Frack....why do you think that 9/11 was "sponsored" internally???

[spongebob]

....imo that attack, was not meant to be directed at human life - it was to strike at out financial institutions....

yes to some extent, but that doesnt mean we should disregard or minimize other intentions of his terrorism. remember now, bin laden had declared a jihad on all US citizens in 97. he specifically said that in order for his objectives to be met he must bring his jihad to american soil. he knew that too many people were desensitized by the TV and were not understanding his motivation by previous attacks, the kobar towers and embassies in africa and the USS cole.

bin laden wants US troops and involvement out of saudi(the mecca land) and the middle east. he is a saudi national and was kick out for his radical views. IMO this reasons are for more important to him than the financial aspect of it.

 

[Sinistar]

i think america needs to stop being the worlds fucking police. its not our job to go out into the world and make everything nice and pretty. if the fucking Iraqis cant get a coup together after 30 years they need alot more than help, and from someone else.

and bush is a gutless little wimp. if he had some real balls, he wouldve went to veitnam instead of jumping into the national guard.

so yea bush is pro war, buts he too much of a fucking pantload to fight it himself.

 

[FreakMonster]

I always welcome that challenge, especially from conspiracy theorists.

What I have presented to you is FACT not conspiracy. If you can't see that I refuse to debate with you further as you seem to just want to argue with me for the sake of argueing.

You think it's because of an elaborate gov't conspiracty. I think it's because our PC gov't is afraid of being accused of racism. Which one do you REALLY think is more likely?

Afraid of being accused of racism? OMG Are you fucking kidding me? If that were the case then the FBI would not be interviewing thousands of Iraqi's here in the US.

Nor does it look like proof of a gov't conspiracy.

Conspiracy? Did you even read my link? It's fact!! If you think it's conspiracy then I really think your argueing with me for the sake of argueing. Here is the post in bold to make sure you can see it.
"September the 11th is a direct result of the incompetence of the FBI's International Terrorism Unit. No doubt about that. Absolutely no doubt about that," Wright said. "You can't know the things I know and not go public."

In the mid-1990s, with growing terrorism in the Middle East, the two Chicago-based agents were assigned to track a connection to Chicago, a suspected terrorist cell that would later lead them to a link with Osama bin Laden. Wright says that when he pressed for authorization to open a criminal investigation into the money trail, his supervisor stopped him.

"Do you know what his response was? 'I think it's just better to let sleeping dogs lie,'" said Wright. "Those dogs weren't sleeping. They were training. They were getting ready."

Now explain IN DETAIL how this is racial profiling and a conspiracy?

In your world maybe. People who think with logic do not think the gov't is behind Sept. 11. I don't trust the gov't either but I guess I will be forever dumb in your eyes because I can distinguish fantasy from reality.

I think your the one who is not thinking with logic. I have presented you with nothing but facts from FBI agents who admitted on National Telvision that their supervisor stopped them from opening investigations on suspected terrorist cells with links to Al-Queda. I think your the one living in a fantasy buddy!!!!

What website did you cut and paste that from? Sources please?

Website? It's common knowlege. Why don't you spend some time researching instead of spewing out crap from your mouth?

Yes, you can thank thirty years of liberal emasculating and immigration.

Wow we are blaming immigration now? LOL keep backtracking and telling yourself that.

 

[FreakMonster]

1. this was in the mid 90's when they were told that. are you suggesting that clinton's admin was in on it to???

No, I'm saying that this investigation could have lead to preventing 9-11. Why are you just looking for little things to pick apart when it's obviously right in front of your face. If your arguement is just that this investigation was in the mid 90's then lets look at a more recent letter from 2002 by Veteran FBI Agent Colleen Rowley to FBI Director Robert Mueller. http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,249997,00.html

 

[FreakMonster]

Dude, what are you doing? You are proving my point and disproving yours.

LOL, you are just getting ridiclous!! Are you telling me that a Muslim agent refusing to investigate a fellow Muslim who is a terrorist is racial profiling?

 

[FreakMonster]

1. freakmonster, yes everything could have been prevented hypothetically. thats a no-brainer! given the condition of the intelligence community and thier lack of financing and human intelligence abroad, standing procedures within the airlines industry, standing procedures within the US govt regarding hi-jacked airliners, and the highly incompetent immigration services it is extremely easy to pull off what bin laden did. given everything i just said i bet i could offer up 3 times as many people who all agree it could not have been prevented.

Yes hypothetically everything could have been prevented but it is so obvious that national security and intelligence officials negligently mishandled counterterrorism operations. The above conditions that you gave could have been part of the incomptency of the intelligence agencies but a big part of that was also the CIA knowing in advance the activities of future hijackers. Tenet even testified this in 2002. Don't you think that if we would have followed through on all these investigations that 9-11 could have possibly been prevented?

2. my opinion is that when arlen spector makes a comment like that, that he is referring to exactly what i am talking about, yes it could have been prevented if the proper tools were in plces. he is not implying that someone let it happen. he is referring to the breakdown within our intelligence community. so taking his qoute out of context and drawing a conclusion from it is rediculous.

He is not referring to what your talking about. Did you even read the damn article? FBI headquarters thwarted Minneapolis agents seeking a FISA warrant to search Moussaoui's laptop computer and belongings before the attack. How is this a breakdown? LOL
And he is not the only person who has made similiar comments.

3. TWC was not the first attack that showed a lack of actual intelligence gathering and not interpretating it sufficiently by our intelligence community. and who said they were the best in the world? you?

So what's your point? We are talking about the prevention of 9-11 not other terrorist attacks.
It's well known we have one of the best intelligence agencies, I can't believe you would think otherwise.

 

[spongebob]

No, I'm saying that this investigation could have lead to preventing 9-11. Why are you just looking for little things to pick apart when it's obviously right in front of your face. If your arguement is just that this investigation was in the mid 90's then lets look at a more recent letter from 2002 by Veteran FBI Agent Colleen Rowley to FBI Director Robert Mueller. http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,249997,00.html

well correct me if i am wrong but i was under the impression that you believed 9-11 was strickly tied to the bush admin. i was just asking if you thought clintons admin could have been involved. now are you saying that it was an intelligence conspiracy?

i am looking for little things to pick apart because thats what you do when you deconstruct an arguement. if you pick apart enough of the pieces then the conspiracy will be debunked.

just like the post you made earlier about arlen spector as to imply he meant someone let it happen. that simply wasnt the case.

as far as the rowley letter, i will read it later and reply. its late.

 

[FreakMonster]

well correct me if i am wrong but i was under the impression that you believed 9-11 was strickly tied to the bush admin. i was just asking if you thought clintons admin could have been involved. now are you saying that it was an intelligence conspiracy?

i am looking for little things to pick apart because thats what you do when you deconstruct an arguement. if you pick apart enough of the pieces then the conspiracy will be debunked.

just like the post you made earlier about arlen spector as to imply he meant someone let it happen. that simply wasnt the case.

as far as the rowley letter, i will read it later and reply. its late.

No I never pinned 9-11 on Bush. Mishandling of terrorist investigations have been going on since the Clinton Administration. I'm not saying it was a conspiracy. It was a mishandling, incompetency, obstruction, and failure to properly investigate terrorists directly linked to Al-Queda.

You try and pick apart my argument but you don't seem to be reading anything I post. Your arguements seem way off.

 

[spongebob]

The fact is that 9-11 could have been easily prevented. Why did our gov't repeatedly ignore warning of the Twin Tower Attacks and why were FBI agents constantly told not to pursue suspected terrorists? We even had a Muslim agent refuse to wear a wire tap on a suspected terrorist. All this leads me to believe that there were some corrupt people within our gov't with a agenda.

this sounds like you believe there was a conspiracy on some level.

 

[spongebob]

No I never pinned 9-11 on Bush. Mishandling of terrorist investigations have been going on since the Clinton Administration. I'm not saying it was a conspiracy. It was a mishandling, incompetency, obstruction, and failure to properly investigate terrorists directly linked to Al-Queda.

You try and pick apart my argument but you don't seem to be reading anything I post. Your arguements seem way off.

1. so you are saying it was a systematic failure and not at all a conspiracy at any level?

2.lol. you presented a qoute taken out of context by arlen spector and used it to bolster your arguement and at the same time apparently didnt read the entire article or failed to comprehend it in its entirety. i pointed it out and my arguements are way off?!? ok, whatever!