Femera/letro for progesterone gyno

[natty4life]

How about trouble getting a boner???.... Test will make you horney but you need the help of Estrogen to work the mechanics...

+ The water retention cause by Estrogen and the increased strength that comes from it is a factored aswel. I have done d-bol with and without using Anti-E's . I can tell you from personal experience that the D-bol without any Anti-E use got me bigger and stronger quicker than while using Anti-Es.




-BRR

Letro is supposed to KILL your libido, but I've never had that problem. Only thing I can say is my sex "drive" is a little more under control while on Letro..............but when the time comes, - it's all-systems-go

 

[Mr.X]

Hmmm.....

I was under the impression that A-dex lowered IGF leves while Aromasin actually increased them. I had no idea about Letro.
-BRR

Here is what I wrote about nolvadex, I couldn't find the link at first. This is a common myth that spread like fire - you got guys parroting it like crazy saying they got 'reduced' gains on nolvadex.

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showpost.php?p=6177278&postcount=13

 

[hankes64]

Estrogen helps with natural IGF-1 levels and lubrication of joints so having it at 0 is not a good idea, you want it around normal as you can get it.

Also, progesterone does not work unless there is estrogen present, so using a SERM that targets the glands like tamoxifen then you will be fine

 

[Mr.X]

I had no idea about Letro.

-BRR

Speaking from experience, I haven't seen a loss of gains on letrozole - minus the bloat of course . Even people who I've helped get rid of their gyno with higher letro dosages, still had good results on their cycles. If there is a negative IGF effect, it would be minor, as many users have gotten great results with letrozole.

 

[Big Rick Rock]

BTW-

I do think that Anti Estrogens are a bit overated as far a BB goes. Before the year 2000 People were doing just fine using Proviron, Masteron and Nolvadex... Now we have to sit here and debate about it? There have been NO new steroids made since what 1960's... Where did this new need for Anti-Estros arise??? I was here on this forum back in 2000 and I remember people where doing just fine using Nolvadex to keep from getting Gyno and drinking a lot of water to keep from getting bloated... Why do we now NEED new drugs to deal with the same steroids our granparents used???


-BRR

 

[macrophage69alpha]

its true that using 2 dht derivatives will help many people avoid gyno- it will also obliterate a lot of peoples hair. Nolva does not work with progestins, since many of the newer drugs in use are progestins.. its an issue....


people got wicked gyno before... hence the gyno specialist practices that sprung up in the late eighties and early nineties and the number of people using steroids has greatly increased.

though agree that DHT decreases ER expression, which can help with bloat and gyno.

 

[Mr.X]

BTW-

I do think that Anti Estrogens are a bit overated as far a BB goes. Before the year 2000 People were doing just fine using Proviron, Masteron and Nolvadex... Now we have to sit here and debate about it? There have been NO new steroids made since what 1960's... Where did this new need for Anti-Estros arise??? I was here on this forum back in 2000 and I remember people where doing just fine using Nolvadex to keep from getting Gyno and drinking a lot of water to keep from getting bloated... Why do we now NEED new drugs to deal with the same steroids our granparents used???


-BRR

IMO, Anti Estrogens were too little too late. There are many bodybuilders back in the day who had hypertension and bad gyno cases. I've trained with 4 guys who at least had 1 gyno surgery per person, and I've personally had 2 gyno surgeries. All from the "old-school" ways of no anti-Es. When I started training and cycling, it was all about the cycles...little was known about anti-Es. Thus, I developed my first case of gyno; had surgery...only to have another case of gyno spring up. This is all due to the lack of anti-Es on the market at the time and the lack of knowledge.

I think Anti-Es are crucial to cycles and should never be overlooked.

 

[Big Rick Rock]

its true that using 2 dht derivatives will help many people avoid gyno- it will also obliterate a lot of peoples hair. Nolva does not work with progestins, since many of the newer drugs in use are progestins.. its an issue....


people got wicked gyno before... hence the gyno specialist practices that sprung up in the late eighties and early nineties and the number of people using steroids has greatly increased.

though agree that DHT decreases ER expression, which can help with bloat and gyno.

You said "newer drugs in use" what are we talking about exacly? As far as I can tell (aside from the Prohormone Fad) There are no new anabolic steroids to speak of...


Well... You were here back in the day when Arimidex was $10 per 1mg pill... How many people were really getting a type Gyno that Nolvadex couldn't cure???


-BRR

 

[natty4life]

You said "newer drugs in use" what are we talking about exacly? As far as I can tell (aside from the Prohormone Fad) There are no new anabolic steroids to speak of...


Well... You were here back in the day when Arimidex was $10 per 1mg pill... How many people were really getting a type Gyno that Nolvadex couldn't cure???


-BRR

Oh, man................don't even remind me of the old price for Arimidex tabs................it was REDICULOUS.....

I've done cycles in the past with DBol/Test, etc and no AI.
I drank 2+ gallons of water/day - did cardio every day - and ate foods with no added sodium, etc.

I can say that the bloat was minimal, but it was a pain in the ass cause eve one cheat meal/week would bloat me for 2 days................

 

[macrophage69alpha]

You said "newer drugs in use" what are we talking about exacly? As far as I can tell (aside from the Prohormone Fad) There are no new anabolic steroids to speak of...



-BRR

trenbolone
t-bol
EQ- pretty much since 50mg/ml was all that was around