Critique this cycle

[BOOEY]

I had a member help me set up the parameters for this cycle - now I would like the board to critique:

Weeks 1-5: Test E, 750mg/week
Weeks 1-5: 50mg Dbol ED
Weeks 6-10: Test E, 900mg/week
Weeks 11-12: 50mg Dbol ED
Weeks 13-16: PCT *see below

Throughout cycle: A-dex, .5mg ED

* PCT:
Day 1: 300mg Clomid, 40 mg Nolva, 10g Creatine
Days 2-10: 100mg Clomid, 20mg Nolva, 10g Creatine
Days 11-30: 50mg Clomid, 20mg Nolva, 10g Creatine

My last cycle was a test-e only cycle, 500 mg for 10 weeks. Results were below expectations (Diet and Training was on point). I believe I do not respond to low doses - this is the case for all medications, not just roids. So I figure 750mg in conjuction with the Dbol and 900mg of test on its own should suffice. Question: Should I run the test 12 weeks?

The member who helped me said the reason for using Dbol between the last shot of test and start of pct was to keep andro levels high but will clear out by the time pct starts. His words: "No decline time of exogeneous test before jumping the natural test is the idea. Additional gains are a bonus but its not the main goal." I thought this was rather clever, but maybe I'm overlooking something - Thoughts?

This will be my first time using Clomid, I've used Nolva before with fine results, but being this is a rather large cycle in terms of amounts, I figure two is better than one.

Ok, thoughts? K to all, thanks!

 

[black sheep]

Personally I would back down the test to 500-600 and throw in Deca at 400mg/week. Your AAS dosage will still be up there where you want it. Personally I think if you were disappointed with a test only cycle at 500mg/week you should consider this route.

The old Test/Deca/D-Bol cycle is hard to beat for a mass cycle..... Well, unless you consider Prop/Npp/D-Bol which is a nice cycle too...

Do some research on the PCT forum. You should use a combination of Nolva and Clomid at least. I run a Nolva, Clomid, HCG PCT. It may cost alittle more, but hey, nothing but the best for my boys.

 

[BOOEY]

Thanks for the advice. I want to stay away from Deca for now. Sticking to Test and Dbol until I feel otherwise.

 

[black sheep]

Not trying to talk you out, but may I ask Why? How much test do you plan to run next time, 1200mg, then 1500mg and so on.

All I am saying is if you did not like results from test only, try something else, until you find what works best for you. Test and D-Bol might give you everything you want, but I hate seeing the test dosages going up over 750 for the average mortal.

 

[Apexx]

Gotta agree with black sheep. Unless you've been doing this a LONG time, I don't see the need in doing almost a gram per week of test. Maybe you just don't respond well to test. Give something else a try. Why not drop the test dose considerably and add something else. If not deca, what about EQ?

 

[Mythicalbeing]

Why so much nolva? You prone to gyno? Or is just the high test your throwing into the mix and playing safe?

 

[Willyumyum]

hmmm, with that much test i'd up the arimidex to 1mg a day... or i'd add nolva throughout... In my cycles I've found that taking nolva throughout helped me retain less water, but didn't hinder my gains - that's just personal experience, though.

Personally I'd also keep the test even thoughout, and drop the second dbol run - your liver is going to hate you. That's just me. I have a good relationship with my liver - haha

But yeah, if you took like 500-750mg of test E a week throughout you'd probably see almost identical results, unless you've found that the 750 has done very little for you, and your a veteran gear user. I'd only raise it if you see your gains top off.

YUM

 

[BOOEY]

Why so much nolva? You prone to gyno? Or is just the high test your throwing into the mix and playing safe?

I'm not sure what you're referring to. I'm taking 20mg of Nolva post cycle (except for the first day which will be at 40mg to jumpstart). The only anti-e I'm taking throughout cycle is a-dex @ .5 mg

 

[BOOEY]

Gotta agree with black sheep. Unless you've been doing this a LONG time, I don't see the need in doing almost a gram per week of test. Maybe you just don't respond well to test. Give something else a try. Why not drop the test dose considerably and add something else. If not deca, what about EQ?

I guess you can say I'm taking a conservative approach to steroid usage. I see so many people on this board using 3 to 4 different compounds and it's only their third or fourth cycle! I've never used Deca so I don't know how I'll react to it. I do know how I react to Test in terms of sides, and luckily they are very minimal. I want to blow up on this cycle and I don't want to run the risk of having to drop a compound due to harmful side effects. When I do decide to give deca a run it will be 1)during a smaller cycle so I can see how I react to it and, b)when test + dbol stop working for me. As far as EQ goes, from what I understand, the benefits of the drug do not surface until after 10 weeks - I think it's recommended for longer cycles, which is why I decided against it. Thanks for the advice though, k to you

 

[DiamondCutCows]

Thanks for the advice. I want to stay away from Deca for now. Sticking to Test and Dbol until I feel otherwise.

I dont see any reason for the huge jump in Test dosing. Nor for the frontload, thats what the DBol will do.

Test at 750 is fine
Dbol the way you have it and your good

 

[BOOEY]

I dont see any reason for the huge jump in Test dosing. Nor for the frontload, thats what the DBol will do.

Test at 750 is fine
Dbol the way you have it and your good

No frontloading, I think you mistakingly saw the 900mg of test which starts after the dbol ends. So when I drop dbol after week 5, should I keep test at the same dosage? I'm not running the risk of andro levels dropping dramatically after that point?

 

[Schutzhund1]

As with others, I feel that the test dosage is excessive.

Is there anychance that the test you did previously was underdosed? Is this test from the same source?

500mg of T/WK with 30mg of Dbol/day is a great cycle for even advanced lifters.

I'm guessing that you are taking the middle of you cycle off of the dbol to help protect your liver? I've never thought of running dbol at the end while the test leaves your system until you start the PCT. I'd love to hear how it works. I've seen other nonaromatizing drugs ran this way but never dbol.

What were your last cycle results that were dissapointing?

 

[BOOEY]

As with others, I feel that the test dosage is excessive.

Is there anychance that the test you did previously was underdosed? Is this test from the same source?

500mg of T/WK with 30mg of Dbol/day is a great cycle for even advanced lifters.

I'm guessing that you are taking the middle of you cycle off of the dbol to help protect your liver? I've never thought of running dbol at the end while the test leaves your system until you start the PCT. I'd love to hear how it works. I've seen other nonaromatizing drugs ran this way but never dbol.

What were your last cycle results that were dissapointing?

Very possible that it was underdosed, I definitely won't rule that out. But I know two other people that were running it with better results than I (of course, this is the net, they could have been full of shit). After PCT, I kept around 13 pounds. But exraodrinary strength increase was almost non-existent. Also, libido barely went up. Again, it could have very well been the test (which is why I'm used a different source this time around). I'm thinking of running with 750, and if I gain well off it, just keep it constant throughout. If I feel room for more, I may bump it to 900.

 

[black sheep]

I guess you can say I'm taking a conservative approach to steroid usage. I see so many people on this board using 3 to 4 different compounds and it's only their third or fourth cycle! I've never used Deca so I don't know how I'll react to it. I do know how I react to Test in terms of sides, and luckily they are very minimal. I want to blow up on this cycle and I don't want to run the risk of having to drop a compound due to harmful side effects. When I do decide to give deca a run it will be 1)during a smaller cycle so I can see how I react to it and, b)when test + dbol stop working for me. As far as EQ goes, from what I understand, the benefits of the drug do not surface until after 10 weeks - I think it's recommended for longer cycles, which is why I decided against it. Thanks for the advice though, k to you

This is not conservatitve. This is Excessive Test Usage.

 

[BOOEY]

Lol, I stand corrected. I meant more towards throwing in more compounds into the mix when I feel they are unnecessary at this point.

 

[idcbp]

I spoke with booey regarding this cycle quite a bit. The thing to remember is that test dosages are a very individual thing. He's been advised of the necessity to limit high test volumes inorder to leave room for future progress, but ultimately he has to decide the route he wants to take. We can give a ton of help regarding ideal stacks and when to start and stop different compounds and pct, but as is always the case, the actual amount one choses to take is a very personal call particularly once a user has experienced the compounds before. I'm still gaining well from 500mg/20-25mg sust/dbol, but if I thought I needed to up it considerably to see gains I felt were worth a cycle, I can't really say what I would do. I figure we give the best advice we can regarding cycles and pct along with suggestions for optimal dosages, but in the end a man's gotta do what a man's gotta...well you get it bros. Good luck booey

schutz, if you want to hear about the dbol end loading sometime, drop me a line. I'm about to end my current cycle in that manner which seems to make good sense.

 

[DiamondCutCows]

No frontloading, I think you mistakingly saw the 900mg of test which starts after the dbol ends. So when I drop dbol after week 5, should I keep test at the same dosage? I'm not running the risk of andro levels dropping dramatically after that point?

Like already said, you have no reason to use 90/wk. Thats A LOT OF TEST!

Why not try keeping test dosage low and add EQ or DECA?

Test 500mg 1-12
Deca 400mg 1-11
Dbol kicker
Nolva/Clomid

Happy Growing!

 

[Mythicalbeing]

I'm not sure what you're referring to. I'm taking 20mg of Nolva post cycle (except for the first day which will be at 40mg to jumpstart). The only anti-e I'm taking throughout cycle is a-dex @ .5 mg

Sorry bro looked like 40mg ED to me...my bad.

 

[black sheep]

Like already said, you have no reason to use 90/wk. Thats A LOT OF TEST!

Why not try keeping test dosage low and add EQ or DECA?

Test 500mg 1-12
Deca 400mg 1-11
Dbol kicker
Nolva/Clomid

Happy Growing!

He is hell bent on following what I feel is bad advise. I would definatly get opinions from other "vets" if you feel the advise you are getting from us is not sound. I think 8 out of 10 would agree with me.

 

[Dial_tone]

There's nothing wrong with the cycle but I don't see the point of raising the test dose near the end.

 

[idcbp]

He is hell bent on following what I feel is bad advise. I would definatly get opinions from other "vets" if you feel the advise you are getting from us is not sound. I think 8 out of 10 would agree with me.

Black sheep, not a flame but you're missing the point bro. I went over this cycle with booey long before he posted it and he isn't following anyones advice as to those test/gear volumes. In fact, I, like any one else would, advised booey to really take a look at the amount of gear he would be using and the goals he wanted to achieve. Noone has made light of that much gear. The thing you have to realize is that the cycle itself is solid, there not a thing about it that constitutes bad advice. The volume is a personal call, not based on misinformation, but on his perceived past experience with test and his own risk/reward equation. There's no question its alot of gear for a relatively new juicer, but its been said and if HE is hell bent on such a cycle, the stack itself is solid. Advice is just that advice, and just b/c he gets that advice, from you or me, and still wants to go heavier, it doesn't mean the advice isn't sound. What to stack, when to use it and how to come off all involve solid planning and "vets" provide invaluable experience and help but once we give that help how much or how little a bro decides to use is a purely individual decision. You give solid advice and wish them the best, to each his own in goals and risks incurred.

 

[BOOEY]

He is hell bent on following what I feel is bad advise. I would definatly get opinions from other "vets" if you feel the advise you are getting from us is not sound. I think 8 out of 10 would agree with me.

I see most are bothered by the 900 amount. But let's say hypothetically I go with a Test+Deca combo. 500mg + 400mg is stil 900mg of androgens in my system. Like I mentioned before, I won't touch Deca until I get the most out of Test cycles. The reason being I get minimal sides from test (few pimples on the back and that's it). I don't want to run the risk of getting gyno, or my hair falling out, etc by adding another compound ... yet. Maybe down the road, but not right now - I'm no rush to experiment with other compounds.

Taking the advice of most, I think I'll go with 750mg of test throughout. Hopefully I won't need the extra 150mg during the second half of the cycle - but I'll leave that as an option. Thanks for the help bros, and more comments are welcomed.