Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below
napsgear
genezapharmateuticals
domestic-supply
puritysourcelabs
UGL OZ
UGFREAK
napsgeargenezapharmateuticals domestic-supplypuritysourcelabsUGL OZUGFREAK

GHB precursor 1,4-Butanediol

F

firstenrgy

New member
IMO 1,4-Butanediol is a great sleep aid, provided it is properly dosed.

If you have any questions on how to dose or where to find 1,4-Butanediol, send me an e-mail.

Please include your board name.
[email protected]
 
I have heard that people wake up in the middle of the night, 3-4 hours after they have fallen asleep with ghb. Then they have to take a second dosage to get another 3-4 hours sleep. Do you experience similar effects when taking butanediol?
 
My exper--with 1-4 but-----

I have used gbl-ghb for about 2 plus years on and off-----mostly off over the last 6 months----I picked up 10 bottles of the 1-,4 and was using it at night to sleep- but let me tell ya after blowing through 4 bottles of the stuff my body just didn't seem right(nothing like ghb) I was getting these weird ass pains in my body(like my nerve endings or something) needless to say I dumped the remaining bottles that I have and I will tell you guys this ( I have put almost everything in my body at least once ) and I will diff---stay the fuck away from 1,4...Something just isn't right with that shit....But I had to go the cheap route and didn't want to listen to some of the guys on here saying the shit is bad news....Pay the price and use the real stuff----peace
 
dosing ghb/butanediol

If I should try 1,4-bdo, how should I dose it? Will I get enough sleep - say 6 to 8 hours - by using just one dosage? Or do I have to take a second dose in the middle of the night?
 
Have used both...something aint right with it...if you leave it in a plastic bottle over night it will melt through...felt weird using it...nothing like ghb
 
I saw this at Albertons

I saw gbl sold at my grocery store as superglue remover, and it was in a plastic bottle, maybe there was something wrong with Hypnotica's that melted though his plastic bottle. It was under one of its lesser know names. Butyrolacetone.
 
I LOVE GHB, but 1,4...

1,4 should only be used if real GHB cannot be found. I find it a very poor substitute. As others have said, the buzz is alot "dirtier" with 1,4 for some reason. Which leads me to believe all is not well...
 
Daeo,

hahaha.....I look forward to reading your post some day man. (I am sure that your a cool guy and all, but you and I always respond to these type posts with a different view point.)


To the guy with the post,

Let me give you a little advice friend. GHB works great for sleep when you first start using it. Then GBL and GHB will SUCK and your sleep will never be the same. Note the time of this post if you don't think that I know what I am talking about it!

I wake up after 3-4 hours of sleep TOPS! GBL actually will not even work as long...although at first it seems to. You will have to get up in the middle of the night to recap (like I just did) in order to lay down again.

One night while I was up surfing the web at 3:30am, I started searching around on the web looking for some reasons why I couldn't sleep. I had no idea that it was from the G / GBL because that was "THE BEST SLEEP DRUG" hahaha...YEAH RIGHT!

It catched up to you at some point. Anyone telling you that it is so great has not used it long enough.....and if they think it is so great...chances are, they are not about to stop using so they will end up at the point that I am at now.

Oh yeah...this stuff is wonderful. I love waking up for an hour EVERY single night. Keep reading all the crap that you read on the web about how much of a mircle the stuff is. I thought the same thing!

About GBL melting plastic? That depends on the type of plastic but yeah...it is a solvent and will melt a lot of shit! Look at recycle bins...they are for differnt types of plastic bottles. HDPE, PP, etc.

Is it safe in humans!?!? OF COURSE IT IS!! (HAHAH...NON-Toxic as that one bullshit report that floats around all over the web about that study on rats or some shit) GBL is BAD NEWS for the body bro. Take it from one who KNOWS!

GBL and GHB are pure trouble! and you won't know that they are until it is too late!

Well my cap just kicked in so I think that I can go back to sleep now.......
 
I have had good experience with it. I do not use it every night and dose only when I have trouble getting asleep. Although it's not disputed that the effect only last three to four hours, some people (like myself) do not wake in the middle of the night. I use 1/2 teaspoon (3ml) and that does the trick. Of course this is not for everyone. If you have an addictive personality you should stay away from it.
firstenrgy
 
I agree if you have an addictive personality stay away. I've been using 1-4 for a few months now and i tend to wake up a few times through the night. I also get really bad night sweats too, my buddy and i did a test. After taking the 1-4 our temp. increased a degree or two. Anyone else get these results?
 
Grainger said:
Daeo,

hahaha.....I look forward to reading your post some day man. (I am sure that your a cool guy and all, but you and I always respond to these type posts with a different view point.)
Click to expand...

Riiiggghtt. I've been taking GHB for over a year off and on now. Don't you think I would have become addicted to it by now? I haven't had any GHB for about two months now. My sleep has been fine and I haven't experienced the "withdrawls worse than heroin". Maybe it's because I know better than not to use it around the clock for months on end.

I'm sorry about your sleep disorder Grainger. But you brought it on yourself by using something for long enough of a duration that it would become addictive. Besides on the internet I don't know anyone who is "addicted" to GHB(and I know alot of people who take it). And blaming it on people who post here is pointing the finger in the wrong direction. Even if everyone on this board tells me it's a non addictive drug, I'd still have the common sense not to drink it like water...
 
I've said this a thousand times people, and i'll say it again, STAY AWAY from 1,4. the shit is worthless and is much worse on your body than gbl or ghb, and the addiction to it is MUCH worse. GBL is so easy to obtain, why in the hell would you resort to 1,4?????
 
wow

there is a boatload of misinformation in these posts! And as usual, the truth(?) is somewhere inbetween. First, gbl/ghb/and 1,4-butanediol are all different drugs. Of the three, ghb and gbl are the most similar in chemical nature, effects, and metabolism. I have used all three extensively and find that gbl/ghb are quite similar, 1,4 by the nature of its metabolism is a little different. The drawback to 1,4- is that it is metabolized by the liver(read that stressfull to the liver) and when used with alcohol and other drugs metabolized by the liver the effects of the drugs are extended and magnified since they compete for the same metabolic pathway. The other big problem that I see here is the proliferation of blackmarket sources that do not let you know the purity of the drug, if the drug is only 99% pure(pretty good right?) what are the contaminants in that other 1%? Feeling a little funny after taking this stuff? Probably because you are slowly poisoning yourself with impurities. The sleep aid myth is another problem. I think it is a rare individual who takes any of the three and sleeps soundly thru the night. For me the effects usually last about 2-3hrs, after that if I took a small dose, 1-2ml) I am able to drop back to sleep. If I take larger doses, I find that I need to take another dose to fall asleep. I have been down that road before and if followed to its logical conclusion, you end up dosing every two hours in order to sleep, NOT A GOOD IDEA! So lets see, possibly contaminated, ultimately casues sleep disorders and dependancy, can lead to serious complication when taken with other competing drugs like alcohol and barbs, causes stress to the liver. All in all, I would have to say that it would be a good idea to stay away from these drugs. Oh, did I mention that some or all (depending on the state) are scheduled drugs that can lead to arrest, fines, and possible imprisonment? :)

Having said all that before the defensive flames begin, you are all big boys and entitled to make your own decisions, I have. :)
 
i've said it before and i'll say it again..... the KEY to these types of drugs is moderation. If your not responsible with it, something IS going to happen with you. It all boils down to a science of how you do things and its always the smart ones that end up fine.
 
I have to throw a little something into the mix here.. I've been using 1,4 for a little while now, and I agree that in moderation, it is harmless (assuming you don't have an addictive behavior pattern). Also.. people keep mentioning that it is HORRIBLE and DANGEROUS.. can I just add that almost every single drug we talk about on this board is now illegal because it was deemed dangerous to humans? How is 1,4 any different? Just as in steroids.. with precaution.. 1,4 is probably less dangerous to your liver than suckin down 7-8 beers in a night, or taking an oral such as d-bol. Just to cover my ass.. I obviously don't have any scientific backup for this.. it's just my opinion, thoughts, and views.
 
i have heard that you can buy it at stores in the form of printer toner, or some cleansers. are any of these pure enough to drink it right out of the bottle from the store (in proper dose). If so, what is the brand name of these products?
 
Be forwarned.. My friend developed CHRONIC PANCREATITIS from drinking GBL almost everyday for over 2 years.. he was not a drinker of alcohol (since he had his G) When he was taken to the hospital they asked him if he drank alcohol, he said no, told them that he drank GBL reguarly.. His doc concluded that his pancreatits was caused by the GBL - the body uses the same enzyme to break down GBL as it does alcohol.. as a matter a fact they claim that it took 100x more of the enzyme to break it down causing excessive stress on the pancreas, which caused a pancreatitis.. and that my friends if NOT something you want to live with.

Everyone thinks out kidneys and liver, but don't forget there are lots of other organs in your body..

Gman
 
That's very sad and all... but I would think taking any addictive chemical every day for 2 years would pretty much cause some internal distress. That's just my opinion again.
 
Dooley said:
That's very sad and all... but I would think taking any addictive chemical every day for 2 years would pretty much cause some internal distress. That's just my opinion again.
Click to expand...

Makes sense to me...
 
Daeo,

I respect your opinion bro. You're one of the luck ones.....BTW, it took 2.5 years before I started to use it every day....before that I only used it once in awhile.....so you're not off the hook yet ;) ahhaha Just let me know if you ever have a problem with it....I would be glad to help you out. Trust me....people are not crying wolf here. When they say that the shit is bad and is a painful expereince, they are just not being a bunch of pussies! It really sucks!!!!!!


I get a kick out of everyone saying, be smart about using and don't use too much. hahaha.....do you think people ever set out to become dependant on drugs? Hell no!....they just think that they can control their drug use. (Some can....some can't) point is, you don't know if you're one of those that can't until it is too late! You trick yourself into thinking "I don't need to use it, I just want to use it"

Just warning people the way that I wish that I was warned. I think that you get my point....

Take care Daeo......and good luck to you.
 
Gman said:
Be forwarned.. My friend developed CHRONIC PANCREATITIS from drinking GBL almost everyday for over 2 years.. he was not a drinker of alcohol (since he had his G) When he was taken to the hospital they asked him if he drank alcohol, he said no, told them that he drank GBL reguarly.. His doc concluded that his pancreatits was caused by the GBL - the body uses the same enzyme to break down GBL as it does alcohol.. as a matter a fact they claim that it took 100x more of the enzyme to break it down causing excessive stress on the pancreas, which caused a pancreatitis.. and that my friends if NOT something you want to live with.

Everyone thinks out kidneys and liver, but don't forget there are lots of other organs in your body..

Gman
Click to expand...

i'm leaving this up for the more knowledgeable people out there, but that's the first incident i've ever heard of someone developing pancreatitis. NOW, are we saying the pancreas is breaking it up or the liver, because as far as i've read, GBL is MUCH easier on the liver than alcohol.
Fonz, Macro Huck?? anyone wanna shed light on this??? interested to hear their side of what happens.
 
the KEY to these types of drugs is moderation
I have several points to make here.
1- moderation is great, but if you are and addict, moderation is not possible(Probably opening a can of worms) with 1,4 GBL or GHB. If our an addict, use something else. there are few worse choices available
2-1,4 GBL, and GHB are all GABAnergic drugs. They all potentiate GABA, such as benzo's (xanax, valium, clonopin etc), and selective benzos like Ambien and Sonata.
3- These 3 drugs all have short have lives 2-4 hours and produce marked physical dependance easily. This results in risk of seizure every 2-4 hours if addicted, and its easy to get addicted.Not fun.
4- because of the short half life, it is a poor sleep aid. It interferes with REM sleep and though it may put you to sleep, if you have a sleep problem, you will wake up when it wears off 3 hours later.
5- 1,4 butanediol metabolizes to a large extent into ethylene glycol (antifreeze). This compounds the CNS damage that GHB would cause. People who spend enough time regularly using 1,4 may need an antiseizure like depakote, tegretol or dilantin just not to shake for a long time after use is discontinued.

Basically my point is, these are dangerous drugs. Why fool with such drugs, even if you can moderate when there are better choices. I just dont want to see bros go down from this shit.

The best drug for sleep if you are not an addict is ambien or sonata. they dont interfdere with REM and give you quality sleep. They also are short acting so dont leave you hungover. But they too have a pretty high addiction liability.
 
Grainger said:
Daeo,

I respect your opinion bro. You're one of the luck ones.....BTW, it took 2.5 years before I started to use it every day....before that I only used it once in awhile.....so you're not off the hook yet ;) ahhaha Just let me know if you ever have a problem with it....I would be glad to help you out. Trust me....people are not crying wolf here. When they say that the shit is bad and is a painful expereince, they are just not being a bunch of pussies! It really sucks!!!!!!


I get a kick out of everyone saying, be smart about using and don't use too much. hahaha.....do you think people ever set out to become dependant on drugs? Hell no!....they just think that they can control their drug use. (Some can....some can't) point is, you don't know if you're one of those that can't until it is too late! You trick yourself into thinking "I don't need to use it, I just want to use it"

Just warning people the way that I wish that I was warned. I think that you get my point....

Take care Daeo......and good luck to you.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the concern, but I think I'll be ok. I think I can talk myself out of using it 24/7 for months on end...
 
Bad Bad Stuff

About 3 weeks ago I'd have gotten on here and flamed everyone of you guys who trashed talked the Gamma-OH, but recently I've had some profoundly negative experiences. Sunday night I took a bunch, and then after I started coming down I took a bump, and then a little later I drank what was left of my glass of orange soda and passed the fuck out mid stride. The fact of the matter was that it wasnt my glass it was lord suston's glass, and I was in some deep deep shit. My breathing was all fucked up and I woke up like 3 hours later (after 3 hours of having my vitals checked by a friend standing by with injectable clen, horse grade epinephrine and some homeade concoction of liqiud benzodiazapines in case shit got worse). I felt sicker than ever before and I have drunk myself into a vomitous mass quite a few times. The moral of this story, this stuff can be dangerous if you get sloppy. Also if you are gonna get fucked up and clean your apartment.....Red Bull and Tequilla instead(the recipe for cheque drops BTW)

The second important thing to note. The fucking Irish kid who lives with us (yes we just refer to him as "the fucking Irish Kid") was addicted pretty badly to codiene for a while and a few years ago he stopped his heart and got the paddles. His GF broke up with him 2 weeks ago and he decided to try 1,4 (without my knowledge). SO the other guys showed him how to dose it, and told him the importance of not drinking it. All seemed well except in 14 days that dumb shit sucked down upwards of 40ml. Think about this, I mean yeah he was getting fucked up once a day at work and once at night but seriously. Can we say addicction? I think G has a high rate of cross addiction with narcotic drugs. Anyway once I woke up puking we took a vote to lock that shit up from that kid, bad news.

Also I havent seen GBL for sale anywhere over the net lately. Does anyone know of a LEGAL (not a source post) place to get that stuff. We bought a gallon of 1,4 right before it got hard to find and after that fucking irish kid got his hands on it we are running a little low.
Laterz
 
Primal X said:
2ml: anti-depressant
3ml: clubbing
4ml: sleep
5ml: barf up everything you ate that day
Click to expand...

This dosing is close to what works for me although I've never taken enough to get to the barfing stage -- don't intend to. I'd say experiment for yourself though -- dosing of this stuff is different for every body. 2.5ml is a pleasant buzz but 3ml puts me to sleep.

2.5 ml Once or twice a week (tops) instead of alcohol has worked for me just fine. The key here is if you're using it to escape from life in general or to just get a nice no-calorie buzz on with friends. I haven't had any trouble with sleep patterns. I doubt if I use enough of it to make an impact.
 
think gman was referin to

TraxZBT said:


i'm leaving this up for the more knowledgeable people out there, but that's the first incident i've ever heard of someone developing pancreatitis. NOW, are we saying the pancreas is breaking it up or the liver, because as far as i've read, GBL is MUCH easier on the liver than alcohol.
Fonz, Macro Huck?? anyone wanna shed light on this??? interested to hear their side of what happens.
Click to expand...



1,4-----1,4 will fuck up your insides,gbl is safe it is less work for your liver than alcohol,but this 1,4 shit is used for makin car bumpers .....it is used to make injection moldings like car bumpers.................on bolex there is a chemist who knows his shit on all the "g" its ganaboy2k1 and he told me 1,4 eats you from the inside out,litterally when used daily...................once a week probably ok ......the human body is tough,but pay the extra for real gbl, safe as can be..................unless you start takin it every hour on the hour...............thats how it gets a bad rap................people abusin it and then cryin about it................gbl is safe....................1,4=eventual problems.................just my 5ius worth peace kc
 
after having two of my closest friends g-out bad enough to where they were hospitalized in the last 2 weeks. I really feel the quality of G in the last year or so since it became a controlled substance has declined greatly. THe 1, 4 bute is shit G. IT gives me a cracked out buzz and is alot harder to regulate .... after hearing that it eats your insides my thoughts are............

FUCK 1,4
 
the 1,4 I get is almost tastless. the GHB and GBL floating around out there is enough to make you puke from it's horrible taste. you tell me what one you think has more impurities?
firstenrgy
 
Re: think gman was referin to

caseyviator said:




1,4-----1,4 will fuck up your insides,gbl is safe it is less work for your liver than alcohol,but this 1,4 shit is used for makin car bumpers .....it is used to make injection moldings like car bumpers.................on bolex there is a chemist who knows his shit on all the "g" its ganaboy2k1 and he told me 1,4 eats you from the inside out,litterally when used daily...................once a week probably ok ......the human body is tough,but pay the extra for real gbl, safe as can be..................unless you start takin it every hour on the hour...............thats how it gets a bad rap................people abusin it and then cryin about it................gbl is safe....................1,4=eventual problems.................just my 5ius worth peace kc
Click to expand...

5 months ago I would have laughed at this post but after me being a cheap fuck and grabbing a bunch of 1,4 instead of G, my body I believe has been fucked up....This 1,4 shit did something to my nerve ending or something but I have not been the same since using this crap. Take it for what its worth and listen to DRRman---use the real G and stay away from 1,4----
 
firstenrgy said:
the 1,4 I get is almost tastless. the GHB and GBL floating around out there is enough to make you puke from it's horrible taste. you tell me what one you think has more impurities?
firstenrgy
Click to expand...

Impurities aren't the problem with 1,4. It's the chemical reaction in your body that's harmful. I've used 1,4 before and can tell something is wrong. Use GHB for gods sake. Using 1,4 because of the legality is stupid...
 
Grainger, 1/4 and gbl are not the same thing.
I personally think that prolonged use of gbl/ghb/1/4 and just about anything else is not good. Use the shit for partying, not every night, every once and a while, just like you would booze. Would you use vodka everynight to sleep, LOL, I dont think so.


I am so damn tired of hearing people talk smack " bro stay away from that shit, it will kill you, I personally know 15 people who have died from that shit" You have to be kidding!

ORCA
 
goodfellas said:
Do any of you guys ever take 1,4 as a club drug? Or mainly just to fall asleep?
Click to expand...
took it as both---

started out at 3mls to sleep and worked my way up to close to 7-8 mls at night---just way to much----stick to the real mcCoy---your body will thank you
 
I know ghb is the real thing, but it is hard to come by. 1,4 is much easier to get. I use 1,4 as a sleep aid, only now and then, and it works great. 3-4ml does the trick for me.
 
Hey Orca FUCK OFF!!! No shit they are not the same thing! I have a masters in biochem. I'm not bragging or saying that it means anything significant but chances are, it is more of a background than YOU have. I have been using GHB since 88! You were probably not even in high school then!.....you are probably still living at home with your mother now!

I was young and stupid like you at one point too so I guess I shouldn't blame you too much but I just post my experiences with the shit to give people a different side of the coin. If you don't like, TOO FUCKIN bad! Can't blame me for not wanting people on this board to get hurt?!?! I only post on thing that I have personal or professional expereince with. I was always pro G, in fact I tried to get Abbott Laboratories to come out with GHB as a drug for many years!

I am sick of listening to people like YOU talking about how SAFE the shit is as long as your "safe" about using!! What the fuck do you know?!??!?!


I GET SUCH A KICK OUT OF LAY PEOPLE TALKING ABOUT CHEMISTRY.....OR PEOPLE THAT HAVE NO CLUE ABOUT DRUG ADDICTION TALK ABOUT HOW TO "USE" PROPERLY!
 
Last edited:
You are right grainger, it is NOT safe, its a very dangerous drug to say the least, but with proper judgement and the proper usage, it can have its good qualities. I just had a friend die last week from GHB, so its definitely not safe. But listen people, i do KNOW this, 1,4 is MUCH MUCH worse on your body than gbl, or ghb. and gbl and ghb are not two totall diffferent drugs. Shit, if you have gbl, all you have to have is sodium hydroxide and water and you can have GHB! its that simple people, GHB is GBL and NaOH. I don't have scientific proof to tell you 1,4 is BAD, but i have personal experience and friends experiences with it, so just STAY away from it, and another thing
GBL is very easy to get online, its just like steroids, all you people want to jump on a site put your credit card number in and have it delivered, well its not always that easy, but if you look hard enough, GBL can be found, and NaOH is perfectly legal to buy, its just lye, then get you some scales, a beaker, and some ph strips and GHB is one step away.
 
DRRman said:
You are right grainger, it is NOT safe, its a very dangerous drug to say the least, but with proper judgement and the proper usage, it can have its good qualities. I just had a friend die last week from GHB, so its definitely not safe. But listen people, i do KNOW this, 1,4 is MUCH MUCH worse on your body than gbl, or ghb. and gbl and ghb are not two totall diffferent drugs. Shit, if you have gbl, all you have to have is sodium hydroxide and water and you can have GHB! its that simple people, GHB is GBL and NaOH. I don't have scientific proof to tell you 1,4 is BAD, but i have personal experience and friends experiences with it, so just STAY away from it, and another thing
GBL is very easy to get online, its just like steroids, all you people want to jump on a site put your credit card number in and have it delivered, well its not always that easy, but if you look hard enough, GBL can be found, and NaOH is perfectly legal to buy, its just lye, then get you some scales, a beaker, and some ph strips and GHB is one step away.
Click to expand...



OOoo don't use lye.... lye is mainly sodium hydroxide WITH many impurities and other metals... get USP grade NaOH or KOH.. if anyone needs links to sites that have it, shoot me an email but for the love of God, don't use lye. Almost the same thing as using drano....
 
Primal X said:
2ml: anti-depressant
3ml: clubbing
4ml: sleep
5ml: barf up everything you ate that day
Click to expand...

that is about right for me too. but it seems to vary from person to person. also how much food you have in your stomach is a big determining factor. first time people I always say stsart at 2ml and work up until you figure out what is right for you.
 
quadsweep, i didn't mean it literally, i meant it was "basically" lye, sorry for the confusion, just was trying to get the point across that NaOH was very easily obtainable and perfectly legal, thats it.
 
I think the doc is wrong here, 1,4 is broken down in the same metabolic pathway as alcohol, gbl and ghb are different pathways, that is why I recommend staying away from 1,4 and stick to gbl/ghb if you really must use the stuff.

==============================================

Gman said:
Be forwarned.. My friend developed CHRONIC PANCREATITIS from drinking GBL almost everyday for over 2 years.. he was not a drinker of alcohol (since he had his G) When he was taken to the hospital they asked him if he drank alcohol, he said no, told them that he drank GBL reguarly.. His doc concluded that his pancreatits was caused by the GBL - the body uses the same enzyme to break down GBL as it does alcohol.. as a matter a fact they claim that it took 100x more of the enzyme to break it down causing excessive stress on the pancreas, which caused a pancreatitis.. and that my friends if NOT something you want to live with.

Everyone thinks out kidneys and liver, but don't forget there are lots of other organs in your body..

Gman
Click to expand...
 
hmm, another budding chemist

who can tell the relative purity of different compounds by there taste! :)


firstenrgy said:
the 1,4 I get is almost tastless. the GHB and GBL floating around out there is enough to make you puke from it's horrible taste. you tell me what one you think has more impurities?
firstenrgy
Click to expand...
 
Re: hmm, another budding chemist

jboldman said:
who can tell the relative purity of different compounds by there taste! :)


Click to expand...

Exactly. And I really don't know what he's talking about either. 1,4 tastes is one of the foulest things I've had the misfortune to taste. The GHB I get on the other hand has virtually no taste to it besides a slightly salty flavor...
 
Flaming Heterosexual said:


Daeo,
Much props to you re: your personal knowledge of G. I've read some really good posts from you.

Now about 1,4 - I get blood work done about 4 times a year. I'm almost exclusively taking 1,4 with a <99.7% assay (I didn't have it tested, it is processed by legit chemical co.). At any rate, my blood work is clean as a whistle.

I do notice some really strong spins that accompany 1,4 that don't happen wth GHB or GBL. I don't have an explaination nor do I have a theory. But I take for the spins. I don't drink so a guy has to have something :)
Personally I don't like GBL, for me it makes me really sedate.

So, bottom line, I respectfully disagree with avoiding 1,4.

FH

---------------------
My Homepage with many USEFUL links ;)
Click to expand...

I must give you credit FH. It's good to see someone who keeps up on themself. I've used 1,4 on occasion before, but prefer GHB. I really don't like the spins and hate puking :D But to each his own. I think internal problems occur when using either 1,4 or GHB for prolonged periods of time. Any way you look at it be careful meatheads. Use that head for something more than growing hair on...
 
(An example of what I am talking about.....)

jboldman -

I would be REALLY interested in hearing the metabolic pathways that you are talking about?!? BE SPECIFIC!


I have money that says you can't....you are simply restating some shit that read on the internet or heard from a friend. you say....

----quote----
"1,4 is broken down in the same metabolic pathway as alcohol, gbl and ghb are different pathways"
--- end quote----

To most people on the board, it might sound like you know what you are talking about.....that same bullshit will be repeated again and it is wrong! That is how so much misinformation has been posted about GHB.

Just like most poeple that don't know shit about nutrition will tell you that it takes weeks to digest red meat and that it just sits in your stomach! PURE BULLSHIT but most people think it.

Hey have a nice day :)
 
all i can say

is i hope gbl is not bad for you in the long run...................but hell,it seems like everything at one time or another causes cancer........well atleast i dont smoke cig,i mean that is basically a death sentence.............they have pretty much proved that:confused: :confused:
 
Re: Re: hmm, another budding chemist

Daeo said:


Exactly. And I really don't know what he's talking about either. 1,4 tastes is one of the foulest things I've had the misfortune to taste. The GHB I get on the other hand has virtually no taste to it besides a slightly salty flavor...
Click to expand...
Unreal! Do you really know what is being sold to people? If you have GHB that is almost tastless than you are fortunate. Have you tried the 1,4 we are speaking of? Fill me in if I am missing something. As you can see I read a lot more than I post. I never talk crap or flame. If you can give me SOLID evidence that the 1,4 I'm taking is worse for me than the GHB that is floating around, I would gladly eat my words. There are so many guys on this board that have information that I can only dream to have. Tell me what's up guys???
firstenrgy
 
Tell you what Grainger

I'll go back and try to dig out my references and you do the same! Let's see which of us is wrong. You DO have references or are you spouting soemthing that you heard somewhere like some college freshman with nothing better to do. How much money ecxactly do you have that says I can not btw????? :)




Grainger said:
(An example of what I am talking about.....)

jboldman -

I would be REALLY interested in hearing the metabolic pathways that you are talking about?!? BE SPECIFIC!


I have money that says you can't....you are simply restating some shit that read on the internet or heard from a friend. you say....

----quote----
"1,4 is broken down in the same metabolic pathway as alcohol, gbl and ghb are different pathways"
--- end quote----

To most people on the board, it might sound like you know what you are talking about.....that same bullshit will be repeated again and it is wrong! That is how so much misinformation has been posted about GHB.

Just like most poeple that don't know shit about nutrition will tell you that it takes weeks to digest red meat and that it just sits in your stomach! PURE BULLSHIT but most people think it.

Hey have a nice day :)
Click to expand...
 
like i said first energy, i am speaking from observations and personal experimentation only, i have taken every precursor under the sun and have made more gallons of GHB than most have ever seen. I just know that for the month i tried some 1,4 i hated it, i felt like shit more and didn't get any of the benefits like GHB. I'll be honest, i don't have a clue what enzymes break down what, but i know how i feel on different substances, and 1,4 didn't do much for me at all. I just don't see why everyone is so wanting this 1,4 shit when GBL is as easy to find as steroids, and the making of real GHB is actually simple??
 
and another thing firstenrgy, if you have GHB that is virtually tasteless, you don't have good GHB, NO GHB tastes good, it should all make you curl your tongue
 
My references are....

Lehninger (The Godfather of Biochemistry!)
and
NTP (National Toxicology Program)


I'm not sure if your a chemist so I don't know how much of this will make sense......

"GHB is first oxidized to acetoacetate, which is activated with coenzyme A donated from succinyl-CoA, then split by thiolase." Lehninger

Thiolase will cleave that succinyl-CoA into two acetyl-CoAs which enters the citric acid cycle ("Krebs")....


" g-Hydroxybutyric acid is a naturally occurring chemical found in the brain and peripheral tissues which is converted to succinate and processed through the tricarboxylic acid cycle. Although the function of g-hydroxybutyric acid in peripheral tissues is unknown, in the brain and neuronal tissue it is thought to function as a neuromodulator. g-Hydroxybutyric acid readily crosses the blood-brain barrier, and oral, intraperitoneal, or intravenous administration elicits characteristic neuropharmacologic responses. These same responses are observed after administration of 1,4-butanediol." NTP

The correct answer is ......

tricarboxylic acid cycle / Krebs / citric acid cycle (all the same)!


Sorry about giving the answer up so soon....I didn't want to take your lunch money.
 
DRRman said:
and another thing firstenrgy, if you have GHB that is virtually tasteless, you don't have good GHB, NO GHB tastes good, it should all make you curl your tongue
Click to expand...

Not true at all. The BEST GHB I've ever had(taste and effectiveness), is the one I currently use. And it has virtually no taste. It's very mild. And it fucks me up bigtime :D If you don't believe me just ask Fonz and Stew meat...
 
Re: Re: Re: hmm, another budding chemist

firstenrgy said:

Unreal! Do you really know what is being sold to people? If you have GHB that is almost tastless than you are fortunate. Have you tried the 1,4 we are speaking of? Fill me in if I am missing something. As you can see I read a lot more than I post. I never talk crap or flame. If you can give me SOLID evidence that the 1,4 I'm taking is worse for me than the GHB that is floating around, I would gladly eat my words. There are so many guys on this board that have information that I can only dream to have. Tell me what's up guys???
firstenrgy
Click to expand...

Yep. It's the same 1,4 we all know. Got it from a well known guy. And scientific data isn't required when YOU can actually tell(by the way your body feels)that something is rotten in Denmark...
 
Well Grainger, we all know that once 1,4bd is converted to GHB it is broken down in the same way, the question is the metabolic pathway that takes it from 1,4bd to GHB and that my friend makes all the difference. I am not a masters degree biochemist, just an ol' country boy trying to make some sense of the state of affairs we find ourselves in here on the boards. I try not to start flame wars, be respectful to others when possible, try to be openminded and give opinions based on my personal experience and on what I believe to be responsible references. This is the information that I was able to find in the first five minutes:

1,4-butanediol, otherwise known as "GHB-Alcohol", is broken down by the same pathway as alcohol, "the alcohol dehydrogenase first converts 1,4-butanediol into the intermediate aldehyde gamma-hydroxybutyraldehyde. This aldehyde then circulates around the body until another liver enzyme, aldehyde dehydrogenase, oxidizes it into GHB"
"Gamma-butyrolactone is an dehydrated form of GHB, normally present in only trivial amounts in aqueous (water) solutions at neutral pH (i.e., in biological fluids). At acidic pH, and in dry environments, the lactone is favored. In aqueous environments, GHB and butyrolactone are in equilibrium with each other, slowly converting back and forth (see Figure B). It may take days for this interconversion to reach equilibrium (i.e., when the rate of lactone hydrolysis into GHB equals the rate of GHB dehydration into lactone)."
GHB(Sodium GHB) is a salt so we can see how that converts to GHB.
So, i summarize, GBL spontaneously hydrolyses to GHB via lactonases(this is me quoting my references), 1,4-BD-enzymatic oxidation by alcohol dehydrogenase to convert to GHB. Note that alcohol dehydrogenase is the same enzyme that breaks down ethyl alcohol. I will list several web sites for references from what I believe to be authoratative sources to reference what I have said since I am not smart enough to think this stuff up myself. I urge everyone to read the references as I think they fairly clearly point out the danger of 1,4-bd compared to the other two.
==============================================
http://www.pharmacy.umaryland.edu/~mpc/Publications/MPC-newsletters/ToxalertOctober2000.pdf

http://www.ijmt.net/3_1/3_1_1.html

http://ceri.com/ghbalt.htm

http://leda.lycaeum.org/Documents/1,4-Butanediol_Toxicity.15209.shtml

These are just afew of the hundreds of references available to anyone interested enough to look for them
 
Last edited:
Ok heres my take. Im getting ready to do a show in 3 weeks and have been using 1,4 every night for the last 9 weeks. I use it because i train at 5 am and i need something i can take to put me to sleep at 8:30 pm and allow me to wake up and not feel groggy or lethargic. I have access to both ambiem and xanax but both make me feel too groggy. I like most have to take 2 doses. 31/2 hours is max sleep time for me and that is taking an initial dose of 5ml. my second dose is usually 3ml. I have done alot of research on 1,4 and i havent found any info that says it could be harsh on the liver. It does say that it could be stressfull to the kidneys and it does make you piss like a wild dog. But I piss atleast 3 times a night anyway so what the hell. I do think that the stuff is probably toxic in some way or another and plan on cutting it out for the most part after my show. ( or get some real ghb) But for now, It does what i need it to do.
 
Daeo said:


Not true at all. The BEST GHB I've ever had(taste and effectiveness), is the one I currently use. And it has virtually no taste. It's very mild. And it fucks me up bigtime :D If you don't believe me just ask Fonz and Stew meat...
Click to expand...


ahhh charcoal processed... makes it almost tastelesss..
 
Did you read my post?

1,4-bdo is converted to ghb by the same metabolic pathway in the liver as alcohol is metabolized. Is alcohol liver toxic? I had a personal experience with bdo since I have access to it by the 55gallon drum! After goingoff cycle for 4 weeks I had a physical and my liver enzymes were high! Damn, I cut out everything even close to liver toxic including clomid, pain killers, everything! Had a retest, my enzymes were still high! I wracked my brain for what was going on, one mornign I woke up with a slight 1,4 hangover and thought that it felt a lot like an alcohol hangover! Bingo, I had been doing bdo every night. Cut out the bdo and magically the enzymes came down to normal range. This caused me to research the pathways accociated with the carious ghb analogues and what I discovered explained what had happened, 1,4-bdo is processed by the liver using the same enzyme as alcohol. Is it toxic in other ways? I am not sure. I see folks reporting that they use 99.7 % pure bdo, I would damn sure want the COA on that find out what the other .03% is, that's a lot of impurities floating around.
 
TraxZBT said:



ahhh charcoal processed... makes it almost tastelesss..
Click to expand...

Oh yeah :drink2: You can actually see little specks of charcoal in some batches. GHB that tastes good. It's almost too good to be true, but it is...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

storyoftheprophet
Aus GH - your source for Domestic Ancillaries and GH
Replies
13
Views
2K
abolone
abolone
Golden_Circle
Approved Log 2025 Testosterone + Masteron Cruise Phase Log
2
Replies
112
Views
11K
the_alcatraz
the_alcatraz
B
[Source] BioPharmaUSA
Replies
13
Views
1K
the_alcatraz
the_alcatraz
Liquid Gold Labs
  • Sticky
Silver Supplier 💎 Liquid Gold Labs Updates + Announcements 💎
Replies
9
Views
2K
pigsy
pigsy
Macedog24
PuritySourceLabs The BEST cardio OUT-OUT product in the sporting realm 🌎🏋️‍♂️WORLD-WIDE 🏋️‍♂️🌎 - By Euro-Pharmacies at PSL NOW local
Replies
0
Views
454
Macedog24
Macedog24
Top Bottom