Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below frankenfurter
New member
Can you post where you read this and where the actual studies are that we can read? I'd be interested to see the raw information.
Caffeine The Drug Of Death For Dieting And Othewise
- Thread starter OMEGA
- Start date
Dai Kaioushin
New member
OMEGA said:
learning new techniques
how about you?
Then you should be busy now just like me. I'm here on Kaioushin Kai with your son, Gohan. I hope he'll be able to pull out that fuckin' sword...
By the way I must force myself to reduce my daily coffee intake which I wasn't able to do for ages. Now there is a reason to do it... Good, inspirating post!
killa in manila
New member
are fat burners ok?NYC,MD6....
1) "Caffeine intake (in all of its forms) decreases whole body glucose disposal (carbohydrate uptake) by 15-30%."
This statement should be qualified with "in adult males" since caffeine has no effect on glucose disposal in females (Metabolism 2000 Jan;49(1):101-7; Influence of age on the thermic response to caffeine in women.)
2) "Caffeine intake decreases skeletal muscle glucose disposal by 50%"
This statement should be qualified by "in sedentary couch potatoes" since this is clearly not the case during exercise (J Physiol 2000 Dec 15;529 Pt 3:837-47; Caffeine ingestion does not alter carbohydrate or fat metabolism in human skeletal muscle during exercise).
"So the final word on coffee and caffeine is this - stay the heck away from it! The only way to minimize the damage it causes may be to drink your coffee with a very low carbohydrate meal and eat only low carb meals for the next few hours after your coffee intake. I know, I know, it now sucks to be a coffee drinker! But giving up your java may bring you some great health and physique benefits"………..
This is a bizarre conclusion to come to for a website that promotes itself as being into fitness. There is a plethora of research that shows that caffeine and even more so caffeine plus ephedrine leads to an increase in energy expenditure, better exercise tolerance (via glucose sparing effects) and an increase in lipolysis that leads to a significant fat loss. As one paper summarized
"Twenty-four-hour energy expenditure was higher in both groups during drug treatment. Ephedrine+Caffeine did not produce systematic changes in glucoregulatory variables, whereas plasma leptin concentrations decreased in both groups with drug treatment. Overall, these results show that E+C treatment can promote fat loss through an increase in energy expenditure, or in some individuals, a combination of an increase in energy expenditure and a decrease in food intake."
"The thermic effect of caffeinated and decaffeinated coffee ingested with a standard breakfast was studied in 8 healthy subjects with indirect calorimetry. A higher increase in the metabolic rate was observed after ingestion of the breakfast with coffee containing caffeine than after that with coffee deprived of caffeine."
Although I agree that excess caffeine consumption in combo with a meal high in carbs may not be a good idea if you're obese or already insulin resistant, I firmly believe that some java first thing in the morning (before cardio or weights) or before any exercise is a good thing. And ECA clearly helps people lose fat no matter when it's taken.
It should be common knowledge on this board that if you're using thermogenic combos such as E+C (or yohimbine) that they work best if you avoid insulogenic meals until well after you take the supps. They will work either way in terms of your long term goals, but having your coffee (or E+C) with a donut is kinda like two steps forward and one step back instead of just 2 steps forward. This is true for the donut even without the coffee though. But coffee before exercise or on an empty stomach is nothing to worry about and will in fact get you burning fat faster than without the stimulants. BTW, almost ANY drug that enhances lipolysis will, by definition, decrease insulin sensitivity and glucose disposal. This is obvious if you stop to think about the biochemistry of fat-burning.......yet even fat couch potatoes manage to lose some fat taking EC stacks.
This statement should be qualified with "in adult males" since caffeine has no effect on glucose disposal in females (Metabolism 2000 Jan;49(1):101-7; Influence of age on the thermic response to caffeine in women.)
2) "Caffeine intake decreases skeletal muscle glucose disposal by 50%"
This statement should be qualified by "in sedentary couch potatoes" since this is clearly not the case during exercise (J Physiol 2000 Dec 15;529 Pt 3:837-47; Caffeine ingestion does not alter carbohydrate or fat metabolism in human skeletal muscle during exercise).
"So the final word on coffee and caffeine is this - stay the heck away from it! The only way to minimize the damage it causes may be to drink your coffee with a very low carbohydrate meal and eat only low carb meals for the next few hours after your coffee intake. I know, I know, it now sucks to be a coffee drinker! But giving up your java may bring you some great health and physique benefits"………..
This is a bizarre conclusion to come to for a website that promotes itself as being into fitness. There is a plethora of research that shows that caffeine and even more so caffeine plus ephedrine leads to an increase in energy expenditure, better exercise tolerance (via glucose sparing effects) and an increase in lipolysis that leads to a significant fat loss. As one paper summarized
"Twenty-four-hour energy expenditure was higher in both groups during drug treatment. Ephedrine+Caffeine did not produce systematic changes in glucoregulatory variables, whereas plasma leptin concentrations decreased in both groups with drug treatment. Overall, these results show that E+C treatment can promote fat loss through an increase in energy expenditure, or in some individuals, a combination of an increase in energy expenditure and a decrease in food intake."
"The thermic effect of caffeinated and decaffeinated coffee ingested with a standard breakfast was studied in 8 healthy subjects with indirect calorimetry. A higher increase in the metabolic rate was observed after ingestion of the breakfast with coffee containing caffeine than after that with coffee deprived of caffeine."
Although I agree that excess caffeine consumption in combo with a meal high in carbs may not be a good idea if you're obese or already insulin resistant, I firmly believe that some java first thing in the morning (before cardio or weights) or before any exercise is a good thing. And ECA clearly helps people lose fat no matter when it's taken.
It should be common knowledge on this board that if you're using thermogenic combos such as E+C (or yohimbine) that they work best if you avoid insulogenic meals until well after you take the supps. They will work either way in terms of your long term goals, but having your coffee (or E+C) with a donut is kinda like two steps forward and one step back instead of just 2 steps forward. This is true for the donut even without the coffee though. But coffee before exercise or on an empty stomach is nothing to worry about and will in fact get you burning fat faster than without the stimulants. BTW, almost ANY drug that enhances lipolysis will, by definition, decrease insulin sensitivity and glucose disposal. This is obvious if you stop to think about the biochemistry of fat-burning.......yet even fat couch potatoes manage to lose some fat taking EC stacks.
I agree w/ ms. This is just too much for me.. i've followed diets where coffee was my ECA so to speak. And I can tell you that compared to identical diets w/o coffee, I did lose more on the coffee diet. I also would have to say that if you are right omega, that the positive effects coffee has on fat loss outweigh the possible negative ones it has on insulin sensitivity.
HappyFunBall
New member
caffeine
What if you're bulking? The insulin sensitivity directly affects muscle growth does it not? The positive effects, like fat loss, don't really mean much when your stuffing yourself with 3500 calories a day! But the negative effects on muscle growth..thats scary.
What if you're bulking? The insulin sensitivity directly affects muscle growth does it not? The positive effects, like fat loss, don't really mean much when your stuffing yourself with 3500 calories a day! But the negative effects on muscle growth..thats scary.
