george halbert...

[cal]

anybody read his column in powermag...?
pretty cool stuff...

well its intresting that he doesnt seem to follow wsb very closely...like his belief (mine too) that speed and power on the bottom come from pec strength...his recommendations...seemed very contrary to louie's dogma...

thoughts...

 

[GRIMMER]

George is a genetic freak ( in a good way) and does things that no one else on this earth can do right now. I would not try to mimick his routines for they are far to advanvced for even most on this board. Just my opinion

 

[powerlifterjay]

Ya i even seen on elitefits that Dave tate actually shot down a movement George does. I believe it was cambered bar on 2 board , or illegal wides , but either way his advice is done do it if you dont wanna lose a pec.

I too believe alot of speed is generated from pec power. I still believe tris are number 1, but some benching needs to be done if your not doing them at all. I mean shirt benchihng is great and i would love to learn the way to get the most poundages ou tof my shirt , but i want raw brute strength as well. And dont think Halbert doesnt raw bench. I was told before the Arnold last year he did a 640 raw at 210lbs. Touch n go.

 

[bigokie]

George is a stud, no matter what anyone says. Now having said that, I would not personally use his routines as he is way more advanced than I am, right now. He still uses a modified westside routine. He still does dyn bench, but he has used 170 pounds of band tension with 225, I don't believe many people can do this, the one exception on this board would be Pljay.

You must remember that he pushed his bench from 475 to 683 using a basic westside routine. It's only after that that he started changing his routine.

I believe that the westisde routine can be changed slightly and not lose any effectiveness. One change that I like is to use flat bench occasionally to stay in the groove.

Just my .02

 

[brianmincher]

If you look at the Q and A over at elitefts.com, you will notice that Dave does not discuss what George does very much, because George is such a freak that he does not fit the mold. The things he does would not work for most people, cause guess what, he is put together out of better materials than most.

That being said, I am always interested in what Halbert has to say. You can' t go wrong taking advice from the best bencher in history, unless of course you try and implement all of what he does. For one thing, Halbert does not squat or deadlift, at all. That has to make a difference in his ability to recover from the insane workouts he does for bench. And I don't think that just cutting out squatting and deadlifting will turn you into George Halbert. George is not used as an example for training because that is like saying, do what Michael Jordan does and you will be able to dunk a basketball from the free throw line. Aint' happenin.

B.

 

[powerlifterjay]

Westside provides a theory and reason. (dam that sounded smart, hope i said it right)! Anyway its the same all of the country you use what works. And if you are new to the sport you dont know really. It takes time to knwo what your capable of. I know a ton on here and all over the interent who use my routine...but one thing that i knwo better then most is what my body responds too. When to say when. Have i dont too much? Do i need more? You can NOT follow a set of reps or sets. Sorry but you cannot. That is what i like most about westside. You go to failure. To a max. The speed...well some need it some dont. I dont do it and i am faster then most people you will see bench anywhere. I promise you that. But i bench. If your not flat benching then hell yes you better hit some speed work. The whole concept of westside makes sense. If it didnt no one would do it. IT works period.

Now that beiing said you still must listen to your body. Chuck Vogalphol when he isnt lifting he is doing grip work or something between sets. He is out of the norm as well. Now why do these too stand out of westside more then others? Because they customize there lifting to their needs. Not what Louie says they need , but what they need. Could I follow George 's routine? Yes i could. Why cause iam not normal. I follow what i need. I would tweak things here and there, but i coudl do it. People who are 100% westside probably would think i am pushing the envelope as well. I use bands dam near every week too. I bench every week. My pecs are strong. Stronger (in my opinion) then those who only do speed work, i will tell you that. Why? I workem. All of you could train this way. But you must listen to your body. If you need rest, rest. Its so simple. Training , powerlifting, eating right, rest its all so easy. Longevity and taking care of yourself is what prolongs your active stay in this sport. George is a freak. No question about it. But i dont see what the huge deal is about what he does for training. His recouperation is fast, alot of ours here is too ...if you knwo what i mean? Guys learn from George, dont be scared to hit them pecs!

I think Kenny Patterson does things i wouldnt think about. Like seated military press in the rack done to heavy singles off a pin. Thats askin for trouble!

 

[Grantsdu]

I just ordered his bench video. I have no idea what I'm in for but I'm going to give it a shot. Anything that has worked that well has to give me some help. Maybe not as much as him but some non-the-less. I will keep everyone informed as far as how the training is going and what have you. I'm not going to give up legs arms and stuff like that though. I will probably modify this myself to as extent. I really need a new workout and this may be exactly what I have been looking for.

 

[bigokie]

Westside is all about modifying your training to make it work for you. George has modified the basic program to work for him. So has Chuck. They still do a lot of what Louie tells them to, they just add in the extra stuff that they know they need. They are the elite of the elite. They know there bodies better than anyone else. It's the same with everyone. You will know your body better than someone you talk to. It just takes some time to learn to listen to it. One thing I try to get past to people is to try the basic westside program for a while before they go changing it. You aren't going to know if something works if you only try it for a month or two. In my own case, using the basic routine laid out by Dave in his BIG, BAD, BENCH article, I added something like 50 pounds to my bench after coming from an injury. So I will keep trying the basic work until it stops working then change it. This may be next month, next year or never. Who knows, only you can decide when your not getting the results you want, at that point change it. That's the great thing about Westside training. It keeps evolving. Since it was started, it has changed immensely.

And as much as some say that the Westside boys don't train there pecks is mistaken. They do timed db presses. Has anyone tried them? My pecks are slightly sore for a day or so afterwards. Any kind of bench will hit your pecks to some degree.

Now having said that, George and Chuck and all the rest broke many plateaus using the basic Westside training. Think about that before you go changing it. How many of us have achieved the numbers that these guys were stuck at before they modified there routines? Very few.

Sorry for the long post, this is my opinion. Take it as you will

 

[CytoMel]

Watching anod westside video with Halbert benching, Louie talks about George's "tremendous thickness" and how big his lats are.

George's thickness along with his chest size makes him very thick from the side view too. That is one of the reasons he is so great.

That is a lesson that I learned too. Blitz your lats and get thicker As an example, my close grip incline max went from 325 to 365 in a few months of getting serious about lats.

For beginners, train your lats and get thicker for a bigger bench. 6 sets a week won't cut it. Try doing 20+ sets a week of lats.

 

[powerlifting USA]

powerlifterjay...

what do you recommend for working the pecs more?

just flat benches? anything else?

and should these be done with wide grip or illegal or anything...or just normal grip?

 

[Hannibal]

For beginners, train your lats and get thicker for a bigger bench. 6 sets a week won't cut it. Try doing 20+ sets a week of lats.

Sounds like the best way to keep Bob from calling you "No Lats".

 

[musclehed275]

When i made my comback, i was still old school, i was scared to death not to do any benching, with the exception of speed benches! I thought my chest would shrink, i wouldnt be able to press shit off my chest etc...Ryan K. got me started and I figured, hell it must work, i did it, and soon i was popping 600+ board presses, and blasting 550+ on the bench with my denim! It works, like everyone said, just modify it to your weaknesses, and youll be fine!!! Plus, my chest is much thicker now than it was when i was bodybuilding!!!

 

[powerlifterjay]

powerliftingUSA

I do flat benches, and the next day i do timed dumbell presses of a stability ball, and i hit tris Max on Thurs. And then again on Fri i hit timed dumbell presses off stability ball. This summer i will do some different things beside straight flat benching. My range of motion will be the same thing but i am gonna add more to the top sometimes, more to the bottom the other times. I got some ideas wanna try.