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final word on ALA ...

Wanker your math and your reasoning are both WAY off.
First you say. "Well folks, be aware that if you plan the R-ALA at a gram a day, then you best order three bottles or $60 for a months supply, and don't forget the shipping, lets round it to $65 order for 30 days. "
You’re missing one of the biggest advantage of using r-ALA. YOU DON'T NEED THAT MUCH of the r-ALA. You only need to use 300mg to get the same results you would with 1000mg of the Racemic. Which means your monthly cost is $20 not $65.
Where do you get this $570 price that you think it costs? Yes r-ALA costs 3 times as much AT THE RETAIL LEVEL you moron the wholesale level is even higher, but again you miss the point. You are trying to compare buying in bulk from a discount supplier with buying a bottle. There are those who save money brewing their own beer, making their own bread and changing their own oil. But most of us don't chose to spend our time that way. If you do that's your business but you have no clue what it costs to produce and sell a product to the public and that’s very evident by your posts.
You think companies can sell something and still pay credit card fees, buy labels, bottles and lab tests AND BUY PRODUCT LIABILITY INSURANCE, and run a website all for free. I don't see any of those costs in your figures. Why? You are very uninformed.
If you want to buy r-ALA in 10 kilo buckets and make your own caps, have fun.

u4ik
What it really shows is that you've done no research. But I think you should do just that. Then if you buy milk thistle to protect your liver you will have purchased the 3 most useless products being sold.
 
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ulter said:
u4ik
What it really shows is that you've done no research. But I think you should do just that. Then if you buy milk thistle to protect your liver you will have purchased the 3 most useless products being sold.

Nice retort. :rolleyes: Why would I buy milk thistle when I take plenty of ALA. It would be like buying HMB to stop muscle catobolism, when I already take plenty of l-glutamine.

You're right on the research. I will read more on Lipoderm-Y and Yohimburn on this very site. After that I will research 1-AD on Testosterone.net. :FRlol: :FRlol: :FRlol:
 
"Nice retort. Why would I buy milk thistle when I take plenty of ALA. It would be like buying HMB to stop muscle catobolism, when I already take plenty of l-glutamine.

You're right on the research. I will read more on Lipoderm-Y and Yohimburn on this very site. After that I will research 1-AD on Testosterone.net. "

OK bro you do that.
 
macrophage69alpha said:
problems with your "solution".. though it may appeal to some.. as it does cost less...

a. you have to buy a kilo- 300 days worth at high end dosages

a1. higher intial cost.

b. you have to cap your self...ie time

b1. most people can cap about 100 caps an hour.. this is a cost.. but will depend on how much time is worth..

c. you have to buy caps-- cost about 45$-60$ for 3000

obviously R-ala is intended for those that want to get the best results with minimal dosage (perhaps avoiding potential sides)..

S-ala has been shown to increase insulin production
S-ala has been shown to counteract R-ala is SOME tissues


S-ala MAY.. stress may.. decrease life expectancy (in rats. )
R-ala, on the other hand, has been shown to increase it(in rats)

those are just some of the reasons..

though if monetary cost alone is the issue.. it is a good idea for those with extra time and patience for capping and either sharing caps or using high amounts..


note- high ala dosages (which are necessary with the racemic to get the same results as the R) deplete BIOTIN.. so be sure to add some to diet.. it may deplete others.. but cannot say for sure.

so where would you reccomend on buying the r-ala ? from anabolicfitness or some other brand ? is jarrows formula racemic ALA too ? ...

thanks for all the inputs guys ... at least i know both sides of the coin regarding racemic and pure r-ala ...
 
at this time AF is the only one carrying r-ala..

jarrow MAY be carrying it soon... there are conflicting reports.. they put out the paper, but no product yet..
 
u4ik_RAGE said:
Hmmm... the R-ALA is certainly a tempting deal, but I think I will continue purchasing 36 grams in caps for $15. :p :p
It works great for me and helped me get into ketosis really quickly and works great on my refeeds.

racemic ALA works.. there is little question.. the point is that s-ala which makes up at LEAST half (for various reasons often more) of racemic ALA has negative effects including increasing insulin production (which may make deposition of fatty acids more likely during the carb-up as well as decreasing lipolytic effect.. though of course not more than the positive.. but there is still diminishment)

other issues.. with racemic you have to use more to get the same effect depleting BIOTIN as well as possibly other vitamins (so if you do use racemic be sure to supplement EXTRA biotin.. which most multi's have little of.. for some reason??)

if you are getting it for that price.. you are likely saving about 25-30% (considering dosage comparisons).. but then again if the mixture is not equal amount of r and s... or is older (degradation) then you may be getting less...

basically R is for people that want the best, with the least potential for sides or unwanted effects..

there is little doubt that racemic will work.. though is some areas it is so inferior as to be almost counter due to its S-ala content...
 
Macro,
Most people will be okay on the much more economical racemic but I certainly feel that your product has it's place on the market. The r-ALA is certainly pricey, but at least the extra cost is mainly from production costs.
 
Oh yeah, my multi has 200% of the RDA but I'm sre that's still too low because RDA for B vitamins tend to be very low.

I usually only use ALA for refeeds and to get into initial ketosis, so I don't worry too much of the leaching of the biotin.
 
u4ik_RAGE said:
Oh yeah, my multi has 200% of the RDA but I'm sre that's still too low because RDA for B vitamins tend to be very low.
.

that is strange..Ast's has 20%.. eas mulit blend 56%.. both twin lab dual tabs and their multi caps have 50% of the rda.. their one a day has 100%.. as does natrols..

a couple dont have any.. including absolute nutrition.

it was something to consider and at the dosage being used by some 3g per day for extended periods.. it certainly can be an issue.. not to mention that at that dosage it seems likely to have effects on other vitamin excretion..
 
ulter said:
Wanker your math and your reasoning are both WAY off.
First you say. "Well folks, be aware that if you plan the R-ALA at a gram a day, then you best order three bottles or $60 for a months supply, and don't forget the shipping, lets round it to $65 order for 30 days. "


You seem to have selective memory. It's been mentioned say 100,000 times that lots of people take about 3 grams of common ALA (see FONZ posts) a day, so once again simple math dictates (from your own words)that in order to get the equivlelent amount of R-ALA take 1/3 the amount, or for easy math 3 grams common ala is equiv to 1 gram r-ala.

I based my cost comparison on available data, since I recently purchased a kilo of common ala at $190 and using mac's formula 3 x expensive determined that amount and concluded the $570 per kilo range. Now if one takes mac's even more than three times comment, lets add $130 and make it an even $700 a kilo for a bulk buy at a discount dealer.

So in conclusion, if one takes 1 gram daily of r-ala to compensate for the 3 grams they we're taking of common, then one will need 30 grams for 30 days, in order to get 30 grams, one must purchase three bottles.

What is somewhat surprising is that you call me wanker, yet do not dispute the math. Also Mac informed the potential price point and thus showed that there is some wiggle room. It's supply and demand pure and simple, price will remain until which time competition sees they can also profit from handling this product.

As i said much earlier, I will reconsider R-ala once price comes down. It's nothing personal and it is my opinion

SirwanksAlot
 
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