Difference between Str. routine and Size routine?

[lavi]

What are the conceptual differences in a workout routine that gear it towards size rather than strength or strength rather than size?

Frequency, volume, rep range? (I'm pretty sure it's not these from what I've picked up from this board, these are just examples )

And does going for strength mean more "cut" with less size? I know that's mainly about BF %, but bodybuilders for example can have more pounds of muscle but lift less than powerlifters.


Learning = Good

 

[SlavikHavik]

wheather your working for size or strength, it wont make you more cut. that is all diet.

most good strength programs have a size element to them, and as a result are actually superior to most size programs. Ie: in my first 7 months of lifting ive gained 40lbs, and stayed at the same bodyfat. which means about 34lbs of that was solid lean mass. Im up from 170 to 210, and still natural. this wouldnt be possible without real strength training, and recognizing that strength=size. I used westside for the bulk of it and some DC techniques, i got better results with westside but dc was still much better than the shit youll find in flex mags, or any volume program. There is no way in hell i could have gained that much just using a simple one body part per week and a million sets a session program. it just wouldnt happen, and thats why you hear all those whinning natural lifters saying shit like "its impossible to gain more than 10lbs of lean muscle a year without steroids" Horse shit! if they stopped training like they were in the 70's they might realize that. but there stuck in there ways. If you use something like westside your going to hit everypossible muscle fiber and fiber type in your body. what does westside work on? Neuromuscular devlopment, hypertrophy, speed, and physical prepardness. what does a standard "size" program work on? ... hypertrophy... thats it.
even the biggest bodybuilders here, like needsize. incorporate strength training into their programs with things like the 5x5.
This whole strength vs size thing is a joke. If you want to learn about this. read every artricle about the diffrent training styles. go to elitefts.com read every article there about strength training. and come back and then you should understand the diffrences, what the rep ranges are, what works what etc.
theres no need for me to tell it all to you, its all there.

good luck

 

[casualbb]

The best strength programs incorporate a combination of maximal work and explosive strength-speed training at lighter weights. Basically lifting maximal weights will increase maximal strength but make you slow. Speed work increases rate of force production to counter that.

Frequency: low to medium (whatever you can handle)
Volume: medium to high
Rep range: low on both speed work and maximal work

The best hypertrophy programs involve more frequent loading with planned progressive load. Basically muscle growth occurs up to 48 hours after loading but no more. Logically then to be in a state of constant growth one must work a muscle 3x/week. Also muscle tissue adapts to a load such that after a time the load will cease to produce growth. So it it necessary to increase the weights each session. Once one cannot make more progress, take a planned layoff to resensitize the muscle tissue.

Frequency: High
Volume: Low-to-medium per session but medium-to-high over the course of the week
Rep range: varied

 

[chewyxrage]

Good post slavik.

 

[Tweakle]

I've been wondering about this myself. I'm getting increasingly stronger on medium rep ranges but the size just isn't there in proportion to the strength gains. Diet, I dunno I'm stuffing myself 6 times a day but again the scales aren't moving.

Hopefully increased frequency is 'the answer' to this, the hst boys certainly gain off it.

 

[coolcolj]

one word - eccentrics

 

[casualbb]

tweak -- if you're not getting heavier you need to eat even more.

 

[Tweakle]

there's just not enough hours in the day, as it is my entire life seems to revolve around food

I'm junking out more than's healthy just to get up the cals. Yesterday for a 'snack' I combined 2 1/2 lb burgers and a chicken whopper into one mayo drenched monstrosity of a sandwich. And felt hungry 30 minutes later.

 

[casualbb]

hahah I feel ya dude. On the topic of weight gain... actually weight gain is not at all a factor of what routine you do. Sounds odd, but bear with me. Weight gain is related only to your diet. If you overeat by X amount, you'll gain Y weight.

Now where routine fits in is that your routine (or its quality) will determine how much of that added weight is muscle.

 

[Tweakle]

Yeah no doubt - you definitely need to be consuming surplus cals to build muscle, I'm just wondering if I should be eating like an IFBB pro on a bulking cycle. It's not that I'm adverse to gaining a bit of fat but I dont want to end up looking like a lop of shit next spring.

Im getting a LOT stronger in the core lifts so the routine is working, as well as excess food I'm going to do the following -

more frequency - 3 workouts a week on a rotating schedule that has me doing alternate leg/upper body sessions. So everything gets hit 3 times in 2 weeks (any more and I burn out)

slower negatives - gotta try this one

higher reps? - not sure about this. Maybe going for 3 x 5 to 3 x 8-10 might add some more size.

squeezing up the reps - again, not sure about this. A forceful concentric with a low negative should do the same as flexing the weight up pumper style I hope.