Looking for Shoulder Press Max...How?

[callthedoctor]

I know there are different techniques for shoulder press...was wondering which one would give the best representation of actual shoulder strength.

I was thinking the push press....I believe this is (correct me if I'm wrong) grabbing the (heavy) BB off the squat rack at shoulder level (like a front squat), walking backwards, bending knees and pushing that SOB to lock out?

I currently do 5x5 with standing behind the neck press (with pretty strict form) and was wondering what I could max with on shoulders...however, I don't want to blow a shoulder going behind the neck...

Any thoughts?


Thanks.

 

[InTraining]

Seated Military Press with the BB would be the option I would choose..You can get a lift off and the position itself is stable....with DBs there is the issue of getting them to shoulder level and that can waste energy even with a spotter...

The Push Press is a good idea but a lot of that will be leg drive and you said you wanted it to be actual shoulder strength..

 

[callthedoctor]

I've never really done the push-press....do people usually do this for reps?

 

[InTraining]

I tend to do the push press in the 3-6 rep range...I find with higher reps form starts to deteriorate...

 

[callthedoctor]

Thanks...I take it you do them to failure? Also, is my description in the first post adequate....

Should I use a belt when going heavy?

 

[InTraining]

Yes...I goto failure...

I prefer using a belt because I want my back to stay in the correct position and it helps me stay tight throughout the set....

This article on shoulder training shows the proper form

http://www.t-nation.com/findArticle...0AB244A50AFE2E72.ba13?article=04-011-training

 

[bignate73]

no, push press wouldnt be ideal at all. that would be the equivalent of a bench press that you bounce off your chest, but with even more force because you can use your legs.

 

[d3track]

i love the push press!
but as far as gauging pure delt strength, the seated bb would work best

 

[cwick0]

Im a huge fan of seated bb military, front or rear.

You will get your strength from varying your sets/reps, for example:

3 sets of 10 at the same weight for 3-4 weeks
sets of 10 as high as you can go for 3-4 weeks
5x5 for 3-4 weeks
sets of 5-6 reps as high as you can go for 3-4 weeks.

This is how i have developed some incredible strenght and endurance on chest and shoulders. My seated rear (touch back of head, till shoulders hit 90 degrees) military press is at 295lbs for 6 reps, front is around 275.

 

[WalkingBeast]

The push press gets the entire body into the movement. A seated press as mentioned would probabally be best to gauge shoulder strength. Since your body remains stable and shoulders are the main mover. Of course shoulders can never be totally isolated, theres always other muscles involved. This is why Ive never been big on "completely strict form". I do what I feel best, and whats brought me results. My mentality is that, in a fight for example, Im not going to use strict and rigid movements, my whole body will be engaged in the flesh ripping fiesta. You could say I have some strongman type ideas that get into my training, but at the same time I always focus on increasing the pain in each muscle I train. I never have a problem with feeling a muscle getting worked. Aside from the rear delts, even with the entire stack (300lbs) on reverse flies. I find that I feel more from cheat curling 185lbs for reps then I do curling 135 for strict reps. I believe the increased load makes a big difference. How this applies to shoulders anymore is unknown to me. haha Keep KILLING that shit!!

 

[TRUEsoldier]

Im a huge fan of seated bb military, front or rear.

You will get your strength from varying your sets/reps, for example:

3 sets of 10 at the same weight for 3-4 weeks
sets of 10 as high as you can go for 3-4 weeks
5x5 for 3-4 weeks
sets of 5-6 reps as high as you can go for 3-4 weeks.

This is how i have developed some incredible strenght and endurance on chest and shoulders. My seated rear (touch back of head, till shoulders hit 90 degrees) military press is at 295lbs for 6 reps, front is around 275.

Your a fuckin animal bro!!!

I was quite happy with my lil ol 195 (to rear, same depth, hit back of head till at 90 degrees) for 5x5

But fuck my shoulder would explode if I even put 295 and tried to lower it...LOL, but I am pretty weak anyways. I think I messed up my rotator as well, but it doesnt affect me on my mil press, or inclines nearly as much as my flat bench, I am almost fucked when it comes to those!!! It sucks

 

[WalkingBeast]

Im a huge fan of seated bb military, front or rear.

You will get your strength from varying your sets/reps, for example:

3 sets of 10 at the same weight for 3-4 weeks
sets of 10 as high as you can go for 3-4 weeks
5x5 for 3-4 weeks
sets of 5-6 reps as high as you can go for 3-4 weeks.

This is how i have developed some incredible strenght and endurance on chest and shoulders. My seated rear (touch back of head, till shoulders hit 90 degrees) military press is at 295lbs for 6 reps, front is around 275.

Thats some MONSTER fucking weight!!

 

[callthedoctor]

Thats some MONSTER fucking weight!!

I agree cwick, I'd like to see 3 wheels behind the neck....how about some video when you get there ! !

 

[anthrax]

Im a huge fan of seated bb military, front or rear.

agree with the front BB military but I stopped doing the rear one
Too much strain on the rotator cuff

 

[cwick0]

agree with the front BB military but I stopped doing the rear one
Too much strain on the rotator cuff

I feel that you can destroy your rotator cuff by going to deep, hence i stop once my elbows get to 90 degrees. The key is to stop there and not fuck your shoulders up.

Plus i really isolate side and rear delts, NO FRONTS, upright rows (155x10), and shrugs.

 

[cwick0]

I agree cwick, I'd like to see 3 wheels behind the neck....how about some video when you get there ! !

1. no video equipment.
2. not a camera guy, i avoid the fuck out of them, try not to break them.
3. im not a little boy...25 years old, 250-255lbs @ 5'10.5". Ive put on between 40-45lbs since arriving at grad school and switching from 3 days a week of training to 5, plus ive been training for about 10 years now.
4. i rarely post any PRs. If i do they are usually on walkingbeast's training log. We trade jabs and advice to one another all the time.

 

[planotexas47]

cwick0, i commend you, i,v been lifting for 9 years straight on my 12 cycle and at 47 and 260 only can do 230 for a few reps behind back. whatever your doing dont change. pat

 

[Scotsman]

Purest test of shoulder strength is the standing shoulder press. That's where you pick up the bar like a front squat and then press it overhead without using any leg drive. That way you can't push into the bench for support. My best ever was 245 for 4 whereas I can push press over 300 no problem. Also I haven't done barbell bnb for a while but was doing reps with 275 before I stopped.

Cheers,
Scotsman

 

[cwick0]

Standing shoulder presses kill my lower back otherwise i would hit them hard.

 

[Griz1]

"maxing out" a shoulder press of any kind behind the neck is asking for an injury.

regular workouts btn...some can do it...some can't.

If you want to know what your max weight is, just do in front. The body was never designed to lift huge amounts of weight at that angle.