Cycle Advice

[icelandic]

hello all,

I'm finally going to do a cycle starting in late november or early december. I'm 22 5'8" 185 ~11% bf. Been training since I was 16. Spent the first 5 or so years following HIT style routines (one or two sets till failure twice-weekly fullbody routines) and got decently strong (275x1 bench 405x5 deadlift 425x3 squat). In the last couple of months I discovered the wealth of information online regarding training routines and diet. I now follow a modified max-ot stlye routine where a I hit each muscle group once a week but hard. I also try (emphasis on try) to keep my diet where in needs to be for a weightlifter: 3000+ cals, 200+ grams protein per day.

Ok enough of my history, im contemplating using some gear to bulk as I have a pretty tough time gaining wieght now matter how mcuh I eat. In the last few months I've made some nice gains in strength by switching to a more strength focused routine and uping my caloric intake. I've been researching this topic since June and think I have a good idea of what to do and what not to do. I was thinking something along these lines:

weeks 1-4: 20-30mg dbol ed
weeks 1-8(or 10): 500mg cyp or enanthate
also
letrozole 1.25mg eod
saw palemtto complex 320-640 mg ed
silymarin complex ed
clomid and nolvadex post cycle

What is the low down on cyp versus enan? Some say cyp kicks in faster but is it really just personal preference? Also on the topic of gear, I have access to commercial european stuff but its kinda steep. I will not use mexican vet gear but I keep hearing good stuff about spectro and genmed stuff from all those crazy canadians . Is this stuff really that good ? How about availability in the states ? Also what about HCG ? Is it really worth the extra estradiol ?

Thanks alot...

 

[gunslinger11]

bump for this bro. your cycle looks good. i personally like ethanate, but thats just me. ive never used spectro or genmed, however i know a few guys who have and liked it. good luck with your cycle.

 

[buffdawg10]

Hey bro your cycle looks good, personally I like enanthate, but if I were you I would throw in some EQ @ 400-500mgs./week. As far as Mex gear there is nothing wrong with it, first of all you can't beat the price,and QV gear is very good stuff! But if you are dead set against it, yes Spectro is awesome shit, that would be the other way to go. Good Luck with your cycle. Peace!

 

[icelandic]

Yeah i heard good stuff about qv over on anasci too. I'm also kinda leaning on enanthate, any preferences between that and cyp. Im kinda confused about post cycle though, some people seem to think clomid is the end all but i think i would rather throw in some hcg and nolvadex in there too. Is it ok to do say 500iu hcg for 5 days during the middle of the cycle so I dont turn it to a eunich. Thanks for the help though. Also i think im gonna try animalmass's 5x5 squat program with this and eat like a motherfucker to try get i can out of it.

 

[Nelson Montana]

Two things right off the bat:

One: You're too young.

And Two: Your diet sucks. 3000+ calaries and only 200 grams of protein?! Try cutting back the cals by about 500 and adding about 100 grams of protein.

If you think you're too light, check out the pic of Framk Zane elsewhere on this board. He weighs less than you and he's taller. Do you have more muscle than that and need even more?

The advice to add 400-500mgs of EQ on top of 500mgs of test is just idiotic.

Stay away from vet gear.

Saw Palmetto sucks

Clomid sucks

Dude, you probably don't realize how much more you can gain naturally. H.I.T will offer very limited gains. There's so much more you can do. Just my opinion. I'm sure it won't be the most popular one.

 

[icelandic]

Honestly I think i've exhausted what my body can do naturally, I mean I began lifting at 145 when I was 15 and now at 185, with a lot less bodyfat, I can pull and squat close to 500. I know I can do a lot more with my bench (its only 275) but gains aren't easy to come by after 6 years or hitting the weights even with slightly more than 200 grams of protein a day. I know HIT is overated but I quit following that philosophy about a year ago. I now use a max-ot style routine except i use a 6-8 rep scheme instead of a 4-6. I really would like the try the 5x5 routine animalmass posted on musclezine as the idea of three hardcore fullbody workouts a week seems like it would do the trick if i were to go on a cycle.

Why do you feel that saw palmetto sucks, seems many feel it helps a swollen prostate immensely. I know you think clomid sucks ass but what is then in you opinion the most effective post cycle regimen (besides not doing a cycle). Also as far as age is concerned, at age do feel that an athlete should seriously consider the use of these drugs, I know this is very serious business but I do feel fairly ready to take the plunge. Also yeah my diet isn't spectacular, but I'm don't really feel the body (or mine at least) can assimilate and take advantage of more than 200 or grams of protein aday with my normal hormone levels (which are on the low side). If i tried a heavy duty bulking diet now, I'd probably just get fat as
fuck.

Anyway thanks for the response.

 

[Nelson Montana]

There's no way you're maxxed out at age 22. If that's the case, bodybuilding ain't your game, son. Do you expect to grow the way you did when your skeleton was still growing!?! Hell, I was making gains in my 30's naturally.

Saw Palmetto sucks because it supresses DHT. At your age it shouldn' be a problem, but either should prostate hyperthrophy.

Spend your money on some quality food and supps and literature and learn how to become a better bodybuilder. You're a strong kid. Make the most of it. Save the juice for when you really need it.

 

[icelandic]

I'm not really interested in becoming a bodybuilder, I just want to get as strong as I possibly can, not even to compete, just for personally satisfaction. Whatever I decide to do, your right about one thing; I have to get my diet perfect, more protein less fat and less shitty carbs. I'm gonna get a big tub of dextrose next week when I get my protein from supplementdirect. Do you feel that the postworkout drink is very underated, i mean I normally just slam down a protein drink with milk, but I think I should use water with protein and dextrose for faster absorbtion. I dont really beleive in supplelments but I do feel a difference from just 5 grams of creatine a day. Do you think r-ALA is waste of money, it seems like it could be a less risky method of getting a good simulated insulin spike with a post workout drink. Also what do you feel is the most effective training philosophy. I know thats a tough (maybe impossible) question, buy you seem to have no shortage in personal opinion in this game

again though, thanks alot man