massive weekend increase in calories for bulking?

[killroy70]

I've been doing a bulking CKD for a while now. I haven't really gotten serious about increasing my calories until the last 2 weeks. My maintenance calories are between 2500-3000. So, I've ramped it up to about 4500-5000 calories per day. However, to my surprise, barely any weight gain in 2 weeks. I'm taking in around 400 grams of fat, 360 grams protein, and less than 30 grams carbs for the 5 low carb days. Still, I have no explanation for the lack of weight gain over the course of the last 2 weeks. What on earth could be the reason? Workout program has been consistent over the course of the last 2 months. Work and sleeping patterns have been the same. What gives? Now, I have read about some bodybuilders having some success really upping their calories in an extreme way during their weekend carb ups. One bodybuilder I was communicating with on another board who was also using a CKD for bulking said that he ramped up his calories from 4500 on low carb days to nearly 10,000 on both saturday and sunday and has gotten great results. He claims that, in his specific case, that eating in this manner helps to minimize fat gain vs eating higher calories for each day of the week. Any comments??

As an aside, strength gains continue to come while on a CKD - faster than they ever have before. Also, I"m using a workout system (Westside) that I've used before. Interesting...

 

[Mr.X]

I've been doing a bulking CKD for a while now. I haven't really gotten serious about increasing my calories until the last 2 weeks. My maintenance calories are between 2500-3000. So, I've ramped it up to about 4500-5000 calories per day. However, to my surprise, barely any weight gain in 2 weeks. I'm taking in around 400 grams of fat, 360 grams protein, and less than 30 grams carbs for the 5 low carb days. Still, I have no explanation for the lack of weight gain over the course of the last 2 weeks. What on earth could be the reason? Workout program has been consistent over the course of the last 2 months. Work and sleeping patterns have been the same. What gives? Now, I have read about some bodybuilders having some success really upping their calories in an extreme way during their weekend carb ups. One bodybuilder I was communicating with on another board who was also using a CKD for bulking said that he ramped up his calories from 4500 on low carb days to nearly 10,000 on both saturday and sunday and has gotten great results. He claims that, in his specific case, that eating in this manner helps to minimize fat gain vs eating higher calories for each day of the week. Any comments??

As an aside, strength gains continue to come while on a CKD - faster than they ever have before. Also, I"m using a workout system (Westside) that I've used before. Interesting...

So you're about 40% over you maintenance. Why are you going up to such high ratios on the no carb days. You need to decrease the caloric intake to 3000. By doing this you will put your body into a mere catabolic mode (not pertaining to muscle); therefore, your body will be deplete of all essential building blocks. Now, on the weekend, go up to around 6000 cal. (NOT 10000 that's ludicrous) and you'll see some amazing muscle gains, of course expect fat gains.

You can also switch to a 3 day no carb, 1 day carb-up routine. Using insulin to get back into ketosis.

Mr.X

 

[killroy70]

Mr. X...high calorie low carb days...

Ok, the reason I'm eating at such a high level is because I am following the Metabolic Diet by Mauro DiPasquale. My goals are:
-Increased strength
-Increased muscle mass with minimal fat gain

Of course I am expecting to add some fat while bulking. Now, why would I want to decrease my calories to 3000 during the week, considering I'm not gaining much on a 4500-5000 calories on the weekdays? Are you referring to the anabolic hormone boost one gets from going from a low calorie to very high calorie diet, cycling on and off? I just figured that keeping calories higher overall would help to add more mass.

And I definitely agree with you with regards to the ridiculous nature of eating 10,000 calories/day on teh carb up. Today I'm shooting for 6000, which breaks down as:
1,000 grams carbs
250 grams protein
110 grams fat

On day 1 of my carb up, I'm going to get my carbs from wherever I can. I'm not going to worry so much about low glycemic, etc... Pop Tarts here I come! Day 2, I'll drop to 5000 calories and adjust the ratios accordingly, trying to eat nice and clean.

Mr. X, in the metabolic diet, when bulking, one figures their caloric intake by figuring 15% above their determined "ideal weight," and multiplies that by 25. For example, let's say I figure my ideal weight to be 215 pounds (I'm currently at 198). I'd add 15% to that (250 lbs) and multiply by 25, which comes to about 6200 calories per day. I haven't quite gone that route yet, as I'm trying to increase somewhat gradually.

I must say, although I have been reading quite a bit of research that attempts to debunk that "fat is bad for you myth," I'm still a little leary of eating 400-500 grams of fat per day. However, the diet has been working so well for me thus far, that I want to stick to it. As I've noted, ALL of my lifts have been going up tremendously. Even thursday workouts, the 5th day of no carbing, have been tremendous.

It just seems that once I hit 200 lbs, my body refuses to add any more weight!!

What do you think? Any other suggestions??
Thanks again

 

[Kid Dynamite]

How long have you been using Westside? If you're getting stronger but not any bigger (which happend with me when using a CKD to bulk) you may need to switch to a higher rep routine, though I can't recall the rep range of west-side, just that it has a low rep alternating with speed workout platform...I think...You might just need to change it up.

 

[killroy70]

KidDyna - Westside

Yes, westide splits the week into 4 workouts:
max effort upper body
max effort lower body
dynamic (speed) upper body
dynamic (speed) lower body

Now, on max effort days, it is true that you almost always work your ONE max effort movement from 3 reps working up to your 1RM (except when performing Good Morning variations - then it's a 3 RM). On the speed days, again, ONE exercise is used to for the speed portion for each workout, always bench and box squat. For bench, you perform between 6-10 sets of 3 reps with different grips with 30-45 seconds of rest between sets. For box squats, you perform 8-12 sets of 2 reps with 45-60 seconds between sets. Accomodating resistance (chains or bands) shoud be used for both movements to allow for compensatory acceloration.

Ok, that's strength and speed. Most of the assistance work is geared to further your strength in the accessory muscle groups as well as aid in hypertrophy. The rep scheme I use for nearly all my accessory work are within the 5-15 rep range. I sometimes drop down to 3 high intensity reps for a compound tricep movement following speed bench, but other than that, most exercises are kept in the "hypertrophy range."

Believe me, Westside can be used to gain mass as well as strength. Granted, I'm posting here because I have not had much success on slapping on the pounds, but I've witnessed others do so with great success.

Now, I did get an email from Dr. DiPasquale where he stated that sometimes people who go from a high or moderate carb diet to his metabolic diet find that their maintenance calorie level rises when using his diet. He provided me with several examples, one of which was a bodybuilder, who much like me, had a previous maintenance caloric intake of around 3000 calories. Only a short while after switching, he found that his maintenance calorie level had increased to nearly 4000 calories. Because this occurred in a relatively short time, it did not appear to be attributed to increased muscle mass that would have increased his basal metabolic rate.

Shit. I hope that I can just find my groove and add the weight at a nice pace so not to add too much fat. I'm going to keep exerimenting and plan on staying on the metabolic diet for at least 6 months. If I do find my groove, I may stay on much longer. We'll see. Until then, I'll probably continue to post to the CKD guru's on this board!!

 

[Kid Dynamite]

Westside sounds good, no doubt. How long have you been doing it? Maybe adaption took place.
I've used CKD's on and off for about 3 years, in both phases. I really can't think of what's going wrong with you not gaining weight on that many calories. I'll try to think of something to help.