Lumberg - 1-test Ethergels Dosage Question

[Flapjack1976]

Hey everyone. I've been lurking for quite a while now, and have read an incredible amount of information on both prohormones and real gear. For now, as long as it's legal, I will try prohormones.

First off, I don't want to start a huge debate about the value of prohormones and such, I've already made up my mind. If you have a bad thing to say about them, please don't do it here.

With that being said, I bought both a bottle of MN 1-test ethergels, and ErgoPharm 4-AD. I am trying to decide how much I should take.

I've read from a few sources that 100-150 mg of 1-test a day is recommended when using ethergels. They didn't seem to be very conservative sources, either. The problem is I've seen many (especially Lumberg) say that lipsomal is the best way to go. Does this mean I should use more 1-test?

Currently, I'm taking two 25mg capsules twice daily for a total of 100mg. At the same time, I'm taking one 300mg capsule of 4-AD twice daily.

Without purchasing more, that is enough for about 22 days, kind of a short cycle as far as I can tell. I was considering doubling up and ordering another bottle of each.

BTW, I've been working out pretty much ever since I've been in the military. I've gone from 126 when joining to my current weight of 162 @ 5'8". I haven't been able to get passed that hump. This is over the course of 8 years, with the last 4 years really understanding the mechanics behind effectively working out.

Also, I know many will suggest it so I have a bottle of ErgoPharm 6-OXO and a bottle of Tribex for post-cycle recovery.


Thanks!

 

[Flapjack1976]

...forgot to mention I'm 27 years old. Don't know if that makes a difference or not.

 

[Lumberg]

First of all flapjack thanks for your service to our country. I'm proud of you.

Second of all if I were going to do 1-test I would not go the oral route. I don't think I ever said liposomal is the way to go, for me transdermal is the best which means through the skin. Liposomal means encapulated in little bubbles of fat/oil. For oral 1-AD is the best bet.


Third of all 600 mg of 4-AD is waay too much IMO. 300 mg is plenty to give you a little extra kick. Try that first and wait to bump it up before you bloat up like a pufferfish.

Fourth of all I have no idea what the ideal dosage for ORAL 1-test is, but since you did your homework I would stick with 100 mg a day and see how it goes. 22 days is perfect for a first cycle IMO and afterwards you can analyze your results and formulate a dosage from there, assuming you want to continue to use oral 1-test.

Hope this helps.

 

[Flapjack1976]

That would explain it. I was under the impression that lipsomal and transdermal were the same thing.

Also, I thought if I was going to go oral, 1-test would still be better than 1-AD because it didn't need to be converted. I would guess this is because more survives the liver in the case of 1-AD?

After I wrote the reply, my buddy and I (who is also trying this stack) had decided to go with a third dosage of the same size. That would bring it to 150mg of 1-test and 900mg of 4-AD.

I figured both would be ok, since they're both within the recommended dosage (4-AD 300mg 1-3 times daily, 1-test 25-50mg 2-3 times daily).

900mg of 4-AD is 3x over what you recommended, so I'll back down on that if you think that's best. But what do you think of the ether delivery system for the 1-test (from Molecular Nutrition)? I heard good things about it, so I went with that. I've never been a fan of transdermals... they've always been a pain in the ass for me. I'll just suck it up for my next stack if it's that much better, though!

Oh yeah, here's the times I've been taking the doses plus my schedule and such:

(pretty good daily example)

6:00AM - Protein shake (25gm protein)
6:30 - Breakfast (usually scrambled eggs, biscuit, fruit and two hard boiled eggs), multivitamin
8:00 - 50mg 1-test, 300mg 4-AD
9:30 - Snack, tuna (21gm protein), banana, yogurt, nutrigrain bar
11:30 - Lunch, (whatever the chow hall has!)
2:30PM - Snack, same as 9:30 usually
4:00 - 50mg 1-test, 300mg 4-AD
5:30 - Workout
6:30 - Protein shake (50gm) with carb/creatine powder (10gm creatine)
7:30 - Dinner
10:00 - Protein shake (25gm), bedtime!
12:30AM - Protein shake (25gm), 50mg 1-test, 300mg 4-AD

So far, I have no sides other than lethargy. I'm never like this. But by the time I go to the gym, I'm usually more energetic. I usually have some sort of caffeine blast an hour before hitting the weights.

 

[Lumberg]

OK in your post you are mixing up 1-AD and 4-AD. You need to pick one and stay with it bro!

And 1-AD actually exploits the liver first pass phenomenon. Your liver actually converts 1-AD to 1-test.

I have never tried 1-test oral in ethergels, liposomal, etc. But I have tried 1-AD and it works.

The thing about transdermal delivery is that your blood levels stay elevated for longer, whereas with orals you are basically gonna get spikes.

Also for orals you are gonna want to gobble at least one of those doses IMMEDIATELY post workout, along with that whey/dextrose shake. Think about it, most anabolism occurs in the window imeediately after working out. That's also when you want your anabolic substances within you!

I find taking it before can actually make me sluggish post-wo also.

 

[Shark01]

Lumberg,
Don't know if you frequent any other boards but there is a new oral out there.......Methyl 1-Test (over 90% availability, methyl to bypass the liver). I hear it is the BOMB (already have 4 bottles set aside.

C-Ya

 

[Flapjack1976]

Yeah, I was getting goofed up between 1-AD and 4-AD while typing. What I was trying to ask was pretty much why 1-AD was better when it still needed to be converted, and you pretty much answered that. I fixed the post, though... in case anyone else is trying to follow along.

I'll start taking the doses right after workout. Do the other two doses seem ok? Should I drop 4-AD from the other two doses? If I'm only going to take 300mg of it, when is the best time?

I'm suprised that 600-900mg of 4-AD is too much, usually the bottles give a conservative dosage... is it because I'm stacking it with the 1-test? I have no bloating, but my buddy had a little stomach bloatage the first few days...

 

[Flapjack1976]

Shark01:

I'm curious about the new delivery system. Where'd you read about this?

 

[Lumberg]

Yeah, I was getting goofed up between 1-AD and 4-AD while typing. What I was trying to ask was pretty much why 1-AD was better when it still needed to be converted, and you pretty much answered that. I fixed the post, though... in case anyone else is trying to follow along.

I'll start taking the doses right after workout. Do the other two doses seem ok? Should I drop 4-AD from the other two doses? If I'm only going to take 300mg of it, when is the best time?

I'm suprised that 600-900mg of 4-AD is too much, usually the bottles give a conservative dosage... is it because I'm stacking it with the 1-test? I have no bloating, but my buddy had a little stomach bloatage the first few days...

I said just start at 300 mg a day. If after several days you have little or no bloating, go to 600. Etc. Don't jump into 600 or 900 a day, you might regret it.

Personally that would be way too much for me, I may have more aromatase than you.

As far as Methyl 1-test, I don't know much about it. I have plenty of Super One+ and a source for very cheap 1-AD so I'm in no hurry to discover new things yet.

 

[Flapjack1976]

I think I'll try the transdermal for my next cycle...

Can you tell me a little about the Super One+? Do I remember you saying it made you a little bloaty?

The 900mg of the 4-AD has done nothing as far as bloating, but it has only been a week. We'll see... next time, I'll start off slower. Since I'm already at 900mg, I don't want to drop down unless I see a problem. What are other signs of gyno other than itchy/puffy nipples and bloating?

Who makes the cheap 1-AD you were talking about? I'm sure you're comfortable that it is a quality product.

If you don't mind answering one more question, can you explain how 1-AD has an advantage over ether 1-test due to the first liver pass? I guess I don't understand it fully... I did a search, but can't seem to find anything.