Do we keep Gains - Or is it vicious cycle

[black sheep]

I have just finished up my first ever bulking cycle, and I am in clomid therapy now. Here are my questions. When You read the "Effectivness" charts on different AS they say that (For instance) D-Bol is a 8 out of 10 for Size, but a 1 out of 10 for keeping gains. Now most are like this (Except Growth!). So why do bulking Cycles if you will loose 90 of what you put on. I don't want to do juice twice a year for ever, I want to do a few cycles to get where I want, then I would like to work hard at maintaining the size with good diet, protein shakes, and Creatine Glutamine. I am Talking Creatine (Phospagen HP) with the clomid, and I will continue on the creatine untill my Jan 1st Bulking Cycle, I train Hard, Eat alot, and deserve to keep this hard earned Muscle. Hell I have worked harder at getting It than the "Natural" people! So any and all input on the subject, including Tips, tricks of the trade, etc. Lets keep this up top as Everyone wants to KNow!!

 

[J-Ro]

I don't think those chart are all that accurate in the "keeping gains" section.

 

[Lao Tzu]

you will keep most of your gains if this is a first cycle, you used injectibles & you used clomid or HCG.


try 2 week cycles (with 4 weeks off between them) of testosterone propionate, trenbolone acetate & dianabol. after 3 cycles you should be 25-30 lbs. heavier. if that isn't enough, do a few more with insulin added to the mix. you should come out 35-50 lbs (maybe) heavier. and the muscle should be more permanent.

if you start in 8 weeks, it will take about 26 weeks total. 6 weeks per cycle + final 2 week cycle.

i wouldn't pay attention to the 'lose it all' stuff. if you gain 15-20 lbs, you should keep alot of it.

 

[black sheep]

bumpety bump for more input

 

[gmaninsane]

Gains

Keeping gains depends on a couple factors. Such as what did you use? Androgens or Anabolics or combined? Pill or injection? What was your diet like during and after(post cycle). Did you use clomid properly? Also a very big part is YOUR GENETICS. Give some more info and maybe we can help you out. THings such as EQ , Deca are very keepable gains. Test you keep about 50 percent of gains. Dbol and Abombs arent so great. But once again ifyou stacked with an anabolic you have better chances of keeping. Post cycle take creatine and glutamine. And get lots of rest. Good luck

 

[The Terminator]

I have only done one cycle but I gained 14 lbs. and kept all of it. I did not take creatine during the cycle but loaded it after to keep all gains. If you drop the Phosphagen until after your cycle is finished and take clomid you should be able to keep atleast 85% of what you gain.

 

[macho21]

bump

 

[black sheep]

I did not take the Phophagen during cycle, and I am now done with the cycle. Finished my cutting cycle of Prop and Winny. Took Clomid 3 days after last shot 300MG day 1, 200MG Day 2 and then 50/100/50 for the rest of the 3 weeks. I took Sust 500 and Deca 400 for my Bulking Phase. I gained 16lbs (Diet was not the best in the beginnning. Anyhow I am taking the Phosphagen and Clomid Now. Been off cycle since last Friday...

Thanks