wonderful. There are men and woman that plan to be parents and there are those that did not plan to be and become parents. Then there are those that forever had planned and never came to be to then give hope to the spirit someone else had left behind.

One can't really say what sort of man or woman would "parent make" after the needy cries of their newborn, after the complete change in their lives, for better or worse, planned or unplanned.

But what for the child who had never asked to be born, to have never asked to be beaten, broken and abused - what for that child, wanted or not wanted and what for that child that cried and asked why he had to be born?

Abortion should be less of the focus, instead the men and women that chose to have sex should consider their actions more thoughtfully and take into consideration that every action has a consequence. That it take not one but two to create a life but it only takes one to destroy it and that may not even be at the hand of the abortionist but by the hand of the parent that has had enough.

So much focus on problem solving and opinion making and too little focus on preventative measure and well thought out family planning.

And too little thought taken to the heart and soul of another.

Too little compassion, patience and understanding.

 

[chesty]

Correct, focus on the problem not the cure. That is what Gattica the movie was about. However, the cure became the problem.

My point is that we find it all to easy to sanitize a problem by reducing it to a basic common denominator that can be said to so basic as that it is not alive, just a collection of amino acids and DNA.

 

[velvett]

My point is that we find it all to easy to sanitize a problem by reducing it to a basic common denominator that can be said to so basic as that it is not alive, just a collection of amino acids and DNA.

I agree with the thought but I don't agree that that is how all people that wold consider an abortion feel about what they are doing.

Who can really project what is going on within the mind of another without being in their shoes and without passing our own judgement without experience?

I think perhaps if the time frame for abortion were to be made smaller - let's say - 1st trimester only - where at this time the fetus is not able to live outisde the mother's body - some people may be more accepting of the idea.

I guess it would be called a compromise between two opposing views of when life begins.

 

[Norman Bates]

Velvett, some people say that those that have unprotected sex should take the responsibility that can arise of it, so they should give birth to the baby and then let someone adopt it.
What do you think of that?

 

[Delinquent]

Let me tell you a story about my experience. A different one than the one on the other thread. I used a condom the first time but the little shit got through. Now if we would have gone through with the pregnancy our lives would have been ruined. 2 16 year olds shouldn't have to have that kind of responsibility. Of course you'll say then put it up for adoption. Do you know how many kids are in foster care or orphanages (sp?) in Florida?? Even worse how many kids in the system aren't even accounted for? The number was in the thousands. Instead of ending something in the 1 trimester I might add, we go through the motions. Spend all kinds of money neither of our families could afford. Then have us go through the anguish of having to give our baby away to possibly never receive the kind of love a child deserves. Now lets fast foward a few years. We broke up but she ended up getting prego a year later and had the baby. She's now caring for a kid without the father b/c he ran off. Teaching drama somehow b/c she never even went to school for a degree so I don't know how she's teaching. She had the potential to go far in the acting biz. She was excepted to UCLA and NYU for drama but couldn't go b/c of the responsibilities she had. So now she's working a 20k job trying to feed a kid without a father. Now me on the other hand, I am engaged with a house with 3 dogs and doing ok for a 23 year old. I may have some financial probs but that's due to our irresponsibility. If my ex and I would have had the kid, I would have never met the girl I'm with now, either stuck in a relationship with my ex b/c of the kid or having to pay child support. I would probably still be living with my parents b/c of the child support so essentially having a kid is not a fucking option at 16.

 

[chesty]

Yes, it would be a compromise, and it could be a start. I suspect that the human race will evolve beyond things like this to the point where they are not considered an answer to a problem.

 

[biteme]

This will be forever debated. I think of my own child and how her life could have turned out differently. For every unloved, unwanted child in the world, my heart breaks.

 

[thebabydoc]

Do you know what one of the most common things I hear before performing a procedure is?

"I don't believe in abortion, but........blah blah blah"
That's how drilled into your heads it is, you don't even realize your right to choose exists and would even fight to take it away from someone else until one day you need to exercise it.

 

[chesty]

Funny thing is I never believed in it and never was a party to it. I also would never try to appease my conscience with the statement I don't believe in this but do it any way. I can't believe how plastic some people can be.

 

[Imnotdutch]

Regarding the first paragraph........you really think that anybody finds that decision easy?? I have known several people who have at least considered abortion for one reason or another.......and it wasn't an easy decision.

Paragraph 3: Whether it is alive or not is not the issue. Whether it is concious or not is another........is it a human in its own right or a piece of meat? Also, babies have a reflex action that makes them grip things. This does not make them concious........it just means that they have a simple nervous system (which does not imply that the baby / fetus is thinking).

Am I for or against abortion?? It depends upon the circumstances. Big questions rarely have simple answers........

How easy it would be for the parents to say doc, just kill it, it has a disease and won't live anyway so just kill it for us and will try again.

But no, the parents realized that this is a human life and a human life that is so defenseless is worth saving. Just think of the possibilities a single life can bring. It staggers the mind.

But abortionists would have you believe that what you are looking at is not a life. Oh they will rationlize that this is the second trimester and it is not a fetus any longer, etc. But you know what? That was always a human in that womb!

I dare a single person to read that story and look at that picture and tell me that abortion is the answer at any stage of pregnancey.

I hope not one person can look at this picture and not cry. If you can honestly say that it does not move you then you are not human.

http://www.michaelclancy.com/

 

[mdd]

Nope! and being anti war has nothing to do with anti abortion. People who try to take away my freedoms, kill my friends, invade my country, threaten/kill my allies will be dealt with swiftly and severely.

In fact, fighting for the country as a Marine is precisely why I am against abortion. Everyone has the right to life in this country. And those that would deprive us of that will they themselves be deprived of it.

cha-ching!

 

[musclebrains]

The use of horrific images to dissuade people from their position is classic.

For example this image of children fleeing the napalming of their village turned American opinion against the Vietnam conflict:

The US government would not allow camera crews in Iraq during Gulf War I for the same reason. Instead we were given bloodless accounts of the conflict by Powell and friends.

I am fairly confident that an image of children mutilated and killed by American bombs in Iraq would produce a more horrified response than the image of a fetal hand.

Shall I post some?

 

[mdd]

Shall I post some?

go for it

 

[slobberknocker]

Making abortion illegal won't end abortion. It will just make it harder for women to get the proper medical attention they'd need.


Just like making steroids illegal didn't stop us from using steroids. It just made it harder for us to get legit, safe gear.

 

[-SD-]

Let me tell you a story about my experience. A different one than the one on the other thread. I used a condom the first time but the little shit got through. Now if we would have gone through with the pregnancy our lives would have been ruined. 2 16 year olds shouldn't have to have that kind of responsibility. Of course you'll say then put it up for adoption. Do you know how many kids are in foster care or orphanages (sp?) in Florida?? Even worse how many kids in the system aren't even accounted for? The number was in the thousands. Instead of ending something in the 1 trimester I might add, we go through the motions. Spend all kinds of money neither of our families could afford. Then have us go through the anguish of having to give our baby away to possibly never receive the kind of love a child deserves. Now lets fast foward a few years. We broke up but she ended up getting prego a year later and had the baby. She's now caring for a kid without the father b/c he ran off. Teaching drama somehow b/c she never even went to school for a degree so I don't know how she's teaching. She had the potential to go far in the acting biz. She was excepted to UCLA and NYU for drama but couldn't go b/c of the responsibilities she had. So now she's working a 20k job trying to feed a kid without a father. Now me on the other hand, I am engaged with a house with 3 dogs and doing ok for a 23 year old. I may have some financial probs but that's due to our irresponsibility. If my ex and I would have had the kid, I would have never met the girl I'm with now, either stuck in a relationship with my ex b/c of the kid or having to pay child support. I would probably still be living with my parents b/c of the child support so essentially having a kid is not a fucking option at 16.

Heres a few pieces of advice:
1. Condoms arent 100% and you know it.
2. 16 year olds shouldnt be fucking in the first place. You just proved that.
3. Ending a pregnancy because of possible foster care or orphanages is not justified. I know many good foster parents and orphages can be temporary for a child that then is adopted out.
4. There is just as much anguish in ending the pregnancy than giving away the child, but as a coupole of 16 year olds you dont have the fortitude to go through with the right actions Thats why I stated #2 above.
5. College is not the be all end all of the world, as you are finding out. Getting a degree is not worth a lot if you make the wrong choices in life otherwise. (ex. Enron execs.) If your ex had a degree in the situation she is in now would it make that much of a difference? After all, she apparently didnt learn from her first mistake she had with you.
6. Stop being so selfish. Your whole post is saying "me me me".

 

[Lift78]

Im pro choice, and sorry that pic did nothing for me. Its a grasping reflex adapted through evolution. its present at birth so the baby can hang onto the mother when its picked up. It goes away after the first year of life. Theres many such reflexes, if you (god forbid) drop a baby it will flayal its arms and legs to the side and arch is back to spread out the impact of landing. If someone doesnt want a baby I think the responsible thing to do is have an abortion. Why bring a baby into the world you dont want, the likely hood of abuse raises dramatically. Whats worse? Abuse of a living human being over years or termination of a pregnancy? Adoption is also an option but if the baby is sickly not many people are likely to adopt it and then its stuck with no one, in an orphanage in typically poor conditions.

 

[Delinquent]

Heres a few pieces of advice:
1. Condoms arent 100% and you know it.
2. 16 year olds shouldnt be fucking in the first place. You just proved that.
3. Ending a pregnancy because of possible foster care or orphanages is not justified. I know many good foster parents and orphages can be temporary for a child that then is adopted out.
4. There is just as much anguish in ending the pregnancy than giving away the child, but as a coupole of 16 year olds you dont have the fortitude to go through with the right actions Thats why I stated #2 above.
5. College is not the be all end all of the world, as you are finding out. Getting a degree is not worth a lot if you make the wrong choices in life otherwise. (ex. Enron execs.) If your ex had a degree in the situation she is in now would it make that much of a difference? After all, she apparently didnt learn from her first mistake she had with you.
6. Stop being so selfish. Your whole post is saying "me me me".

Um yea it was supposed to be about me me me. I guess we can agree to disagree then b/c the way I look at it, I am the most important thing in my life. If something is gonna fuck up my plans, I'll do anything for it not to happen. In this case, the money I earn would be going to support a fucking runt I didn't even want instead of on me. I don't give a shit about flushing some stupid fucking runt down the tube. It's better than the alternative for me and remember it's all about me me me.

 

[thebabydoc]

Making abortion illegal won't end abortion. It will just make it harder for women to get the proper medical attention they'd need.

Damn straight. I have worked with the "old timers" and believe me, the stories they tell me of women coming in with septic abortions make even my skin crawl. Try reading (not watching) "Ciderhouse Rules," it has a wonderfully accurate and revolting description of what a septic abortion is like and its effects.

 

[-SD-]

Um yea it was supposed to be about me me me. I guess we can agree to disagree then b/c the way I look at it, I am the most important thing in my life. If something is gonna fuck up my plans, I'll do anything for it not to happen. In this case, the money I earn would be going to support a fucking runt I didn't even want instead of on me. I don't give a shit about flushing some stupid fucking runt down the tube. It's better than the alternative for me and remember it's all about me me me.

Since you are engaged to be married, are you still going to act so selfishly with your own family? I suppose that if you and your future wife have a disagreement then you will just toss her aside since she is fucking up your precious plans. I would suggest either you or your future wife get fixed because kids definetely require selfless behavior from the parents, which you are obviously lacking.

 

[Delinquent]

Hence the reason I don't have any and probably will not until I have some sort of satisfaction in my life. I've never been out of the southeast or even on a plane. I've never experienced shit my whole life. So yea I am pretty selfish right now. I'm sure my opinion will change once I give in and have one mainly for my fiance'. If it was up to me, I would be content with our three dogs but she wants a couple so I can't deny her what she's always dreamed of. BUT this will only happen once I have some sort of satisfaction or gratification out of my life

 

[-SD-]

Hence the reason I don't have any and probably will not until I have some sort of satisfaction in my life. I've never been out of the southeast or even on a plane. I've never experienced shit my whole life. So yea I am pretty selfish right now. I'm sure my opinion will change once I give in and have one mainly for my fiance'. If it was up to me, I would be content with our three dogs but she wants a couple so I can't deny her what she's always dreamed of. BUT this will only happen once I have some sort of satisfaction or gratification out of my life

LOL. You are going to have to "give in" to your fiance' for something as life-changing as having a child? Hope you discussed that little piece of information with her so she knows she is marrying someone with no desire to ever become a parent. The choice to have kids is not something that one spouse finally caves in to or throws up the hands and says "ok honey, youve wore me down, you can have kids". If you dont want kids now then you wont want them while you are married, the old saying still holds true that you cant change someone's mind about it. If you just need to party a while or travel or get on a plane or whatever before you decide to have kids then thats totally understandable, but from the attitude you are posting I dont think you want kids ever and you need to tell your wife that if thats the case.

 

[Delinquent]

LOL. You are going to have to "give in" to your fiance' for something as life-changing as having a child? Hope you discussed that little piece of information with her so she knows she is marrying someone with no desire to ever become a parent. The choice to have kids is not something that one spouse finally caves in to or throws up the hands and says "ok honey, youve wore me down, you can have kids". If you dont want kids now then you wont want them while you are married, the old saying still holds true that you cant change someone's mind about it. If you just need to party a while or travel or get on a plane or whatever before you decide to have kids then thats totally understandable, but from the attitude you are posting I dont think you want kids ever and you need to tell your wife that if thats the case.

Like I said my mind may change. If not, I'd rather have a kid than lose her. Hopefully I'll be one of those types who are apprehensive at first then my views will change once the kid pops out.

 

[-SD-]

Like I said my mind may change. If not, I'd rather have a kid than lose her. Hopefully I'll be one of those types who are apprehensive at first then my views will change once the kid pops out.

Cool, if you are only 23 it never hurts to wait anyhow. Youve never heard anyone say "gee I wish I had kids sooner in life". Im 28 myself and dont see it happening anytime soon and Ive let my girlfriend know that upfront.