Cutter immediately following a Bulker...

[viczeva]

1)drop the var for 'bulkin'
2)bulking/cutting is more about diet anyways
2)run hcg the whole way through at 500iu E3D and dont stop half way for that pct
3)run test at x level and eq at x level the whole way through!

why drop the var? it wont produce significant gains? but strenght will go up right? thanx
vic

 

[SLICED]

You guys really seem to know your shit and it seems logical to change this cycle so after receiving everyone's constructive feedback,

I've decided to completely alter my original plan and create one long 22 week cycle with pct starting in week 23:

Var 40 mg weeks 1 - 8
Test E 500mg weeks 1 - 20
Eq 400mg weeks 1 - 16 *** (or should i keep it at 12?) I know people say to run it long as possible, but I've never used EQ and worried about some of the anxiety sides some receive, hence the only 400 mg dosage.
Winny 50mg weeks 17 - 22
Clen/ECA rotation 13 - 20
pct starting in week 23 till week 27
Proviron weeks 13 - 20

.5 mg ED adex during bulker,(initial 12 weeks)
1mg ED adex during cutting phase (weeks 13 - through pct)

Cal intake for the 1st 12 weeks would be at 4000 cals per day
macro ratio 40p/40c/20 fat

then changed to roughly 2000 cals per day for weeks 13 - 20
macro ratio 60p/30c/10 fat

I'm still confused how to incorporate HCG in this new plan?

There seems to be so many different idealogies behind HCG and its proper usage in a cycle.

a couple options:

1) Start HCG in week 6 and continue until PCT at 500 ius per week. Stop HCG at PCT time and just use Nolva and Clomid for 4 weeks.

2) Start HCG at 500 ius per week for 3 weeks in PCT ONLY along with nolva.

**** A lot people are against taking HCG longer than 6 weeks , so I'm real confused on what protocol to follow ****

 

[SLICED]

Bro, thats not a good idea at all. Test E won't clear until about week 10.5 (check halflife calculators - 100mg is still suppressive). Then you hop on more gear? Just stay on or actually take a break. Start HCG week 6. Run Arimidex throughout and 500 iu HCG once a week. Run Test E the whole time. Start EQ at the beginning. Change up your orals throughout. Only thing you should change from bulk to cut is diet/clen/eca/t3.

You definitely sold me on this bro. Can you please critique my revised plan?

 

[SLICED]

well assuming you are set on doing them back to back, I think its completely pointless to have a break between and do any PCT because by the time your natural levels are back up you will be taking substances that will make them go back down

rather, keep your Test E in there throughout (wk 9-13) adjust your diet and start your EQ. Also I think it is a mistake to run your EQ longer than the enth, because the EQ has a longer half life which means that blood levels of the test will drop before the EQ which may hinder your PCT. I think you should switch it around.. run the Test 2 weeks past the EQ and begin PCT 2.5 weeks after last Test shot.

Definitely grab some HCG and use it throughout the cycle. This is a very long cycle and you will most likely get raisin nuts from it, so the HCG should help. I'll let someone else discuss dosages and frequencies of the HCG though

How do you feel about my revised plan? I'm choosing to start the EQ in week one and not in week 9, but would it be smarter to start it later while I'm cutting to help peserve more lean mass?

 

[SLICED]

For the bulker, id replace the var with a better bulking drug (drol, dbol, deca).....dont PCT after the bulker, just go to the cutter........

Personally, i think all that juice for a CUTTER is a complete waste. You could make a full cycle with that (test and EQ) and use just the winny to cut with.

AAS dont have the fat burning effects of thermos or stims...they are best to keep the body performing well while in a cal defecit and to hold muscle.
The best cutter i did was drol at 50mg a day.....it was enough to keep the muscle on while dropping a LOT of fat.

Fat loss is 95% diet and cardio, why use 3 AAS when you get what you need out of 1? The other two arent going to do much more for cutting fat so id say save them.

Ofcourse fat loss is primarily diet, but I've read that a person should increase dosages while cutting to peserve muscle mass. I've taken deca and dbol and in the past and I did not like the water retention associated with those even with the use of adex.

 

[ksbst9mm]

No, no, and no. How's that for a speedy response?

lol thats what i was thinking.... well said.

ksbst9mm

 

[bigrand]

Ofcourse fat loss is primarily diet, but I've read that a person should increase dosages while cutting to peserve muscle mass. I've taken deca and dbol and in the past and I did not like the water retention associated with those even with the use of adex.

Bloat isnt a big deal during bulking (adex should take care of it, it was probley the deca as adex has no effect on it). You dont need to up the doses for cutting, all its used for is to preserve, not build....same as cals, you need more to build muscle then to maintain. Id actually bulk for longer, 4000 isnt too high so i doubt you will put on much fat at all. Id start cutting at the addition of winny.

 

[SLICED]

BUMP for a critque on redesigned cycle....

 

[AAP]

Why even bother?

Why not just do a longer Lean Muscle Mass Increase cycle? what is the point of shedding fat to just gain weight again? A 6-9 lb gain in muscle size with no increase of bodyfat would be a much better goal.

 

[SLICED]

Why even bother?

Why not just do a longer Lean Muscle Mass Increase cycle? what is the point of shedding fat to just gain weight again? A 6-9 lb gain in muscle size with no increase of bodyfat would be a much better goal.

Well I hope from the eq, test, and var for 12 weeks I will gain 10 - 15 lbs of mostly muscle maybe a little fat, and then for the rest of the 8 - 10 weeks gradually cut bodyfat without losing those 10 - 15 lbs of hard earned muscle that I gained during the first 12 weeks...