Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below 02gixxersix
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thats why im not comin off for a while. stay on for a year its fun.
Losing all gains post cycle?
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xonic2xonic
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A guy recently posted this in another thread:
"After every cycle I've ever done, I lose every single ounce of muscular size I developed while on... but keep the fat for some odd reason. I even took nolva and everything else for "post" activity, but it DID NOT WORK at all.... but that's just me. I always have shitty experiences with juice.... I do like getting hella strong though.. which is the only reason I use."
I am interested to know how many other people feel that they are in the same boat. I have a feeling, quite a few! EVERY SINGLE "keep gains" (LOL this excludes bridging/never coming off) recommendation (clomid, HCG, etc.) seems to work for some, do nothing for some, and even be detrimental to others. IMO there is nothing that conclusively works. I lean towards a belief that without androgenic/anabolic agents, we return to our genetic predispositions/maximums (which can be pretty damn pathetic!)
Who has the balls (no pun intended) to admit that they too have cycled and returned to where they were naturally within months afterwards?
"After every cycle I've ever done, I lose every single ounce of muscular size I developed while on... but keep the fat for some odd reason. I even took nolva and everything else for "post" activity, but it DID NOT WORK at all.... but that's just me. I always have shitty experiences with juice.... I do like getting hella strong though.. which is the only reason I use."
I am interested to know how many other people feel that they are in the same boat. I have a feeling, quite a few! EVERY SINGLE "keep gains" (LOL this excludes bridging/never coming off) recommendation (clomid, HCG, etc.) seems to work for some, do nothing for some, and even be detrimental to others. IMO there is nothing that conclusively works. I lean towards a belief that without androgenic/anabolic agents, we return to our genetic predispositions/maximums (which can be pretty damn pathetic!)
Who has the balls (no pun intended) to admit that they too have cycled and returned to where they were naturally within months afterwards?
xonic2xonic
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Also include in your responses, how you like getting "hella strong."
Stillgoing
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xonic2xonic said:
The reason for losing all gains no matter what you do post cycle may very well mean that your natural test levels are no longer high enough to support them. This is what has happened to me. For 10 years I always kept atleast half my gains and most of my strength and continued to progress with only one or two cycles a year. I also never did any post-c therapy. Now that I'm in my mid 30s and have had a vasectomy, I can no longer keep any of my gains. My test levels, at 400, are just not high enough anymore (due to age or vasectomy or both). So, the only way to keep them is now HRT. This is not a failure in post-cycle therapy, if you don't have the test levels, you don't have them. The only option if this is the case is HRT.
Stillgoing is right. Some of you younger guys that are shooting your mouth off about "doing it smart" and "doing it right" are going to see what it is like a little later on in life when you are shut down hard and you don't have test levels to keep your gains.
I am in the same boat. I am still trying to recover from my cycles but it seems to be a lost cause.
Stillgoing, what I would like to know is......what are the drawbacks of HRT? Do you totally loose your nuts or what?
I am in the same boat. I am still trying to recover from my cycles but it seems to be a lost cause.
Stillgoing, what I would like to know is......what are the drawbacks of HRT? Do you totally loose your nuts or what?
Gettin'Old
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But StillGoing, 400 is completely within the normal range. Is this amount of normal production insufficient to maintain some significant quantity of gains made, provided you utilize proper post cycle therapy?
Stillgoing
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Gettin'Old said:
Yes, your right, 400 is "low-normal". The way the numerous doctors I have consulted with have described it to me, everyone is different in terms of what they need. I may have been at 800 before, and I need a higher level to function well & maintain gains.
The bottom line for me is this: I've been training 18yrs and cycling on and off for 15 years. I estimate I've done 20-25 cycles. I was also pretty successful making gains, I started at 180 and got up to 295 at 15% or so. I also won several regional & state level shows. The point so far is, I know my body and I know what I'm doing. Well, my last 2 cycles (the only cycles since my vasectomy 3 years ago) I have done low dosages and done everything correctly regarding post-c. In both cases, I lost ALL the gains from the cycle and in fact, sunk lower than where I was before cycle. Upon testing my test levels, 8wks after the last cycle I was back to my 400 level, but, all gains were gone. It then takes another 6 months and a couple HCG/nolv/clomid runs to get looking a little better and feeling a little better. But the symptoms of low test remain; very easy fat accumulation, tired, lots of sickness, low sex drive, difficulty putting muscle on etc. This NEVER used to happen to me. So, this last cycle was a test, and, I failed, miserably. So, if I recovered and felt just fine clean for 12 years, then everything changes and I can't recover and I feel like shit when off, something dramatic has happened to me. I wish I had my test levels checked when I was a little younger, but, I didn't. So, I don't have definitive proof of what my previous levels were. But, my body is telling me clearly enough that they were higher.
Hope this helps answer the question.....
Stillgoing
New member
Grainger said:
Regarding nut size, everyone is different. I never have experienced much atrophy there before, and, I don't expect I will on HRT. Nelson has said that his size difference is negligible. Apparently on an HRT dose you are still producing some, albiet a lower dose.
The only draw-backs I can find are; 1- your dependent on it the rest of your life, and, 2- potentially more estrogen & conversion to DHT. These can be controlled though.
The benefits are numerous.
S
satchboogie
Guest
satchboogie's post cycles:
clomid - 100mg for one week, then 50mg a day for 2-3 weeks.
creatine for 4 weeks.
25-30% more cals than usual.
clomid - 100mg for one week, then 50mg a day for 2-3 weeks.
creatine for 4 weeks.
25-30% more cals than usual.
I was the one quoted in the beginning of this thread about "losing all muscular size"... and it is true for me. I've done clomid AND nolva post cycle and it didn't do shit. It's not like I deflated like a baloon with a hole in it overnight.... I just gradually lost my size and strength over a period of about 2 months afterward.
Perhaps my natural test levels are low.. I don't know, but am certainly interested to find out. I gained approx. 20 lbs on my last cycle.. but afterwards, lost 5 pounds, my muscles went back to their pre-cycle size, and I lost most of my strength.
I'm not trying to speak dogmatically, just simply sharing my experiences.
Perhaps my natural test levels are low.. I don't know, but am certainly interested to find out. I gained approx. 20 lbs on my last cycle.. but afterwards, lost 5 pounds, my muscles went back to their pre-cycle size, and I lost most of my strength.
I'm not trying to speak dogmatically, just simply sharing my experiences.
S
satchboogie
Guest
i run proviron all the way through my cycles, and since i dont use mega dosages i've never needed nolvadex. i guess i dont get severe sides like some.
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