Dgugs That improve Athletic Performance

[Flash_75]

Drugs That improve Athletic Performance

An athletes needs are quite different from a body builder. We are more after improving our strength to wieght ratio, explosive power, and endurance than just looking the part. I want to get a thread started regaurding the use of AAS and other drugs that you have knowledge of that improve athletic performance. I would love to here different theories and views on :

-dosing efficiency, like how much is enough and at what point does the anibolism outwiegh the performance benefits.

-Are stimulants really beneficial, and if so, to what type of athlete and when?

-Are EPO and HGH as good as the hype surounding them?

-what do you believe is the best way to maintain the progress you've made when it comes time to discontinue performance enhancers.

-Risks of each.....

I know this subject should really have it's own section, but I thought this might attract more of the athletes looking for information and we can use this forum as such.

 

[Flash_75]

Let's start this off with the subject Testosterone

The highest I've gone with test is 400mg/week. My strength gains were slow but steady. I didn't use an anti-e, which was dumb. The water retention really hindered my evaluation of it's effects - I gained strength but didn't really improve my strength to wieght ratio very much. The mood elevation was unreal. I felt great all the time. My recovery was up, but not like it was with Equipoise at only 200mg/wk. All in all I'd say test has some use, but it may be better suited to power-lifters, or combined at a low dose with other anabolics for motivational purposes.

what do you think?

 

[Thaibox]

This is an excellent idea bro. I'm gonna go do some deadlifts, eat some food, and I'll be back to add my thoughts.

 

[Thaibox]

I'm glad you started this thread. I have two main interests in life- martial arts and bodybuilding. Unfortunately, I don't have the genetics to excel in both simultaneously. Here are my past cycles and results/effects.

1. 10mg D-bol/day.......200mg Deca/wk
My very first cycle, I didn't know what the hell I was doing(I thought I did) but I gained considerable weight(water) then crashed hard and weighed even less when I was done.

2. 500mg sust/wk......40mg Dbol/day(4 weeks)........600mg Deca/wk........actually used clomid and nolva this time and got decent results. However, I took too much Deca and my girlfriend was pissed.

3. Frontloaded 1g Omnadren and dropped to 500/wk
Frontloaded 600 Deca dropped to 400/wk
50, 40, 30, 30mg D-bol 1st 4 wks
50mg Winny last 5 weeks
50mg Proviron throughout to keep my girl happy
Good results but I got sick for about a week, sapping some of my gains.

------------------------------------------------
This is about when I got injured and stopped fighting.
------------------------------------------------
So, determined to get big and strong while I wasn't training, I did the following....

4. Frontloaded 1250 testoviron dropped to 750/wk
Primobolan 400/wk
50mg D-bol 1st 4 weeks
75 Fina/day last 6 weeks
100mg Proviron/day
1mg arimidex
clomid

This was by far my best cycle. I gained quality weight and got broke all strength plateaus. Four weeks into it, the day after I benched 405 I realized that I toasted my rotator, 2 days later I came down with mono, so I had to stop everything. Over the course of three weeks(not eating or sleeping) I lost 20 lbs. I just got back to the gym last week and its pretty sad.

Fighting..............................

My first cycle made me feel a little better when I was training(probably aggresiveness). I think the deca helped with a lot of my little injuries(joints and such). But, I gained a lot of unfunctional weight from the D-bol that I could tell slowed me down. When I crashed after the cycle, I didn't really want to fight at all. D-bol without a decent anabolic and something to use after it(like winny) kinda sucks for sports application

My second cycle was similar to the first, but adding the test helped me out, and I felt amped up to train all the time. I didn't feel any slower this time and my strength was up and I learned quickly how to take advantage of this. Since I used proper clomid therapy, I didnt crash this time and my training only progressed.

My third cycle was similar to the second until I stopped the D-bol and started the Winny. Winny was great, I wasn't retaining any useless water, but my strength was definately up. I could swear that it helped with my stamina as well. I could do drill after drill in and out of the ring, and even though my body was fatigued, my heart was burning for more.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
Clearly, I didn't use juice for the sole purpose of excelling in my sport. I wanted to grow at the same time I was doing tons of cardio in and out of the dojo, which is hard.

If I wasn't concerned with size, but only functional strength. I would probably do some combo of Fina/Winny/anavar/Primo

 

[KAYNE]

THEY'RE ALL CLASSIFIED AS PHYSIQUE/PERFORMANCE ENHANCING SO I GUESS IT JUST DEPENDS ON WHAT YOU ARE TRYING TO DO AND HOW YOU REPSOND TO EACH.



KAYNE

 

[Thaibox]

Re: Drugs That improve Athletic Performance

-Are EPO and HGH as good as the hype surounding them?

I have several friends that have done GH, and were all extremely happy with the results. It is definately something I am looking into. A cycle with GH/slin would be outstanding. I'm just not sure I'm ready to take the risk of slin yet. I need more knowledge and time. A few very well known MMA have used GH successfully. And, the good part about it, is there is no way to test for it yet.


The best way to maintain the progress when its time to quit? Once I knew a decent amount, it wasn't a problem for me. You simply have to become familiar with Clomid, proviron, HCG, etc.

 

[Flash_75]

Hey thai. Glad to see your as interested in performance enhancement as I am.

I am a semi experienced user of AAS. I have done 4 cycles and am in week 14 of an 18 week winny/test cycle.

I am very interested in trying slin. I have alot of knowledge on slin use and can help you find the info you are looking for on proper use, dosing, and duration of use. Slin and creatine is supposed to be AWESOME for strength gains. my reserves on it is the wieght gain. I am 194 @ 7% right now and would rather be closer to 185......so I'm not even considering slin unless I get to 184.

as far as coming off. I know the way the bodybuilders do it, but I'm looking for alternatives to the traditional methods. the stigma of maintaining mass could be the shortcoming of athletes looking for a performance edge. clomid/anastrozle/chastebarry is a definite must when ending any cycle, but what about training to maintain performance? thats the trick.

 

[fhg43]

Re: Drugs That improve Athletic Performance

An athletes needs are quite different from a body builder. We are more after improving our strength to wieght ratio, explosive power, and endurance than just looking the part. I want to get a thread started regaurding the use of AAS and other drugs that you have knowledge of that improve athletic performance. I would love to here different theories and views on :

-dosing efficiency, like how much is enough and at what point does the anibolism outwiegh the performance benefits.

Dosing is tricky as everyone responds differently to medication. and different athletes have different needs. NFL players need to pack on more muscle as much as possible, kick boxers may need just to gain a few pounds of muscle but maintain lightweight for quickness. Endurance athletes need to maintain or add just a little muscle and may just use AAs to facilitate recover (growth or rebuilding). Rule of thumb is more isn't necessarily better and this is difficult for athletes to understand. Taking more test or EPO or amphetamines has serious serious side effects like death or significant bodily harm so it really depends on 1) drug, 2) goals, and 3) athletes response to medication. All are equally important.

-Are stimulants really beneficial, and if so, to what type of athlete and when?[/B]

Yeah but damn they are nasty-any athlete can benefit from stimulants always before competition.

-Are EPO and HGH as good as the hype surounding them?[/B]

EPO-yes probably the important drug ever for endurance athletes. Still the gold standard and more or less undetectable (the tests are pretty inacurate-trust me). HGH-good but general consensus has been it needs to be used with a few other drugs to be really benefitial.

-what do you believe is the best way to maintain the progress you've made when it comes time to discontinue performance enhancers.[/B]

Rest some and let the body recover and then train naturally. Drugs are for training more or less (EPO being the glaring exception). Train hard while on and then rest. Then train hard and use your new found strength/fitness to do harder workouts which will help you progress.

-Risks of each.....[/B]

Stimulants-screw you up good in high doses
EPO, AAS, HGH-look its all going to screw your natural hormonal levels if you use too much so-and EPO in really really high doses can lead to heart stopage

I know this subject should really have it's own section, but I thought this might attract more of the athletes looking for information and we can use this forum as such. [/B]

You could write books on this topic but it is interesting to ponder-

FHG

 

[Flash_75]

I think we should take this 1 drug at a time.

I'll start a new thread entitled Athletic Performance with (drug X) and drug X will vary from thread to thread. this way we can discuss, say testosterone, fully and include others experiences.

 

[Jacob Creutzfeldt]

You are missing out on various nootropics, painkillers, and fast acting androgens like halotestin. I just started taking 1-tes and I know it causes quite an elevation in my agression, so I can only immagine what an androgen like halotestin or cheque drops would do to my agression.

 

[Rather Be Ruggin']

Re: Drugs That improve Athletic Performance

-Are EPO and HGH as good as the hype surounding them?

Did you do any research on EPO?!?!? EPO will put you 6 feet under faster then you can run a 40 yd dash. Not only that, but studies are showing that it can have long term effects on blood cells (primaraly what EPO effects in the first place) , liver, kidneys and other vital organs. I'm sure you missed that though. DON"T DO EPO unless highly supervised by a physician with experiences of EPO.


my experiences with A/S and athletic performance:

working on sprinting and lowering sprint times w/ drug test:

Prop - 200mg taken 4.5 hours prior to training session (only on sprint days)
150mg taken on non sprint days prior to strength training or bed

DBOL- 25mg taken after training



IMO this has been the best cycle that i've done for increasing my sprint times (40yd dash)

 

[Flash_75]

rather be....

EPO is safe if you know what your doing. I definitely wouldn't recomend it to anyone with newbie questions on it.

I havent used EPO. I plan on it though. I train with a heart rate monitor always. I know how to check my blood pressure. I know how to keep my blood "slippery". I have a doctor who is sympathetic, so everything is in place.

I think you missed the point. Does EPO live up to the hype?

I apreciate the input. Why not dbol prior to training? I am real interseted in dbol.

 

[Rather Be Ruggin']

Because using Dbol prior to used will pump your legs up to much and you will not get as much benefit from you training session. Plus, it hurts like a bitch running with a pump.

cheers

 

[Thaibox]

I would compare EPO to insulin. Two of the most significantly beneficial drugs for athletes. Also two of the most dangerous. Neither are for newbies, but if used with knowledge and intelligence can be great.

 

[triguy]

ideas to ponder

Im a good muscle gainer on AAS. Being a triathlete, the dbol/slin/gh cycle just put too much muscle on!

only thing ill try is a halo only cycle. w/ GH 2 i.u.'s EOD

I think the androgens will increase recovery, but no muscle gain.

 

[Thaibox]

Re: ideas to ponder

Im a good muscle gainer on AAS. Being a triathlete, the dbol/slin/gh cycle just put too much muscle on!

only thing ill try is a halo only cycle. w/ GH 2 i.u.'s EOD

I think the androgens will increase recovery, but no muscle gain.

No offense bro, but 2 i.u.s eod isn't going to do dick for you. And GH isn't cheap

 

[fhg43]

Re: Re: ideas to ponder

No offense bro, but 2 i.u.s eod isn't going to do dick for you. And GH isn't cheap

Thaibox-Triguy and I are on the same page as far as what we want from our 'supplements'-neither of us want huge size. So my question is this-what is a good GH dosage for endurance athletes? GH has many benefits and even low doses could be beneficial for an enduro. But I asked a similar question on another board and never got a response. what dosage GH is good for endurance athletes?

FHG

 

[fhg43]

So I have a question but let me preface it:
I know the benefits of GH for bodybuilders and life-extension and I can see how they would apply to other athletes, but:

What specifically does the endurance athlete gain from GH?

Keep in mind that endurance athletes typically aren't looking to gain size (maybe a few KGs of quality muscle) and are very concerned about weight gain.

Increased recovery?

Some muscle gain when stack w/AAS?

Fat loss?

Connective tissue repair?

Relief of chronic joint pain?

What kind of dosage would an endurance athlete run-remember size isn't a concern-?

2-4iu (5/2)? How long?

If the athlete were eating a carbo rich diet would they need to cycle slin or would lots of carbs keep the natural slin response regular?

FHG

 

[rider]

what does everyone think about weight loss drugs for cycling? I have been thinking alot about T3 but I hear its catabolic.. how bad is it? i would trade in a few lbs. of muscle if it took a few lbs. of fat w/ it. I'm a pretty good sized racer as it is so my thinking is that even if i do lose a little strength the weight savings would outweight it. Also, has anyone tried clen? i know thats supposed to work well but i have a hell of a time getting to sleep just on ECA's so I think if i took some clen id be up for a week. Let me know what you all think.

FHG- for the HGH, i think the answer is "all of the above" i've heard of cyclists running HGH at 6-7IU per day during the off season, and they stacked it with insulin. I think you need to no matter what your diet is. You dont even need to stack it w/ other AAS.. it'll put muscle on ya just w/ slin. ill drop you a note in a day or so.

 

[Flash_75]

Hey FHG, great responses. We are definitely on the same wave length. Mass is not the goal. Rather recovery so you can go train intensely EVERY day. We should start a new thread regaurding HGH.

rider T-3 might be OK at lower doses, like less than 50mcg a day. It will lead to overtraining real quick.

Here is what I'd recomend.

AM intervals for one hour every morning on an empty stomach and ECA. don't eat for 1 hr after you finish.

Use 1mg arimidex ed, or eod if thats all you can afford.

I don't like anything that messes with performance, and T-3 at above 50mcg falls in that catagory. I've never used clen because I'd heard ephedrine is just as good and a lot cheaper.

 

[rider]

flash- thanks for the reply.. what will arimidex do for weight loss?? also, would liquidex work? It's pretty much an anti-e right? and you say T3 messes w/ performance, how so? i am slightly afraid of over training as I racked up some huge miles this winter, so maybe the T3 wouldnt be a good idea for a cyclist, i asked because my meat head buddies all got super ripped on it, said it didnt do wonders for their strength though. ok thanks for the help.
rider

 

[road kill]

Rider - Save your money. I tried t3 and clen last summer and it didn't do shit even when I bumped the dosage up to 100 mcg's. It wasn't bunk gear either. I think it has a bigger effect if your fat percentage is high and you have a slow metabolism.

 

[Flash_75]

T-3 is gonna drain you of nutrients and they won't be readily re-supplied. What your doing is so much harder on every system in your body(maybe with an eception to the CNS) than bodybuilding that as athletes we really can't follow the same rules.

 

[fhg43]

re: T3

I was really interested in T3, but was told by a few people that I should avoid it. I did quite a bit of research and felt like I could comfortably use it. A few members I spoke with said it would really hurt my training-the high dosages needed for fat loss would generally hinder my ability to perform athletically. This makes sense. I think it could be catabolic and chew up too much muscle-I don't have much anyway!! I could see how T3 could prevent you from recovering fully and thus leading to declining performance. Somebody said I might benefit from the low 12.5-25mg dosage so may be I'll look into that.

Clen-Obviously works for endurance athletes cause a few guys have been popped! I've heard that ECA works almost as good. I don't know how much clen costs. I wanna know how there is so much floating arounding the US-it is not FDA approved. Well I guess coke isn't FDA approved either and there seems to be quite a bit in the US so....Oh yeah rider if you do get some don't give it to your dog like Vandenbrouke....

HGH-I have heard so many vary experiences with it I wanted to hear more about positive usage in endurance athletes. I raced against a guy last summer who appeared to have been a victim of the Russian school of 'up the dosage'. He had some serious acromegaly-super cromag eyebrow ridge, huge mitten hands, strangely long arms. But damn he was ridiculously strong. I'd kinda like to use some GH just to slow the aging process!! I can already see the lines in my face. Look at Eric Dekker and Scott Sunderland those guys are just in their 30s and the look very very old.

FHG

 

[Thaibox]

Re: re: T3

I don't know how much clen costs. I wanna know how there is so much floating arounding the US-it is not FDA approved. Well I guess coke isn't FDA approved either and there seems to be quite a bit in the US so....

Clen is cheap. T3 is dirt cheap. There's a lot around because its not a controlled substance like gear is.

 

[Flash_75]

Thai is right. T-3 and clen are very affordable. roughly $20 for 100 tabs of 50mcg T-3 and clen can be had for $30 for 100 20mcg tabs.

Clen is easier to get in euroupe than ephedrine. They are both bronchiodialators, which is why they may improve endurance. I wouldn't use either for rides in excess of 3 hrs. For short rides or crit's, It probably can't be beat.

A theraputic dose of HGH is 1iu a day. HGH use slows natural HGH production, so unless your over 30 I'd say save your money. If your over 30 go with 2-4 iu in the afternoon with a 5-on 2-off schedule....I'd take the two off on light days, but thats just me.

I'm falling in love with "Rather be Ruggin"s ideas of quick acting androgens and anbolics. I used fina and got pumps that would literally end a training session. Not too mention I was growing like a weed.

20mg of dbol post training has made the list for my next cycle. DEFINITELY

 

[rider]

Thanks so much for all the info guys, i guess im just gonna have to be tough and not eat. Thats the one diet plan that has yet to fail. Im a little afraid of clen and ECA's because ill most likely get drug tested this year, does anyone know how long these things will hang around in your system? and Flash- What will the arimidex do for weight loss? alright thanks again for all the help.
rider

 

[fhg43]

Thanks so much for all the info guys, i guess im just gonna have to be tough and not eat. Thats the one diet plan that has yet to fail. Im a little afraid of clen and ECA's because ill most likely get drug tested this year, does anyone know how long these things will hang around in your system? and Flash- What will the arimidex do for weight loss? alright thanks again for all the help.
rider

Clen and ECA have very short detectable lives in your body-especially the body of a cyclist or any other endurance athlete. Ephedrine and caffeine can only be detected within hours of use. You could use ECA for weight loss and just not use it on race days. Clen has a longer detection time, but in an endurance athlete I'd say it is like 3-5 days. I've used EC in races and it works, but the next day you are spent. With the EC you can drive your heart so high and reallyt fatigue yourself. I've used it a few times and have been destroyed the next day-but you can go so hard. Basically it allows you to perform at a level you normally can't and then you are super fatigued from it and have problems recovering. I can only imagine what really good amphetamines do to you!

FHG

 

[fhg43]

When the hell do I get an avatar-I have 400 posts!!

FHG

 

[Thaibox]

When the hell do I get an avatar-I have 400 posts!!

FHG

500 bro, almost

 

[Bulk32]

im a 110 meter hurdler, im 6'1 200 lbs. i love this post. my goal this summer is to loose 10-15 lbs. and get ripped to shreds. i got 8%bf. im thinking of hitting up a 6 wk. cycle of Fina 37.5mg ed prop 100mg eod t3ed then Anavar 40mg ed for 4 weeks starting wk. 2 with clomid post cycle. i am also going to run armidex ed throughout the whole cycle. hopefully this will help me achive my goals and get my times down a little more. anyone ever try a cycle like this before?

 

[Flash_75]

I'm a sprinter too

Bulk.....NOOOOO.......

Have you used fina before. I HATE that shit! bodybuilders swear by the stuff. Yeah, I gained wieght on it, which wasn't my goal, so I was leaner in BF% but lost no actual fat. It didn't do shit for my explosiveness. My strength Went up, but in proportion to my wieght. YOU will not lose wieght on fina. its too strong of an anabolic. Heres the kicker. Disabling pumps. I would get so pumped after 5 sprints that my quads would sieze. I couldn't do shit for about 5 minutes...hardly walk, and even that hurt like a mofo.

Have you got experience with all the drugs you mentioned?

I can help you get your times down, I just need to know your past experiences. What cycles have you done in the past? are you at 8% eating whatever you want. PM me or email me.

 

[shadow13]

College athlete wanting to get bigger and faster. Please help

I understand that there are side effects I just don't wan't to loose my hair or not be able to have kids.I am new to this.I play football. I am 6'0 218, bench 440 and 225 28 times. My 40 is a 4.7-4.8. I truly would like to get faster and stronger.I need something I can run on. Any help I appreciate.

 

[Flash_75]

shadow, how old are you? I wouldn't touch gear untill all your natural potential has been tapped.

 

[shadow13]

Athlete

I am 21. I really need to get faster. But I don't want to hurt myself.