I am looking for some input from some of the more experienced users on here and those who have used HGH, t3 and insulin in a cycle or any two of them combined.
A little background:
I am coming to the end of a 10 ish wk cycle - well it's actually over but I still have some test in my system. I am around 270lbs right now but holding a small amount of excess water. I would probably be around 260 lean if that was gone and I am about 12-13% on average - at a guess. I am slightly over 30 more than 6 ft tall and I will now be doing PCT and a cycle of nordatropin. I will be using a total of 340ius.
I worked it out at 2ius a day for 6 months 5 on 2 off but I could also do 3ius a day for 4 months.
So question A:
4 mths @ 3ius or 6 mths @ 2iu
I would go the 6 months @2IU's
I have used hgh before but not for extended periods of time and I didnt use it most effectively.
Question B:
Would 25mcg daily of t3 be enough or should I taper up to 75 and then back down (cycle one month on one month off)? or how would this best be used for maximum effects with the hgh? I was actually thinking of only running it for 1 mth at 25mcg for the duration.
Why don't you use the T-3,4 combination.
Question C
I was also thinking of running a 2x 10 day insulin cycle every 3 months (I am an experienced user so please do not comment unless you are answering the question - I know and have numerous studies on the risks). I will probably do the insulin for 10 days in week 2 and then 10 days in month 3. 5iu twice daily humalog - super strict diet during insulin active times. Is this how you would do it/have done it? Please for this question, only those who have used hgh and slin together
Question D
Is there anyone who can suggest a better way of cycling all the above or is what I have listed what you would go with?
Question E
With the 2iu daily - would one injection be best in the morning or would you still split it in to two injections? Would you differ the timings than in the morning if only one injection?
Do the GH first thing in the morning before you eat and no sugars for at least 1/2 hour.
Any help/input would be super appreciated.
Thank you gentlemen and ladies
Here is a great piece on GH, Slin and IGF...
HGH + IGF-1 + Slin - A basic guide for the lazy man
There are volumes of information and studies available about using HGH, IGF-1, and Insulin, but for the most part coming up with a good cycle including all of these is a tedious process and requires more reading than most people wish to do or have the time to do. The following is meant to a quick and simple reference to what a cycle including all three might look like and a brief description of the action of each component. This is in no wise intended to be presented as the ONLY way to run a cycle such as this, but merely as an example of one method that will definitely yield results.
THE CYCLE
Weeks 1- (20-30) – HGH – On 5/ off 2
2 – 2.5 IU’s first thing in the morning
2 – 2.5 IU’s early afternoon
injected Sub-C into abdomen, obliques, fronts of the thighs, upper triceps
Weeks 1-5, 11-15, (21-25) – Long R3 IGF-1 – Every day
60mcg’s intramuscular post work out on workout days,
first thing in the morning on non workout days
Weeks 6-10, 16-20, (26-30) – Humalog – Workout days only
8IU’s immediately post workout, intramuscular
*** alternatively, you could run Humalog on 1-5, 11-15, (21-25) with your LR3 if you prefer, depending on your cycle goal***
Immediately after Humalog injection – do the following
Injection + 5 minutes – drink shake with 10g glutamine / 10g creatine / 55g dextrose
Injection + 15 minutes – drink shake with 80g of whey protein in water
Injection + 60 – 75 minutes – eat a protein / carb meal with 40-50g of protein, 40-50g of carbs, NO FATS
Avoid fats for 2-3 hours for Humalog IM, 3-4 hours for Humalog sub-q, 4-5 hours for Humulin-R.
**keep some glucose tablets or other simple carbs on hand for the active window of your insulin. Hypo symptoms can and will hit hard and fast and you will have little time to react. This is the main danger of insulin use. Be ready.***
OPTIONAL
Weeks 1-5, 11-15, (21-25) - T3 - 12.5mcg - 25mcg per day (or 12.5mcgs ->100-150mcgs ->12.5mcgs if used for fat loss instead of protein synthesis assist and slight metabolic boost)
HGH
HGH should ideally be used for 20-30 week cycles (or longer). The dosage should be between 2-3IU per day if you are using GH primarily for fat loss, 4-5 IU’s a day for both fat loss and muscle growth, and approximately 1.0 – 2.0 IU’s a day for females. It is best to split your injections 1/2 first thing in the morning, 1/2 early afternoon if your dose is above 2.0IU’s per day. Your pituitary will naturally produce about 10 pulses of GH per day. Each injection you take will create a negative feedback loop that will suppress these pulses for about 4 hours. By taking your injections first thing in the morning and early afternoon you will still allow your body to release its biggest pulse, which normally occurs shortly after going to sleep at night.
When starting out with your HGH cycle, for most people it is wise to begin you dose at 1.5 – 2.0IU per day for the first couple of weeks, and then begin increasing your dose by 0.5 to 1.0 units every week or two until you reach your desired level. While it isn't an absolute neccessity to do this, if you are sensitive to the type of sides HGH present you will often times avoid these sides of joint pain/swelling, and bloating/water retention by slowly acclaimating to your ultimate 4-5 IU/day goal.
You should use an U100 insulin syringe for injecting HGH, and inject it Sub-C into your abdomen, obliques, top of thighs, triceps. Rotate injection sites. HGH can have a small localized fat loss benefit, so keep this in mind when choosing your injection sites.
IGF-1
When HGH makes it pass through the liver, a release of IGF-1 is a result. IGF-1 appears to be the key player in muscle growth. It stimulates both the differentiation and proliferation of myoblasts. It also stimulates amino acid uptake and protein synthesis in muscle and other tissues. While HGH will cause an increase in your IGF-1 level over the course of a few months, HGH has a cumulative effect, so the addition of IGF-1 will greatly speed up the time to results.
There are two types of IGF-1 that will typically be used by bodybuilders. One is bio-identical HuIGF-1, a 70 amino acid string. The other is Long R3 IGF-1, which is an 83 amino acid analog of human IGF-I comprising the complete human IGF-I sequence with the substitution of an Arg for the Glu at position 3 (hence R3), and a 13 amino acid extension peptide at the N-terminus (hence the long). Which of these you use depends on your goal.
HuIGF-1 is very short lived in the body (half life of probably around 10 minutes). This type of IGF-1 is very useful if you are seeking local site growth. Since it is so short lived, little of the IGF-1 makes it to other tissues and IGF-1 receptors in the body. The way to inject this is immediately post work out into the muscle that you wish to have local site growth. Use a U100 insulin syringe, and inject 80mcg’s bilaterally into the desired muscle immediately post workout. For this type of IGF-1, I would use it workout days only or if desired you could inject on non-workout days first thing in the morning into a muscle group worked the previous day.
For Long R3 IGF-1, it isn’t as critical that you inject into a local site as long R3 has a active window of many hours, and is designed specifically to resist being bound. Since it is common to reconstitute this type of IGF-1 with Benzyl Alcohol, Acetic Acid, or Hydrochloric Acid I would still recommend that you inject intra-muscular. It can and probably will leave a nice red irritated spot if you inject Sub-C. I still inject into a muscle just worked to take advantage of increased IGF-1 receptors, but because of the long activity window of this type of IGF-1 any muscle will work well and give you good results,. I would suggest that you inject between 40-80mcg’s per day everyday immediately post workout on workout days, and first thing in the morning on non-workout days.
Use a U-100 insulin syringe with 1/2" needle to inject IGF-1 intramuscular (bilaterally for HuIGF-1, bilaterally optional for Long R3)
Insulin
Working out causes us to end up in a catabolic state. It is important to back in a positive nitrogen balance as soon as possible. When not using insulin, we drink some dextrose with our protein to cause an insulin spike immediately post workout to help shuttle the protein and sugars to the muscles.
Insulin is very good at shuttling nutrients to the muscles, and works in a very complimentary manner with GH in the types of things that they shuttle. Also, HGH can cause an amount of insulin resistance, so adding some insulin to your cycle will offset any potential resistance that might occur during your HGH cycle.
For the purposes that we are using insulin, a dosage of 4-10IU’s is adequate and should be used immediately post workout. I personally prefer using Humalog intramuscular as it will cause a rapid spike and clear out of your system quickly. You can use it sub-q or use Humulin-R instead, but each of these will result in a longer active window, thus a longer time to avoid eating any fats and watching your carb intake. Any fats or over abundance of carbs will end up being stored as fat during insulin's active window. The approximate windows are:
Humalog - IM - 2-3 hours
Sub-q - 3-4 hours
Humulin -R - IM - 3-4 hours
Sub-q 4-5 hours
Use a U-100 insulin syringe with 1/2" needle to inject IM immediately post workout. Alternatively, you can inject Sub-C if desired or if you wish a longer active window for some reason. Begin with a dose of 2IU's or so, and increase the dose each workout day until you reach your 8IU's.
If for some reason you wish to avoid insulin, I would still suggest that immediately post workout you spike you own endogenous insulin by drinking 80 grams of dextrose / 40 grams of whey isolate protein. While this certainly won't do the work of 8-10 IU's of Humalog, it will most certainly assist getting your muscle back in a nitrogen positive environment in a short amount of time.
T3
HGH can have a slight inhibitory effect on your thyroid. For most people this is minimal and does not require any additional thyroid be taken, but if you wish to augment protein synthesis as well as give yourself a slight boost in thyroid without shutting down your own production, you can add 12.5mcg of T3 daily to your HGH, IGF-1, Insulin cycle. This will aid both in bulking and cutting.
If you add T3 to your cycle, you should also consider taking some thyroid support supplements such as t-100x, bladderwrack, coleus forskolin. You should check and make sure your intake of trace minerals (selenium, zinc, copper) is sufficient to aid in the conversion of T4 to T3.
If you are going to take more than 12.5 mcg of T3, you will need to cycle the dose both up and down to avoid a rebound effect when going off the T3 part of your cycle, but for our use with an HGH cycle and use in assisting with protein sythesis, 12.5mcg will be sufficient.
If you wish to use T3 in conjuction with the above for heavy cutting, begin with 12.5mcgs, ramp up to 100-150mcgs, then slowly back down tapering back to 12.5 mcgs and running 12.5mcgs for several days before discontinuing use. This will minimize the chance for rebound while your own thyroid gets back in gear. Cycle your T3 in conjunction with your LR3 IGF-1. The thought behind this is that LR3 binds poorly to IGFBP's, so you will be able to use an elevated dose of T3 (which will likely increase IGFBP's) and still keep elevated IGF-1 levels. I would suggest that use of T3 above 25mcg's or so would not be advisable for too many 5 weeks segments of your complete cycle. As one of the major "anabolic" benefits of HGH use is elevated IGF-1 levels, we don't want to create an environment of radically increased IGF binding proteins. Abuse of T3 will go a long way in creating that environment hostile to IGF-1.
Well, I think that about covers it…add a cycle or two of your prefered testosterone combo (cyp, e, prop, etc.) and you have a great combination for bulking or cutting.
Hope this helps. Enjoy!
RedBaron @ IFL
Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below 
