Help.. Low Test levels.. Need advice!!!

[deltoromd]

I have been around for several years but have never posted, this is the first time i have felt the need to post. I need some advise from some of the experts here. I have taken just about all the OTC andro products over the years. Some with slight gains, some did nothing. Last year I did an 8 week cycle of Sustanon and ended with Win-V and Clomid. I had very nice gains, gained about 20lbs of muscle and began to see a change in body structure for once in my life. I started out at 5'8" 184lbs and ended up at 205lbs by the end of the cycle. Feeling great and looking much better than ever!!!

Now a quick history.. I have felt in the last 4-5 yrs i have began to suffer from low test levels, (moodyness, sleeplessness, hairloss, gynomastia, loss of appattite, loss of sex drive, fat retention in the belly and breast area, etc.) When I was on Sustanon, I felt so called "normal again". I have not taken anything in the last 6 months now. No Andro products, no creatine, no test, no nothing, excepts for a few protein shakes a week with my normal diet.

I went to the Dr. 2 weeks ago and had some blood test run to see what is going on with me. The only thing found is my test level came back low for my age. I am 28yrs old and it came back at 205 nG. According to my Dr. I should be above 240nG. According to most internet sites medical books acceptable range is 300 to 1200 nG. I am going back to the Dr. today to have blood re-drawn. I should have the results in 1 weeks. He stated if they come back low again, hormone therapy will be required. This would obviously explain all of my problems that i have been experiencing.

Now from a bodybuidling point of view. I have been trying for about 3 yrs to get into some amature competitions in my area, but have fallen short each time and have not entered because I was not happy with my overall development. The low test levels prob had a lot to do with it. How do I approach this with my Dr. so I dont look like someone that is just trying to get legal Test but rather there is a medical need? And how do i get the most of this test therapy that will be admininstered and monitored by my Dr.? I dont want to come across as a roid head and have my Dr. just say no, you dont need it now, but I do want to get the most out of it so i can persure some competitions in the near future...

Any suggestions? Also, you can send me a private email if you would feel better talking about it offline.

Thanks,
Mike

 

[junk]

It is my understanding from your post that your doc will prescribe you testosterone (cream, oral or inj.) ? I don't think you would need much 'begging' 205nG is extremely low for your age. Even 240 or 300 would deserve HRT or some sort of other treatment. However, you would not be able to take testo at bodybuilding levels and when you have to be tested by your endo. A cycle of 500mg weekly sust would bring your levels real high, depanding you when tested, it can come easily well over 1600 which would cause a lot of antagonism from your doc, and rightfully so.

 

[deltoromd]

That is correct Junk. They will perscribe test oral, cream or inj. I am awaiting the results of my second blood test before they will start some sort of HRT. What is perferrable ( I would assume inj) since you get an immediate surge then it starts to decrease? I want to push my lifting to the next level and start participating in some competitions, but dont want the doc to get pissed.... He already knows that i am a gym nut and eat good (for the most part, not perfect but better than most). Just not sure how to approach it without screwing myself.

 

[sigmund]

Alot of Docs conclude HRT is the only option when test levels come back low. In my opinion this isn't the case, my guess is that you're shutdown following pro-longed prohormone & AAS use. I think that it may be better to focus efforts on getting your natty test back to where it should be via HCG / Nolva / Clomid / Adex etc.

Did you include full PCT (post cycle therapy) in your previous cycles?

Ultimately the choice is yours but HRT for life at 28 is a big decision.

Additionally - have a browse through some of the posts on the PCT board in particular Jenetics experience of recovery following a long period of being shut down.

 

[nsashbl01]

Alot of Docs conclude HRT is the only option when test levels come back low. In my opinion this isn't the case, my guess is that you're shutdown following pro-longed prohormone & AAS use. I think that it may be better to focus efforts on getting your natty test back to where it should be via HCG / Nolva / Clomid / Adex etc.

Did you include full PCT (post cycle therapy) in your previous cycles?

Ultimately the choice is yours but HRT for life at 28 is a big decision.

Additionally - have a browse through some of the posts on the PCT board in particular Jenetics experience of recovery following a long period of being shut down.

Good advice here. I'm on HRT because I fucked up my pituitary from multiple head injuries. I still made sure I wasn't recoverable before starting HRT. I believe they can tell by checking FSH and LH. Go to sbi and read Swales "Recipe for Success", bring it to your doc.

At your age, I'd do my best to get my endoctrine system straightened out before any more cycles.

Good luck...

 

[deltoromd]

I agree this could be the result of prolonged prohormone use but I always quit after 8 weeks. Generally I would do 1 or several prohormone stacks for 8 weeks then i would stay off of everything for atleast another 8 weeks. I have not done that much of the good shit. I did one cycle of d-bol and winny-V. Results were average but better than the prohormones. About 3 months later I tried sustanon with winny-v and had much better results. Gained about 24 lbs of muscle and lost about 3% body fat during that time. I concluded both cycles with a cycle of clomid for 3 weeks.

Like I said, I have been off of everthing for about 8 months now, so, with or without a heafty post cycle regimine, I would think my body had enough time to recooperate. The reason I tried the "real stuff" is I have always thought my test levels were low, for many reasons I wont get into now, but valid.

I think I am going to take my results from the first and second blood test and go see another dr. (someone besides my family physician). I would like to get a specialist opinion.

I know it is a big decision, but hell, dont the Life Extension companies use HRT to keep the stars and rich living a longer healthier lives than previous generations? Just a thought for discussion.

Thanks again for the responses.

 

[deltoromd]

nsashbl01, Sorry, where do i find this? "Go to sbi and read Swales "Recipe for Success", bring it to your doc."

I am looking for it, cant find it...

 

[envies]

Definitely go to an endocrinologist. he/she will most likely be much more educated on the endocrine system than your general physician...keyword 'general', not specialized.

 

[junk]

I agree this could be the result of prolonged prohormone use but I always quit after 8 weeks. Generally I would do 1 or several prohormone stacks for 8 weeks then i would stay off of everything for atleast another 8 weeks. I have not done that much of the good shit. I did one cycle of d-bol and winny-V. Results were average but better than the prohormones. About 3 months later I tried sustanon with winny-v and had much better results. Gained about 24 lbs of muscle and lost about 3% body fat during that time. I concluded both cycles with a cycle of clomid for 3 weeks.

Like I said, I have been off of everthing for about 8 months now, so, with or without a heafty post cycle regimine, I would think my body had enough time to recooperate. The reason I tried the "real stuff" is I have always thought my test levels were low, for many reasons I wont get into now, but valid.

I think I am going to take my results from the first and second blood test and go see another dr. (someone besides my family physician). I would like to get a specialist opinion.

I know it is a big decision, but hell, dont the Life Extension companies use HRT to keep the stars and rich living a longer healthier lives than previous generations? Just a thought for discussion.

Thanks again for the responses.

To summerize:
1. Go see an endocrinologist, preferably one that has experience with young athletes (not many).
2. The fact that your cycles were 8 weeks does not imply that PCT is not essential, it is. Some people can get their hpta very supressed from 8 weeks, while some don't. I never really did understand guys that do not do ANYTHING post cycle to keep their gains for which the've worked so hard for (or didn't).
3. For short cycles the minimum for PCT is 3 weeks. For longer, I usually aim at 5-8 weeks to make sure endocrine system is kick started.
4. Blood work is essential about 2-3 weeks after PCT is over to see how your body is doing on it's own.
5. Even if you were suppressed for 2 years, a good endocrinologist can help you get out of it, you can ask Jenetic.
6. HRT is always a route, but depands on your goal.
7. Don't mix HRT with cycles. HRT is HRT - hormone replacement therapy it's about 100mg of enathate every once in a while, not 500mg of sust every week. so don't count on HRT to get you AAS cycle results. Also if you visit your doctor with a reading of over well over 900 that won't really look like HRT.

 

[DIVISION]

I think I am going to take my results from the first and second blood test and go see another dr. (someone besides my family physician). I would like to get a specialist opinion.

Smart.

Find an Endocrinologist who's covered under your insurance and see them, realize that they will most likely want to run their own bloodtests for liability purposes and to squeeze more money out of your insurance company. Once they have done that, you will most likely be put on Test Cypionate or Enanthate 200MG EW or EOW. This is HRT only....nothing more. You don't want to make it seem like you're begging for juice, all you can do is complain of your lack of stamina, libido, and muscle soreness lingering for days.

Once you see the Endocrinologist, see them for all your HRT needs, simply bypass your family practioner as it will only complicate matters.



DIV